B&B

Kaz1000

saajan_12 said:

Kaz1000 said:

PollyWollyDoodle said:

It’s really not his ego. He has a duty to represent you and also a duty to represent the lender. It’s normal to confirm that a residential property has got residential planning permission. This doesn’t, it’s all very well the council saying ‘it shouldn’t be a problem’ but that isn’t the same as having a change of use. How would you feel if you’d moved in and then you’ve got a visit from the enforcement officer saying that you are not using the property for the agreed purpose? The solicitor is simply doing his job, and fulfilling his duty (remember he acts for the lender as well as for you) by giving them a clear report. In the same way that he quite correctly advised you, when you first looked at the property, that you might have difficulty with the mortgage.  Perhaps you’d rather have a solicitor who ignores these requirements and just says “don’t worry, it will be fine”?

The planning enforcement officer sent us the below email:

  "With regard to any obstacles which would prevent you from completing the purchase of the above property, I can only comment from a planning perspective and as far as I am aware there are none – your solicitor will be looking into any other matters and advising you accordingly.

·         Can the official change of use application be submitted after the house move?  Yes, an application can be submitted once you move into the property, the application can be completed online via the planning portal: https://www.planningportal.co.uk/

·         Is the application likely to be approved?  Whilst there is no guarantee for the outcome of any application, as they cannot be pre-determined, I would comment that, as the property was previously residential, there is no policy constraints which would mean that to revert back to residential would be unacceptable. "

Wouldn't this suffice for confirmation? We basically did most of the work for the solicitor and basically paying him to provide negative opinions and delaying any progress. We got referred to this solicitor by our EA. Regretting it now. 

The email literally says IF you apply for retrospective change in planning, then it Probably would be approved. Its not a guarantee that (a) it will be approved and (b) until the approval, the council won't take enforcement action.  I might decide that % chance is worth the risk, but the lender doesn't have to agree. 

You're paying the solicitor to act for the vendor, which entails the opinions that you call negative. The alternative is 
a) the lender has their own solicitor, which they'll only do if  you pay for it, to double up on work your solicitor has done -> so extra costs plus the 2nd solicitor is still providing the negative opinions. 
b) your solicitor acts for both but fails in their duty to make the lender aware of any pertinent facts. With only positive opinions, you could exchange, then the lender finds out about the current planning status, withdraws the mortgage offer, and you can't complete -> Your seller sues you for everything. 

Thanks for your response. But can you read my initial posts please. We made the lender aware on numerous occasions and they (lender) said it all comes down to the physical survey. This happened week before last and based on that survey, the mortgage was approved.
And obviously the council's planning enforcement office can't give you a gurantee on an email as they charge for the change in use application process. 
If you worked with my solicitor then you will understand the problem we are facing. We had sold 2 properties in the last 5 years and worked with 2 other solicitors and had no problem at all.
It is not the legal obstacles I'm debating rather the 'old fashioned, white collar senior gentleman know it all' who won't work with a positive attitude. He seems to be the judge and jury on my trial. 

AdrianC

Kaz1000 said:

Thanks for your response. But can you read my initial posts please. We made the lender aware on numerous occasions and they (lender) said it all comes down to the physical survey. This happened week before last and based on that survey, the mortgage was approved.
And obviously the council's planning enforcement office can't give you a gurantee on an email as they charge for the change in use application process. 
If you worked with my solicitor then you will understand the problem we are facing. We had sold 2 properties in the last 5 years and worked with 2 other solicitors and had no problem at all.
It is not the legal obstacles I'm debating rather the 'old fashioned, white collar senior gentleman know it all' who won't work with a positive attitude. He seems to be the judge and jury on my trial. 

Your solicitor is also the lender's solicitor.
He has a duty to make the lender known.
He is fulfilling that duty.

Now, you know and we know that the lender already know... and are happy.

So why would the solicitor telling them (again) make the slightest difference?

Kaz1000

AdrianC said:

Kaz1000 said:

Thanks for your response. But can you read my initial posts please. We made the lender aware on numerous occasions and they (lender) said it all comes down to the physical survey. This happened week before last and based on that survey, the mortgage was approved.
And obviously the council's planning enforcement office can't give you a gurantee on an email as they charge for the change in use application process. 
If you worked with my solicitor then you will understand the problem we are facing. We had sold 2 properties in the last 5 years and worked with 2 other solicitors and had no problem at all.
It is not the legal obstacles I'm debating rather the 'old fashioned, white collar senior gentleman know it all' who won't work with a positive attitude. He seems to be the judge and jury on my trial. 

Your solicitor is also the lender's solicitor.
He has a duty to make the lender known.
He is fulfilling that duty.

Now, you know and we know that the lender already know... and are happy.

So why would the solicitor telling them (again) make the slightest difference?

We just want to progress quicker on this property. We saw it in Jan and it went to a cash buyer. Then it came back in Feb it came back on the market so we put a bid and offer accepted. I'm pregnant and want to start all the neonatal appointments in the new place. We are in Reading and the property is in North Yorkshire. We got the searches as we bought it off the previous buyer.
I don't mind the solicitor telling them any number of times and letting us know the results asap. The fact he hasn't even written up a report since he got the offer and only keeps threatening us about the report while we chase him. If the lender declines the mortgage we do have a plan B, so not really bothered. But we can execute or start plan B once the current route fails.
All I want is for the threats to stop and he gets on with the report and we know the results.

AdrianC

Kaz1000 said:

AdrianC said:

Kaz1000 said:

Thanks for your response. But can you read my initial posts please. We made the lender aware on numerous occasions and they (lender) said it all comes down to the physical survey. This happened week before last and based on that survey, the mortgage was approved.
And obviously the council's planning enforcement office can't give you a gurantee on an email as they charge for the change in use application process. 
If you worked with my solicitor then you will understand the problem we are facing. We had sold 2 properties in the last 5 years and worked with 2 other solicitors and had no problem at all.
It is not the legal obstacles I'm debating rather the 'old fashioned, white collar senior gentleman know it all' who won't work with a positive attitude. He seems to be the judge and jury on my trial. 

Your solicitor is also the lender's solicitor.
He has a duty to make the lender known.
He is fulfilling that duty.

Now, you know and we know that the lender already know... and are happy.

So why would the solicitor telling them (again) make the slightest difference?

We just want to progress quicker on this property.

Getting in a flap over nothing won't speed things up.

We saw it in Jan and it went to a cash buyer. Then it came back in Feb it came back on the market

Why did they pull out?

so we put a bid and offer accepted.

A month and a bit ago...?!? That's all? And you're panicking about timescale?

I'm pregnant and want to start all the neonatal appointments in the new place. We are in Reading and the property is in North Yorkshire.

Getting in a flap over nothing won't help there, either...

We got the searches as we bought it off the previous buyer.

Your lender are happy to accept those?

I don't mind the solicitor telling them any number of times and letting us know the results asap. The fact he hasn't even written up a report since he got the offer and only keeps threatening us about the report while we chase him. If the lender declines the mortgage we do have a plan B, so not really bothered. But we can execute or start plan B once the current route fails.
All I want is for the threats to stop and he gets on with the report and we know the results.

You say "threats", he says "doing his duty to his client"...

But - and I repeat repeatedly - the lender already know...

Kaz1000

AdrianC said:

Kaz1000 said:

AdrianC said:

Kaz1000 said:

Thanks for your response. But can you read my initial posts please. We made the lender aware on numerous occasions and they (lender) said it all comes down to the physical survey. This happened week before last and based on that survey, the mortgage was approved.
And obviously the council's planning enforcement office can't give you a gurantee on an email as they charge for the change in use application process. 
If you worked with my solicitor then you will understand the problem we are facing. We had sold 2 properties in the last 5 years and worked with 2 other solicitors and had no problem at all.
It is not the legal obstacles I'm debating rather the 'old fashioned, white collar senior gentleman know it all' who won't work with a positive attitude. He seems to be the judge and jury on my trial. 

Your solicitor is also the lender's solicitor.
He has a duty to make the lender known.
He is fulfilling that duty.

Now, you know and we know that the lender already know... and are happy.

So why would the solicitor telling them (again) make the slightest difference?

We just want to progress quicker on this property.

Getting in a flap over nothing won't speed things up.

We saw it in Jan and it went to a cash buyer. Then it came back in Feb it came back on the market

Why did they pull out?

so we put a bid and offer accepted.

A month and a bit ago...?!? That's all? And you're panicking about timescale?

I'm pregnant and want to start all the neonatal appointments in the new place. We are in Reading and the property is in North Yorkshire.

Getting in a flap over nothing won't help there, either...

We got the searches as we bought it off the previous buyer.

Your lender are happy to accept those?

I don't mind the solicitor telling them any number of times and letting us know the results asap. The fact he hasn't even written up a report since he got the offer and only keeps threatening us about the report while we chase him. If the lender declines the mortgage we do have a plan B, so not really bothered. But we can execute or start plan B once the current route fails.
All I want is for the threats to stop and he gets on with the report and we know the results.

You say "threats", he says "doing his duty to his client"...

But - and I repeat repeatedly - the lender already know...

Call it our luck as the B&B was in a chain which toppled in Dec. In Jan we saw the property but it went to a cash buyer. We didn't get much details why the buyer pulled out. But call it our fortune to get it.
Sticking to timelines for the below purposes:
1. LISA - meets all the criteria for the house purchase as I am a first time buyer. If this offer gets rejected by the lender based on the report, I will probably withdraw the cash asap as the penalty goes up to 25% from 6 April. All other properties are above £500k in the area so no use of the LISA.
2. Stamp duty holiday, this is a big factor and will help to towards the purchase.

I do need to stress less though in stead of being on edge )

Madmel

Our current house was a B&B when we bought it.  We had zero intention of continuing that business and like the OP, wanted to use it as a family home.  Although it's 14 years ago now, we never got any sort of planning permission; the solicitor went through all the plans since the days when it was a farmhouse and the barn & creamery were converted into holiday lets in the mid-80s.  We weren't buying with a mortgage, which might complicate matters. OP, if the mortgage falls through, try a broker.

Once we moved in, we realised that our 4-bedroom house was valued as Band A for Council Tax with the remainder subject to Business Rates. The previous owners used only one bedroom, en suite, downstairs room and kitchen for their sole use. One quick phonemail sorted that out and nobody has ever asked anything further. So it is possible to be paying Business Rates AND council tax, but it was very straightforward to sort out.

Kaz1000

Madmel said:

Our current house was a B&B when we bought it.  We had zero intention of continuing that business and like the OP, wanted to use it as a family home.  Although it's 14 years ago now, we never got any sort of planning permission; the solicitor went through all the plans since the days when it was a farmhouse and the barn & creamery were converted into holiday lets in the mid-80s.  We weren't buying with a mortgage, which might complicate matters. OP, if the mortgage falls through, try a broker.

Once we moved in, we realised that our 4-bedroom house was valued as Band A for Council Tax with the remainder subject to Business Rates. The previous owners used only one bedroom, en suite, downstairs room and kitchen for their sole use. One quick phonemail sorted that out and nobody has ever asked anything further. So it is possible to be paying Business Rates AND council tax, but it was very straightforward to sort out.

Thank you very much for sharing. Might get a broker like you suggested as plan B. 
Our council confirmed the house is currently a Band F and is charged residential rates. Councils are very helpful like you pointed out.
Your post gives me hope so fingers crossed.