Rent charge and lenders criteria

Rubygracesza

Hello hive mind, I wonder if you can help...

 We are trying to purchase a property in what we thought was the last stages of purchase, when our solicitors told us about a historic rent charge listed on the property. Initially, they thought it was not an issue and could be covered with indemnity insurance. But our lenders, Barclays, are not happy and will only move forward if the rent charge is removed/revoked. I have now researched these rent charges and understand the difficulties they can cause if greedy owners decide to make use archaic laws to cause trouble and edit the deeds to the property. We would opt to buy the rent charge, but the problem is, our property was not listed on the land registry as the owners have lived there for a very long time. The owners know nothing of the rent charge and have never paid it. The rent charge was granted in 1937 and the owner is quite likely, dead. How do we find out who owns the rent charge? I am going to go knock on the neighbours doors tonight to see if anyone knows anything, but I wondered if there is some magic registry somewhere I could access? And if I do find out who owns it, how do I go about purchasing it and how long would this take? 
We thought we were at the end of the buying process and have given notice on our rented house, so now we are in full panic mode. As first time buyers, it feels like this process has had horrible surprises right to the bitter end. 
Any advice greatly appreciated! 

dimbo61

I understand that rentcharges run out in 2037.
We had one on out Victorian terrace house and managed to buy out the rentcharge and pay the outstanding balance ( 17 years) by one payment of £85 
I think it was about £3 a year and we had owned the house for over 5 years before we were contacted by NEW owners of the rentcharge.
However we were supplied with past rentcharge invoices from the previous owner but the estate agents who had been collecting the Rent due had closed down.

princeofpounds

In a way, this is not your problem to solve. The vendors are the ones that need to deal with the rentcharge. Do not go knocking on doors on their behalf. It may sabotage their ability to benefit from indemnity insurance if you alert the wrong person.

The rentcharge will probably need to be redeemed if lenders will not accept indemnity insurance. The linke below explains the process, assuming it is a type that is eligible (sounds like it may well). The government page is not clear but I think there are procedures for when the rentcharge owner cannot be identified - I'm sure I've seen guidance on that before but couldn't find it on the page. They have a helpline that should be able to answer you in short order anyway.

But again, this is for the vendors to sort out. They will find it very hard to sell the property unless they do, although some lenders may accept indemnity policies less and less do now.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/rentcharges

"If you have any questions about the process to apportion or redeem your rentcharge, email the MHCLG rentcharges team at rentcharges@communities.gov.uk or call 0303 444 8095 or 0303 444 4560 or 0303 444 0216 (9am - 5pm Monday to Friday)."

Rubygracesza

Thank you for all your responses. 
I have now found who owns the rent charge by asking the neighbours (against your advice I know but it was a quick solution and I am up against the clock.) The company is Shenstone Properties Limited and they seem to be as crooked as they come. No website, no email address and no phone number. You can only contact them by letter and you can only pay by cheque! If the cheque is late, they impose huge fines. Since the owner have died and their son (the executor) dealing with the estate knew nothing about the rent charge, I can only imagine the fines they will be imposing after not receiving their £4.20 for the last 12 months. I am waiting by snail mail to find out how much they will charge to buy the rent charge. No one seems to be able to tell me who should pay for the rent charge. If like others it is only around £80 then I don't care, but some are saying these companies impose ridiculous charges of £1500 - £2500. In this instance, who pays?
I can't understand how companies like this are still allowed to operate! 
Many thanks, 
Ruby 

wilfred30

Rubygracesza said:

Thank you for all your responses. 
I have now found who owns the rent charge by asking the neighbours (against your advice I know but it was a quick solution and I am up against the clock.) The company is Shenstone Properties Limited and they seem to be as crooked as they come. No website, no email address and no phone number. You can only contact them by letter and you can only pay by cheque! If the cheque is late, they impose huge fines. Since the owner have died and their son (the executor) dealing with the estate knew nothing about the rent charge, I can only imagine the fines they will be imposing after not receiving their £4.20 for the last 12 months. I am waiting by snail mail to find out how much they will charge to buy the rent charge. No one seems to be able to tell me who should pay for the rent charge. If like others it is only around £80 then I don't care, but some are saying these companies impose ridiculous charges of £1500 - £2500. In this instance, who pays?
I can't understand how companies like this are still allowed to operate! 
Many thanks, 
Ruby 

Oh dear!  Have you ever heard of the word 'libel'?

Rubygracesza

I'm not sure what libellous about it. Complaining online about a company that operates in an obstructive manner is hardly a suable offence. If you read this companies reviews on Google, you will find far stronger language than I have used in my post... 

princeofpounds

Rubygracesza said:

No one seems to be able to tell me who should pay for the rent charge. If like others it is only around £80 then I don't care, but some are saying these companies impose ridiculous charges of £1500 - £2500. In this instance, who pays?

As I said before, this is for the vendor to sort out. If they try to sell the property to anyone else who needs a mortgage, they will run into the same problem. 

You should really read the link I provided to you - it details how rent charges are redeemed and the approximate costs. Obviously the rentcharge owner and anyone can negotiate to buy the rent charge in another way, but except perhaps for an advantage in speed assuming it is all handled smoothly, that would be largely pointless.

It will cost about 70 quid if redeeming the official way, but the rentcharge owner can ask anything they like to sell it.

AdrianC

Rubygracesza said:

The company is Shenstone Properties Limited and they seem to be as crooked as they come. No website, no email address and no phone number.

It took about three seconds to find 01543 250458 - but there is no legal requirement for any company to have website, public email, or public phone numbers.

You can only contact them by letter and you can only pay by cheque!

Is that a problem?

If the cheque is late, they impose huge fines.

They cannot impose "fines".
They can only impose late payment fees in line with whatever's specified in the covenant or lease, or in line with what's allowed by legislation. Interest at 8% above base rate, for commercial debts.

Rubygracesza said:

I'm not sure what libellous about it. Complaining online about a company that operates in an obstructive manner is hardly a suable offence.

Alleging in writing that their business model is deliberately illegal certainly can be libellous, yes.
It's pretty much the dictionary definition, tbh.
The main defence is that you can prove it to be true. But defending a libel case is usually a pyrrhic victory at best, due to legal costs.

Rubygracesza

princeofpounds said:

Rubygracesza said:

No one seems to be able to tell me who should pay for the rent charge. If like others it is only around £80 then I don't care, but some are saying these companies impose ridiculous charges of £1500 - £2500. In this instance, who pays?

As I said before, this is for the vendor to sort out. If they try to sell the property to anyone else who needs a mortgage, they will run into the same problem. 

You should really read the link I provided to you - it details how rent charges are redeemed and the approximate costs. Obviously the rentcharge owner and anyone can negotiate to buy the rent charge in another way, but except perhaps for an advantage in speed assuming it is all handled smoothly, that would be largely pointless.

It will cost about 70 quid if redeeming the official way, but the rentcharge owner can ask anything they like to sell it.

Of course I have read the Government website on rent charges. Thanks for posting but my original question was how to find out who owns the rent charge. You cannot apply to redeem the rent charge unless you know who owns it. I now know who owns it by asking neighbours, but as I said above, the company are incredibly old fashioned and do not have any method of contact except by post which is very unusual in this day and age, and disruptively slow when trying to buy a house. I have also read that they charge £75 per letter they send out, and that they take months to respond to solicitors letters. Many have complained that they never responded and they eventually had to give up on their house purchase. 
Again, it seems outrageous that companies like this are allowed to exist. 

Rubygracesza

AdrianC said:

Rubygracesza said:

The company is Shenstone Properties Limited and they seem to be as crooked as they come. No website, no email address and no phone number.

It took about three seconds to find 01543 250458 - but there is no legal requirement for any company to have website, public email, or public phone numbers.

You can only contact them by letter and you can only pay by cheque!

Is that a problem?

If the cheque is late, they impose huge fines.

They cannot impose "fines".
They can only impose late payment fees in line with whatever's specified in the covenant or lease, or in line with what's allowed by legislation. Interest at 8% above base rate, for commercial debts.

Rubygracesza said:

I'm not sure what libellous about it. Complaining online about a company that operates in an obstructive manner is hardly a suable offence.

Alleging in writing that their business model is deliberately illegal certainly can be libellous, yes.
It's pretty much the dictionary definition, tbh.
The main defence is that you can prove it to be true. But defending a libel case is usually a pyrrhic victory at best, due to legal costs.

What on earth are you talking about? I haven't claimed they are acting illegally. I have said they are duplicitous, old fashioned and deliberately obstructive. 
If you don't have advice to lend on the matter, I suggest you spend your time doing something more useful. Maybe take up gardening? You seem in need of a hobby.

davidmcn

Rubygracesza said:

AdrianC said:

Rubygracesza said:

The company is Shenstone Properties Limited and they seem to be as crooked as they come. No website, no email address and no phone number.

It took about three seconds to find 01543 250458 - but there is no legal requirement for any company to have website, public email, or public phone numbers.

You can only contact them by letter and you can only pay by cheque!

Is that a problem?

If the cheque is late, they impose huge fines.

They cannot impose "fines".
They can only impose late payment fees in line with whatever's specified in the covenant or lease, or in line with what's allowed by legislation. Interest at 8% above base rate, for commercial debts.

Rubygracesza said:

I'm not sure what libellous about it. Complaining online about a company that operates in an obstructive manner is hardly a suable offence.

Alleging in writing that their business model is deliberately illegal certainly can be libellous, yes.
It's pretty much the dictionary definition, tbh.
The main defence is that you can prove it to be true. But defending a libel case is usually a pyrrhic victory at best, due to legal costs.

What on earth are you talking about? I haven't claimed they are acting illegally.

I'm not sure how else people are meant to interpret "they seem to be as crooked as they come."