Does this look like asbestos?

Swasterix

Good morning forumers!

We have an old pergola in the back garden which I intend to remove. The previous owner of our house decided to cover it with what looks like 4x corrugated cement roofing sheets (not a good look). They’re roughly 2000mm x 750mm in size. Aware that this can contain asbestos, I’m wondering if it is possible to tell just by looking at it? I have no idea how long it’s been there, but assuming a while looking at the state of it. 

I’ve uploaded some photos below. You can see that there seems to be a coating peeling off, although not sure whether it has been painted maybe in the past. I’m just trying to work out whether this is a job to DIY (am aware of the precautions necessary etc.), or whether to just pay somebody to deal with it. 

Thanks in advance!

Doozergirl

It does, but it's encased in a matrix and so it's the 'better' kind of asbestos product. 

One doesn't need to be licensed to remove it and most councils will take an amount of it away for free if it's double bagged. 

The HSE have produced a guide to removing it safely. 

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/guidance/a14.pdf

Swasterix

Doozergirl said:

It does, but it's encased in a matrix and so it's the 'better' kind of asbestos product. 

One doesn't need to be licensed to remove it and most councils will take an amount of it away for free if it's double bagged. 

The HSE have produced a guide to removing it safely. 

https://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/guidance/a14.pdf

Ok, thanks for the reply DG, helpful as always 😊

I was pretty certain before asking, was just living in hope somebody would say “no you idiot, it’s just......”

The sheets are held in place with nails & rubber washers. Unfortunately there is not enough clearance to get to the nails underneath with my bolt cutters so my plan was to carefully cut the washers out, cut the tops of the nails, remove sheets and wrap them in 1000 gauge sheeting. Sound ok?

Silly question... are the sheets particularly heavy?

Why anybody would put them on top of a pergola is anybody’s guess. But it’s not surprising given some of the old boys other DIY master strokes!

Thanks again!

GDB2222

How old are you? Not an entirely daft question, as it takes around 25 years for any health problems to emerge. 

Obviously, wet it down and wear some ppe.  Will you need to reduce the size down to around 1m long to dispose of it?

You have tried prising the nails out with a mole grip?

Swasterix

GDB2222 said:

How old are you? Not an entirely daft question, as it takes around 25 years for any health problems to emerge. 

Obviously, wet it down and wear some ppe.  Will you need to reduce the size down to around 1m long to dispose of it?

You have tried prising the nails out with a mole grip?

I’m in my mid 30s, and plan to live to at least 100... so will be sure to take the necessary precautions 😂

I haven’t tried prising them out, no. Did consider it, but there is only about 20mm of nail protruding from the top, and nothing to lever off so figures that I stand a better chance of damaging one of the sheets that way. 

Yes- after contacting the council I can’t take them to the tip in sheet form, they will only accept asbestos waste in the asbestos bags, which are nowhere near 2000mm.... I’m guessing it would be a bad idea breaking them up while encased in the sheeting to fit into a bag..?

GDB2222

You can't find someone my age to do this job for you?

I would break them with a hammer, not a saw, obviously. Or prop them at one end and stand on them. I doubt that there's a good way, really. 

Wrapping in plastic might be good, provided you can break the sheet up and bundle the whole lot up and put it inside the approved bags, without unwrapping it. I'm betting it won't all fit, though.

As DG says, it's far from the most dangerous sort of asbestos. I knew a chap who used to work with asbestos powder. They'd get big bags of the stuff and mix it up with water. He's died now, but not from mesothelioma. I expect your risk from a few sheets of cement board is pretty minimal.

Mickey666

Swasterix said:

Yes- after contacting the council I can’t take them to the tip in sheet form, they will only accept asbestos waste in the asbestos bags, which are nowhere near 2000mm.... I’m guessing it would be a bad idea breaking them up while encased in the sheeting to fit into a bag..?

I don't see why, providing they are securely wrapped such that no fibres could be released into the air.  In fact, it's probably a very safe way to break down the sheets into smaller sizes. 

What are the alternatives?  Sawing is an option as long as the sheets, the saw and the cut are kept wet to prevent 'dust', but what happens when thing dry out?  Or perhaps just break them up by hand while standing upwind of a gentle breeze - perfectly safe for you but perhaps not so good for anyone downwind.   Against those options, wrapping first and then breaking into smaller pieces seems quite sensible.

Swasterix

GDB2222 said:

You can't find someone my age to do this job for you?

I would break them with a hammer, not a saw, obviously. Or prop them at one end and stand on them. I doubt that there's a good way, really. 

Wrapping in plastic might be good, provided you can break the sheet up and bundle the whole lot up and put it inside the approved bags, without unwrapping it. I'm betting it won't all fit, though.

As DG says, it's far from the most dangerous sort of asbestos. I knew a chap who used to work with asbestos powder. They'd get big bags of the stuff and mix it up with water. He's died now, but not from mesothelioma. I expect your risk from a few sheets of cement board is pretty minimal.

Mickey666 said:

Swasterix said:

Yes- after contacting the council I can’t take them to the tip in sheet form, they will only accept asbestos waste in the asbestos bags, which are nowhere near 2000mm.... I’m guessing it would be a bad idea breaking them up while encased in the sheeting to fit into a bag..?

I don't see why, providing they are securely wrapped such that no fibres could be released into the air.  In fact, it's probably a very safe way to break down the sheets into smaller sizes. 

What are the alternatives?  Sawing is an option as long as the sheets, the saw and the cut are kept wet to prevent 'dust', but what happens when thing dry out?  Or perhaps just break them up by hand while standing upwind of a gentle breeze - perfectly safe for you but perhaps not so good for anyone downwind.   Against those options, wrapping first and then breaking into smaller pieces seems quite sensible.

Haha, I could ask my 70 odd year old dad to take one for the team, but I’m not sure whether he’ll be willing!

Seriously though, I’m not too concerned about doing it myself and am happy to take the necessary precautions. 

Thanks again for the input, I think I’ll go with my original idea of wrapping well and breaking up. If it doesn’t work, I can always pay somebody to come take it away. 

Cheers. 

Swasterix

KeithSussex said:

Breaking them up even inside sheeting could create a significant amount of dust, then its notifiable work. 

Seen securing bolts,screws snapped off using a 450mm long (sharp !) cold chisel. one good blow from a lump hammer will cut through them and not damage the sheet.
Bags are for small items, Wrap it with clear 500+ gauge polythene sheeting use gaffer tape to seal it. You have probably had a read of the Hse document A14

Is the work close to your neighbours property ?  

Thanks for the input Keith. I wasn’t aware of that, so may have to re-think the disposal method. Council have informed me that they will not accept any asbestos waste that is not contained in one of their bags, so may have to pay for somebody to take it away. 

Yes- I’ve read the HSE guidance sheet. 

Cheers

Ganga

As others have said it is the dust ( if it is asbestos ) that can cause the worst health hazards ,so keep wet which ever method you use ,i would spray with a garden hose and snap in half by standing on it over a wooden beam and then bag and snap again till it fits in the council approved bags.

Mickey666

KeithSussex said:

Breaking them up even inside sheeting could create a significant amount of dust, then its notifiable work.

Do you have any references regarding what would constitute 'significant' dust and therefore make the work notifiable?

Besides, how could anyone ever know?  If this was really an issue I doubt that asbestos cement sheets would be exempted from all the regulations for other asbestos products.  Keep the stuff wet and there'll be minimal dust when breaking it up and what there is won't become airborne if already enclosed in tough plastic sheeting.

Just need a few sensible precautions rather than hysteria over the "A" word.