Howdens trade accounts

Karen_carter

I am being asked by my kitchen fitter to pay his Howdens trade account. If I do this will it affect my consumer rights with regard to product guarantees ? 

Bradden

Yes.. as I understand it  you will be classed as a B2B sale and you will not have the basic consumer protection. However if you may find it's more expensive to pay for it without going through their account. Unless the invoice is in your name then you aren't technically the customer... regardless of who made the payment. 

Aylesbury_Duck

It certainly makes things messy.  Why can't you just pay the fitter who then uses the money to pay off the account?

Karen_carter

I'm thinking that paying the fitter is the safest route.....so he then has responsibility as the retailer to me.....right ? However fitter doesn't seem to like this plan !

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Bradden said:

Yes.. as I understand it  you will be classed as a B2B sale and you will not have the basic consumer protection. However if you may find it's more expensive to pay for it without going through their account. Unless the invoice is in your name then you aren't technically the customer... regardless of who made the payment. 

This is not correct, you are not a business, if the retailer only wishes to accept contracts from those who are a business it is their obligation to screen their customers. 

A business can not simply deny your rights because they claim to be trade only otherwise all businesses would be trade only. 

It does sound messy, might be worth a post on this board:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/categories/in-my-home-includes-diy-moneysaving

for more advice as to whether it's a common thing to be asked to do. 

Has the fitter given you a contract in writing for the job they are going to perform? 

Sandtree

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

This is not correct, you are not a business, if the retailer only wishes to accept contracts from those who are a business it is their obligation to screen their customers. 

A business can not simply deny your rights because they claim to be trade only otherwise all businesses would be trade only. 

But the OP won't be the customer, the kitchen fitter will be, the OP is to pay on the fitters account.

Personally I would first examine why the fitter wants you to pay Howden's directly, is it because you want to pay by credit/debit card and the fitter either doesnt accept these or doesnt want the fees for you paying by credit card? 

Are you wanting to pay by credit card to get S75 protection? Certainly having the kitchen invoice to the fitter but you paying the bill could make a mess of the D-C-S chain thats required for S75 protection.

Aylesbury_Duck

Karen_carter said:

I'm thinking that paying the fitter is the safest route.....so he then has responsibility as the retailer to me.....right ? However fitter doesn't seem to like this plan !

Have you asked him why he doesn't like it?

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Sandtree said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

This is not correct, you are not a business, if the retailer only wishes to accept contracts from those who are a business it is their obligation to screen their customers. 

A business can not simply deny your rights because they claim to be trade only otherwise all businesses would be trade only. 

But the OP won't be the customer, the kitchen fitter will be, the OP is to pay on the fitters account.

Personally I would first examine why the fitter wants you to pay Howden's directly, is it because you want to pay by credit/debit card and the fitter either doesnt accept these or doesnt want the fees for you paying by credit card? 

Are you wanting to pay by credit card to get S75 protection? Certainly having the kitchen invoice to the fitter but you paying the bill could make a mess of the D-C-S chain thats required for S75 protection.

If the OP pays Howdens and isn't Howdens customer then the OP would be the fitters customer instead and still have consumers rights against the fitter. 

If the fitter isn't looking to try and off load some responsibility I can't see why they'd not be happy the OP doesn't wat to pay Howdens directly, unless it's a tax dodge? 

Or could the fitter have set up the order in the OP's name, possibly not through his Howdens account (if he has one to begin with)? 

Sandtree

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

If the OP pays Howdens and isn't Howdens customer then the OP would be the fitters customer instead and still have consumers rights against the fitter. 

If the fitter isn't looking to try and off load some responsibility I can't see why they'd not be happy the OP doesn't wat to pay Howdens directly, unless it's a tax dodge? 

If the order is placed on the fitters account and invoiced to the fitter then I would strongly argue the fitter is the customer irrespective of who makes the actual payment. If your Mrs is going for her monthly nails/waxing etc and you pay for it doesnt make you the customer.

My guess is the kitchen units are £10,000 if the OP pays the fitter £10,000 by CC then the fitter only receives £9,700 because of the 3% fee he has to pay. He then has to pay Howdens £10,000 and so is £300 out of pocket. Its illegal in the UK for personal customers to be charged more for paying by CC and so this is the fitters way of keeping the cost down without being out of pocket... alternatively the fitter may not take cards at all and so if OP wants to pay by CC its their only option.

bris

The fitter is Howdens customer, they don't deal with the public. Fitters often ask the customer to pay direct, the benefit of this is that the customer knows the fitter is passing on the trade discount. The cons are that there is no S75 protection if paid by CC. Not many fitters will accept CC's anyway so S75 protection is rare for individual tradesman's work.

The OP can seek a company that accepts CC's but they tend to be a lot pricier.

Bottom line is there is no harm paying Howdens direct, it's not a scam, not all Howdens account holders have credit accounts so the goods aren't released without payment first. Not all tradesmen have 3k lying about to buy goods before they get paid so there is not much wrong here.

The OP still has full consumer rights against the tradesman.

Bradden

FWIW  Howdens do not technically deal direct with the public.. but they are happy to take your cash whether you have an account or not - you just won't get as good prices.. and it will still be classed as a B2B sale.