Final pay and accrued holiday pay / tax and ni issue.

General_Grant

What is holiday entitlenent for a complete year?

How many days a week are worked?  Same hours each day?

When does the holiday year run from?  January, April or some other date?

Had any holiday been taken during the holiday year?  Bank holidays?  

Furloughed at any point?

Lindsey614614

For complete year 20 days and 8 bank holidays.  work 4 days (week one ) OFF Thursday.  Do Mon and Tues 5 hrs day.  8am till 1pm.  10 hrs. Same time / hrs on  wed and Fri  10hr plus 5pm till 8.30 pm on wed and Fri.. Total 27hrs week  .(Week two ) 6 days as  weekend on still have Thursday off .Same times / days  as week one 27hrs, plus 8 till 12 sat and 8 till 12 sun  extra 8 hrs.
So week one 27 hrs. week two 35 hrs 
 Holiday year runs 1st April to 31st march....Had no holidays at all from Jan 2020 . Worked all year as very short staffed.
Bank Holidays Worked Good Friday and Easter Monday, first and last Mondays in may, last Monday August.. Also Christmas day. and new years day. only one NOT  worked was Boxing day Saturday of weekend off.
No not been furloughed at all.

p00hsticks

p00hsticks said:

Lindsey614614 said:

Hi . On slip shown as tax code 1250L ..Normal code that is on all others.
Not had p45 as yet.
Another strange one is on the original slip dated week ending 3rd. it says THIS WEEK EMPLOYER NATIONAL INSURANCE £14.24
on this one sent today...says THIS WEEK EMPLOYER NATIONAL INSURANCE  £163.55???

My understanding is that if you are paid weekly, then your employer has to deduct 12% NI on anything over the primary threshold of £183 a week up to the upper earnings limit of £962 a week - beyond that the rate is 2%.

so I make it that your normal weekly pay of £272 should produce an NI figure of (272-183) x 12% = £10.68

But if the final £1354 is put through as a weekly payment then the NI to be deducted is

(962-183) x 12% + (1354 -962) x 1% = £93.48 + £7.84  = £101.32

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/rates-and-thresholds-for-employers-2020-to-2021

So if my calculations are correct (please check them!) it certainly looks as if that NI figure is higher than it ought to be.

Sorry, I've  only just realised that you are quoting the Employers NI, not the Employees. As getmore4less has said, this is calculated as a straight 13.8% on everything above £169, so the figures of  £14.24 and £163.55 look correct for gross pay of £272 and £1354

Lindsey614614

p00hsticks. YES was employers NI quoted . And you were spot on as my NI was exactly £101.32 from £1354. Robbing sods

General_Grant

Lindsey614614 said:

For complete year 20 days and 8 bank holidays.  work 4 days (week one ) OFF Thursday.  Do Mon and Tues 5 hrs day.  8am till 1pm.  10 hrs. Same time / hrs on  wed and Fri  10hr plus 5pm till 8.30 pm on wed and Fri.. Total 27hrs week  .(Week two ) 6 days as  weekend on still have Thursday off .Same times / days  as week one 27hrs, plus 8 till 12 sat and 8 till 12 sun  extra 8 hrs.
So week one 27 hrs. week two 35 hrs 
 Holiday year runs 1st April to 31st march....Had no holidays at all from Jan 2020 . Worked all year as very short staffed.
Bank Holidays Worked Good Friday and Easter Monday, first and last Mondays in may, last Monday August.. Also Christmas day. and new years day. only one NOT  worked was Boxing day Saturday of weekend off.
No not been furloughed at all.

So if you want to check your holiday pay:
As it's different hours/days in different weeks, they may use hours rather than days (that is convert the 28 days holiday into hours).  And the pro rata amount (for 1 April to your file day) will be on the combined total of 28 days.
You appear to have worked every bank holiday as Boxing Day was transferred to the Monday as a bank holiday.  We don't have bank holidays on Saturdays.

Lindsey614614

General-Grant 
 Been on Gov.uk calculate holiday entitlement. Not sure if done correct. Put in holiday start date and my end date. Came up as 4.25 weeks. Says no regulations on how to convert entitlement into days or hrs for workers with irregular hours.?
Tried to work on the very minim amount of 27 hrs x 4.25  come up as 114.75 hrs.
Allowing for more hrs on  (second week ) 35 hr . Tried to get hrs from what would have been normal 4 weeks worked .Tried this as 2 weeks getting 35 x 2 so 70 hrs + 27 hr x 2.25 week is 54.25 hrs, comes up as 124.25 hrs .
But not sure if correct anyway but have calculated the minim 27 hrs x 4.25 , 114.75 hrs , by hourly rate and that is more than the £1080 they state...Have also divided this £1080 by hourly rate comes up as 107 hrs ?
So a normal month would be worked 2 x 35 hrs + 2 x 27 getting 124 hrs not 107 ?
TIA

getmore4less

The rules on holiday pay changed last year that a weeks pay is now averaged over 52weeks, not everywhere has caught up and the 12.07% method has been challenged in court that it should still be 5.6 weeks(pro-rata when leaving) even part time the average of 52 weeks sorts out the amount. 

For 9 months that's 5.6x9/12= 4.2weeks at 62/2 average hr per week that's 130.2hrs

You will have to ask how they have calculated the holiday pay.

We could keep guessing till we make a match. 

Lindsey614614

Have asked them 3 times for a breakdown of and been ignored.  ACAS have said have a claim for un authorised deductions if I can show what I am still owed. Don't know how I can show that as Don't know how they have calculated it. As only £1080 for holiday showing .This at hr rate works out 107 odd hrs.. divide that by 4 is under 27hr week. not taking into account the 35 hrs.
Not that good with numbers. but the best I could get on average month was 124 hrs. x hr rate £1243.72...So at least £163 short.
On your calculation of 130.2 hours x hr rate is £1305.906.. So at least £225 short.
Don't know anything about rules changing or 12.07 % method..
So is 4.2 weeks my allowance for the nine months from the full year of 5.6 or have I got that wrong.
Am checking contract to see if that says anything else about holiday pay. Have already seen where it says " your holiday pay will be based on your average earnings over the previous 12 weeks "   Is this what you mean by changed to 52 weeks.

Savvy_Sue

Yes, that 12 changed to 52.

What I might do is a claim for the maximum i might be owed, and let them prove me wrong ...

Lindsey614614

Savvy sue
Thanks for response.
Have braved it and asked my neighbour as know he works in payroll and he has confirmed average of the previous 52 weeks. Not the last 12 weeks. Although stated in contract he said makes no difference as changed to on termination is over the 52.  He said trying it on / don't let them get away with it.  Probably the reason they will not give a breakdown as based it on 12 week.

Was even more helpful as his sister works for CAB. He has given her my number. She called explained what to do. Now need to add 52 weeks and find average of that.  And she will be calling me back on Monday for the total. She will get the figure and help in filling amount claimed.  Also she said that at the moment the amount they paid IF over 12 weeks is wrong anyway. If average was 31 hrs week she gets that as 130.2 hours not 107.
And said as over 52 weeks it will not now be OVER the average of 31 hrs week or 62 fortnight based on 27 one week and 35 one week . As over the year did a few Thursday day off's at 5 hrs extra and some sat or sun days off at 4 hrs day.