Euro Car Parks Parking Charge Notice at Brockhill Country Park - Hythe

Millaman1974

Hi all, hoping for some advice on 3 PCN I received from ECP in November 2020 for simply picking my daughter up from school. I did not park in the car park I simply turned around, the camera however has my registration coming in and going out.
I'm new so apologies if this has been covered, I have looked through the Newbies thread and have seen some very useful responses around KCC owned land, Notice to Hirer PCN (I Lease my vehicle), even seen some posts directly on this car park as it seems common for these people to be issuing these fines out. I'm passionate about this, I did not park in their car park and these automated cameras you cannot seem to explain how the cark park is laid out or talk to anyone directly. I cannot believe this company get away with this so I would like to fight against my 3 parking charges, any help and advice would be really appreciated thank you. My circumstances are as follows:-

Dates of event - 13/10/2020, 23/10/2020, 9/11/2020 - I did not know or realise there were cameras monitoring the car park, I went into the cark park on one occasion to turn around and come back out, the other two times I would of past the camera and turned around but not fully gone into the car park (theres a very long lane from the start point where the camera is to the actual car park, 200-200m at least down the lane). I'm from the area and have used Brockhill Country Park for years to explore the countryside with my children so I know the area and I have paid for parking at weekends multiple times, on these three occasions I simply picked my daughter up from the school next to the cark park and parked on the side of the lane by the entrance gate with a large number of other cars. At this stage I do not believe anyone knew of these charges as a large number of cars were parked just by the entrance to this lane, now no-one parks there so there must of been multiple cases like this but I cannot find anything in these threads.

Steps I've taken (maybe incorrectly I don't know) - I appealed to ECP saying I did not park in their car park I simply turned around, so I have admitted it was me driving which looks as though it was wrong from other threads, all three have been rejected and I had three letters saying I owed £70 per charge therefore for simply turning around I owe them £210 which I find completely unbelievable. I have written to the school to see if there were other cases similar, also their car parking warden (it gets very busy) told me to go down the lane and turn around and park near the gate (explained above), they asked me to email them the details but unfortunately have come back to me saying they are careful NOT to offer this advice to parents, even though they did. I did kind of ignore ECP after this but have this week received three letters from a company called Debt Recovery Plus asking for three amounts of £140, so they've now doubled the original £70 amounts. I have not as yet written to POPLA, do I now do that and say the Landowner is KCC so do not believe the fine is valid, also they appear to of got my details as Car Hirer directly from the DVLA, are they allowed to do that?

What would be the best next steps to take, any advices would be very much appreciated, I realise I should of tackled this earlier but thought the issue may of gone away until I've now received the three letters from Debt Recovery Plus.

Appreciate any advices,

Best Regards

nosferatu1001

A lot of info, not a lot of detail
How long do they state you were there? How long were you there for?
You say "simply for turning around" but then state you were parked! Both statements cannot be true at the same time

Millaman1974

Hi @nosferatu1001, yes sorry not very clear. On the entrance to a lane leading to the car park theres a camera, you drive 200-300m down this lane to reach the car park where the ticket machines are, I turned around there once and came back out but parked by the entrance gate which probably is still before the camera sees you leaving. All 3 were between 10 and 20 mins, there are now signs up just as you enter the lane saying it is all under pay and display and you can find the signage in the car park for full details. this was not there before, I've attached a couple of photos which show the lane and where it starts including the signs up there now. I took these photos a while after the event, this whole area had cars parked there picking up from school and now has noone due to these signs and I guess the so called fines ECP have handed out.

KeithP

Have you missed your opportunities to appeal to PoPLA?

Millaman1974

@KeithP having just re-read the letter of appeal from ECP they say I had 28 days from the date of the letter to appeal to POPLA so maybe yes, they stated as follows:-
(carefully considered evidence is a joke by the way, there's no way to explain to these people the layout of the car park they apparently own, as seen in the photos above the actual car park is a long way from the gate and entrance) I don't like these ANPR devices, no way to communicate any longer.

Having carefully considered the evidence provided by you we have decided to reject your appeal for
the following reasons:
 The car park is operated by Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR).
 Cameras capture an image of vehicles entering and leaving the car park and calculate their
length of stay on site.
 When purchasing a pay and display ticket, you must enter the correct vehicle registration
number (VRM) and this information is directed to the camera system.
 I can confirm that no pay and display ticket matching your VRM was purchased at the time of
the terms and conditions.
 The signage is clear, a valid pay and display ticket must be purchased for the full duration of
your stay on the car park.
 I can confirm the parking charge notice was issued correctly and remains payable.
Please make payment of the discounted amount of £40.00 by visiting our website at
www.eurocarparks.com or use the automated telephone service 0203 553 4559. Alternatively make
your cheque payable to Euro Car Parks Limited (to include a £2.50 handling charge for cheque
processing) and post to Euro Car Parks Ltd, 30 Dorset Square, London, NW1 6QJ, quoting the PCN
number on the reverse of the cheque.This amount is now due and the charge will be held for 14 days
to allow time to make the payment. If payment is not received by this time the charge will increase to
£70.00 and this may also result in the notice being passed to a third party with further charges
applicable.
You have now reached the end of our internal appeals procedure.
You can make an appeal to the Independent Appeals Service, POPLA (Parking on Private Land
Appeals) using the unique POPLA Reference code provided above. Please note, should you decide
to appeal to POPLA, or if you appeal to POPLA and your appeal is subsequently rejected, the option
to pay a discounted amount will NO longer be available and the FULL AMOUNT of the PCN will
become due.
If you/the driver decides to appeal to POPLA, you will need to visit the website, www.popla.co.uk,
where further details of how to appeal (either online or by downloading the relevant forms) can be
found. If the driver is unable to access the website, please call us for further information on how to
obtain the forms. Please ensure that the POPLA Reference Number as noted above is quoted on all
correspondence to POPLA. The driver has 28 days from the date of this letter to submit an appeal to
POPLA. If the driver appeals to POPLA, we will suspend recovery activity on the PCN.
Appeals may NOT be accepted if payment is made against the Parking Charge Notice, including any
appeals logged via POPLA, if applicable.
If you choose to do nothing, we will seek to recover the monies owed to us via debt recovery
procedures and may proceed with Court action against you.
By law we are also required to inform you that the Ombudsman Services (www.ombudsmanservices.org/) provides an alternative dispute resolution service that would be competent to deal with
your appeal. However, we have not chosen to participate in their alternative dispute resolution
services. As such should you wish to appeal then you must do so to POPLA, as explained above.
Yours sincerely
PCN Coordinator
Parking Charge Notice Department
  

KeithP

Do I really have to read all that to try and work out whether you have missed your opportunity to appeal to PoPLA?

nosferatu1001

You have a total of 33 daysa to bang in an appeal. No arguments. You can easily work out if you are inside that time. 

Millaman1974

You don't need to read all of that no, it was just for info, yes I'm outside of that date so missed the initial appeal with POPLA.

Coupon-mad

So ignore them and come back if you get a court claim, same as every case. No posts about debt demands, or worries about CCJs please...

Millaman1974

Ok I will do thank you, as I say all completely new to me so just after advice so appreciate people taking time out to respond.

nosferatu1001

The newbies thread is your bible for thiss. Read it repeatedly, so that nothing is a surprise