EA pushed us in a bidding war - advice (can I make 2 offers to the seller at the same time?)

moneysavinghero

This property is definitely a seller market property as it is a designer home

Why have you gone in at 5% below asking price then? And why are you considering dropping that to 8% below asking? Do you not really want this house?

GDB2222

getmore4less said:

what message are you trying to send with these multiple offers.o

if it is the most obvious one that somehow a cash buyer is more attractive usually the quick sale no complications storry.

That is not a lot of use if their move is complicated by the usual chain mortgage etc. 
Do you have any idea of the vendors motivations? 

The bigger issue you have with you mind games with the cash or mortgage option is they know you can go a LOT higher than any of your offers.

If they think you are keen can call your bluff.

There can be more than one round of best and final if it is obvious there are game players in the mix.

It is exactly this, really. The op has gone on at length about the offers he can make, but he has not said a word about what is motivating the sellers. If he knew that, he’d know what sort of offer to make.

AdrianC

GDB2222 said:

getmore4less said:

what message are you trying to send with these multiple offers.o

if it is the most obvious one that somehow a cash buyer is more attractive usually the quick sale no complications storry.

That is not a lot of use if their move is complicated by the usual chain mortgage etc. 
Do you have any idea of the vendors motivations? 

The bigger issue you have with you mind games with the cash or mortgage option is they know you can go a LOT higher than any of your offers.

If they think you are keen can call your bluff.

There can be more than one round of best and final if it is obvious there are game players in the mix.

It is exactly this, really. The op has gone on at length about the offers he can make, but he has not said a word about what is motivating the sellers. If he knew that, he’d know what sort of offer to make.

The very fact it's gone to best and final suggests that the vendor is looking more for the best price than for any warm-and-fuzzies about who they want to live in their old house.

As far as "...can go a lot higher...", being able to afford to pay more is different to being willing to pay more. I could afford to spend £10 on a loaf of bread. I'm not going to. There's a mindset that a lot of people - especially in the foothills of the housing ladder - absolutely must spend every single penny they can possibly raise, max LtV and an echo in the piggy bank. It doesn't always work like that - especially where somebody could afford to pay pretty much the entire asking price in cash, or is happy to raise a smallish mortgage. The OP could almost certainly afford to buy a different, much more expensive house if they so desired. That doesn't mean they're going to pay OTT for this one.

TheCheerleader

We are in the process of selling our house and had 4 asking price offers within two days of marketing. We then went to full and final offers, we accepted an offer £20k over asking price, but £7k less than the highest offer, as they hadn’t sold their property. Whereas our buyers were in rented after selling, with cash in the bank and only needed a small mortgage. 

caprikid1

Some view cash buyers as a pain, they have little process they need to follow, don't need to invest till the last moment and can be very likely to gazunder without the complications of revised mortgage offers. 

pp556677

AdrianC said:

GDB2222 said:

getmore4less said:

what message are you trying to send with these multiple offers.o

if it is the most obvious one that somehow a cash buyer is more attractive usually the quick sale no complications storry.

That is not a lot of use if their move is complicated by the usual chain mortgage etc. 
Do you have any idea of the vendors motivations? 

The bigger issue you have with you mind games with the cash or mortgage option is they know you can go a LOT higher than any of your offers.

If they think you are keen can call your bluff.

There can be more than one round of best and final if it is obvious there are game players in the mix.

It is exactly this, really. The op has gone on at length about the offers he can make, but he has not said a word about what is motivating the sellers. If he knew that, he’d know what sort of offer to make.

The very fact it's gone to best and final suggests that the vendor is looking more for the best price than for any warm-and-fuzzies about who they want to live in their old house.

As far as "...can go a lot higher...", being able to afford to pay more is different to being willing to pay more. I could afford to spend £10 on a loaf of bread. I'm not going to. There's a mindset that a lot of people - especially in the foothills of the housing ladder - absolutely must spend every single penny they can possibly raise, max LtV and an echo in the piggy bank. It doesn't always work like that - especially where somebody could afford to pay pretty much the entire asking price in cash, or is happy to raise a smallish mortgage. The OP could almost certainly afford to buy a different, much more expensive house if they so desired. That doesn't mean they're going to pay OTT for this one.

Fair points thank you both  @getmore4less @GDB222 @AdrianC

Indeed, what is driving the seller is £££, although they made it look like all they cared about is a "good buyer" that "woudl understand the house"

Proof is in the pudding. We started the conversation with the EA stating not much interest in the property (have been on since September last year) and "wiggle room" in the asking price. They also stated that they wont accept our offer if we did not make the effort to come and see the property -- just a virtual viewing would not suffice.

Flash forward a week and we have 4 bidders, one that has never seen the property and one that is not even in the country... Enough said...

pp556677

moneysavinghero said:

This property is definitely a seller market property as it is a designer home

Why have you gone in at 5% below asking price then? And why are you considering dropping that to 8% below asking? Do you not really want this house?

Part of me is fairly certain this is a huge set up by the estate agent / seller so in a way I would like to call their bluff and send them a nice !!!!!! you card. But life is not always like that because houses like other possessions come with emotions attached to them...and that means £££

The smart money says stay on my original offer, the bluff caller say go lower, but the FOMO says go over and have no regrets

pp556677

Murphybear said:

I get the impression from your original post that you don’t  care whether or not you get this property.  Apologies if that is not the case.

if this house is as desirable as you say I would be a bit concerned about being gazumped. This happened to us some years ago.  We found a house that we liked and the price was the maximum we could afford.  We made a lower offer which was accepted.  We had just started the process and had a call from the EA saying they had accepted a higher offer.  We didn’t offer to match it.  A few weeks later we had another call from the EA, the buyers had withdrawn and were we still interested at our original offer, they really couldn’t understand why our answer was a resounding “no”.  We found our dream bungalow shortly after.

If I were you I’d look for another property unless this is really your “dream house” in which case I wish you luck. 

Thanks @Murphybear

The house is all we want and even going to my top end it will be lower than similar houses that don't have the location and characteristics of this. So we see value in going over. It is more about coming to terms with the fact that EA/seller are kniving and smell foul

pp556677

AdrianC said:

Just give a single figure. That's how the buyer will view it - they'll ignore all bar the biggest number. And they'll compare that to the other numbers to see which is biggest.

Whether there's a mortgage involved or not - especially at a very low LtV - is only likely to be an issue if the lender will find the place undesirable security and put a £0 valuation on.

Just talked to the lender and they are happy with the higher valuation.
We have reduced LTV and going for the bigger number. Hopefully we get it..

Mutton_Geoff

pp556677 said:

Part of me is fairly certain this is a huge set up by the estate agent / seller

It's not a set up. The agent works entirely for the vendor, not you. The agent is trying to maximise the price for his client. You are just a pawn in that game. Perfectly normal behaviour. See some of the other threads where vendors/agents have accepted even higher bids from others after best foot forward/sealed bids were already agreed.

We do know the agent has sold many more houses that you have and has seen almost every kind of negotiator in the book. I'd suggest getting your own ducks in a row rather than trying to second guess what's going on behind the scenes.