Fixing heavy radiator over insulation...

delmonta

Hi, I've just had my living room internally insulated, overall it's added 93mm to the wall. I need to attach my 1800mm tall column radiator which weighs a lot!

I've attached a photo of the fixings that came with it, but they aren't long enough now. 
They've put some batten where the fixing needs to go, but I really need something that goes through the insulation, through the batten, and into the brickwork. 

What should I use? Would masony screws be enough, what length would be right, considering Theresa nearly 100mm of insulation before hitting the brickwork? I can't really get any Rawl plugs in now it's covered up.

Any other advice on how to make sure th3 rad won't fall off and create a huge mess!

Thanks

FreeBear

Use chemset or resin anchors - M6 150mm long, and they will never come out.

delmonta

FreeBear said:

Use chemset or resin anchors - M6 150mm long, and they will never come out.

FreeBear said:

Use chemset or resin anchors - M6 150mm long, and they will never come out.

OK thanks, I just ordered some resin from screw fix, and some threaded rod which I'll cut down to size. I 've never used it before but it looks simple enough

Jeepers_Creepers

The other good thing about using resin is that you'll be able to get the brackets dead level before the resin sets. With column rads, the brackets have to be dead level or else they won't sit vertically, or not all 4 brackets will be sharing the weight. You'll have some room for adjustment in each bracket - an elongated hole - but it's always good to have a starting point of the bracket being in the middle of that adjustment!

Take some time to get the bracket positions spot on, and draw around them to be able to set them exactly there again. Mark through the mounting holes, drill for your rods, extract/blow out all dust, do a dry run, and then fix using resin - reposition the brackets using your lines, and tweak the rods until they are central. Allow to set.

delmonta

Jeepers_Creepers said:

The other good thing about using resin is that you'll be able to get the brackets dead level before the resin sets. With column rads, the brackets have to be dead level or else they won't sit vertically, or not all 4 brackets will be sharing the weight. You'll have some room for adjustment in each bracket - an elongated hole - but it's always good to have a starting point of the bracket being in the middle of that adjustment!

Take some time to get the bracket positions spot on, and draw around them to be able to set them exactly there again. Mark through the mounting holes, drill for your rods, extract/blow out all dust, do a dry run, and then fix using resin - reposition the brackets using your lines, and tweak the rods until they are central. Allow to set.

Thanks for the detailed explanation, I'm a little nervous as its such a heavy radiator. So the brackets have an m6 size hole and then an m8 size elongated hole. It comes with 8 screws and plugs. Are you meant to use both holes on each bracket, so a total of 8 fixings? Or just one? I don't see how having the elongated hole helps if you use the normal hole too, as you couldn't move it anyway! I want to get the sturdiest fix possible. 

Secondly, I have 90mm to get through before I even hit the wall. It's the plasterboard, and then the insulation (firm insulation). Will this be ok? Its not going to crush the board or insulation I dont think, the brackets are big enough to spread the pressure a bit. And I can cut the threaded rod to go as far into the brickwork as necessary, so I'm hoping thats all ok?

rob7475

Just one fixing through each bracket will be fine. The radiator is heavy but all the pressure will be downwards rather than pulling out from the wall. Think of a kitchen cupboard - they are usually held to the wall with four 2 or 3" screws going into brown plugs. We fill cupboards with tins and heavy crockery etc but they don't fall down.
You just need to be careful you don't overtighten the bolts and pull through the plasterboard

delmonta

rob7475 said:

Just one fixing through each bracket will be fine. The radiator is heavy but all the pressure will be downwards rather than pulling out from the wall. Think of a kitchen cupboard - they are usually held to the wall with four 2 or 3" screws going into brown plugs. We fill cupboards with tins and heavy crockery etc but they don't fall down.
You just need to be careful you don't overtighten the bolts and pull through the plasterboard

Ok thanks, so why do they give you 8 screws and plugs, and have the normal hole and elongated hole in the bracket?

Should I be using only the elongated hole? Or is it different fro the bottom and top brackets

FreeBear

It is usual to use two fixings per bracket. The elongated holes are to allow for small adjustments if the fixing holes are a little out of place.

If you are concerned about spreading the load to stop the PB & insulation being crushed, put a piece of plywood between the bracket & wall.

delmonta

FreeBear said:

It is usual to use two fixings per bracket. The elongated holes are to allow for small adjustments if the fixing holes are a little out of place.

If you are concerned about spreading the load to stop the PB & insulation being crushed, put a piece of plywood between the bracket & wall.

Ah ok you are both saying different things. But surely the elongated holes don't let you adjust anything unless you don't fix the other hole. Or maybe you are meant to do the second hole after to secure it in place. 

delmonta

Maybe I'll use the resin and threaded bolt for the elongated holes, and then use a long masonry screw for the other hole in each bracket. That would make things easier to adjust and get right

FreeBear

delmonta said: Ah ok you are both saying different things. But surely the elongated holes don't let you adjust anything unless you don't fix the other hole. Or maybe you are meant to do the second hole after to secure it in place. 

Drill the bottom holes first for the elongated holes. Offer up the brackets, get them level and square, then nip up the screw/bolt. Once firmly fixed, use the top round hole as a guide to drill the remaining fixing holes. Remove the bracket, insert the resin & fixings. Reattach the bracket and nip up the fixings lightly, and after checking all is level and square, leave for 24 hours for the resin to harden fully.

After tightening the fixings the next day, the radiator can be rehung and plumbed in.