Executor accounts

emmajayne.roberts

My grandfather passed away last year. he had 4 children and 2 of which were joint executors. 

one of the executors said they would sort out probate etc. after 3mths this was still not done and they left the country for 4mths to go travelling. 
The executor remaining then realised the other one had not sorted out probate as promised. so over the following few weeks and months this was all sorted.
The time has now come to open an account so money can be accessed. However,  the one executors who left the country does not live locally and there is mass friction between them and other 3 siblings. This executor (who left), will not allow the other executor (who finally sorted everything out) to open an account for the funds to be disrupted unless they both have to sign for it. 

even though the other siblings have said they are happy for the other executor (the one who sorted it all out) to open it as would be a normal exactors account.

with no banks locally now open ( all our town banks have now closed) we have to travel to get this sorted. 

I want to know, can an executor open a executors account with a copy of probate. ie not the original but it has they're name on it, as they are refusing to send bank forms unless a copy of probate is sent. 

SevenOfNine

We transferred all funds from the deceased's account into a separate account in the name of one of the 2 executors, in Lloyds bank with just the death cert, but it was only £15k or so, way under their threshold for paying out (it's up to £50k there)  A disclaimer was signed. We didn't even advise the other executor as he'd been abusing the deceased's a/c up to the point of death. 

You may find it quite problematic opening an execs a/c, some don't seem enthusiastic at the best of times, (like Lloyds) others may know which still do.

How have you been dealing with income/expenditure up 'til now?  How much are you talking about, the amount may make a difference to responses.  How did exec 2 sort probate out without the co-operation of exec 1? Exec 2 can apply for certified grant copies, they just cost a bit more if not ordered at the time probate was applied for. 

Sounds a bit like a trust issue between 1 & 2, can't say I'm surprised, why 1 volunteered to get it underway, & why 2 failed to spot nothing was happening fairly quickly, is a bit odd. Nothing worse than execs who can't work well together, just all round aggravation! Good luck.

emmajayne.roberts

SevenOfNine said:

We transferred all funds from the deceased's account into a separate account in the name of one of the 2 executors, in Lloyds bank with just the death cert, but it was only £15k or so, way under their threshold for paying out (it's up to £50k there)  A disclaimer was signed. We didn't even advise the other executor as he'd been abusing the deceased's a/c up to the point of death. 

You may find it quite problematic opening an execs a/c, some don't seem enthusiastic at the best of times, (like Lloyds) others may know which still do.

How have you been dealing with income/expenditure up 'til now?  How much are you talking about, the amount may make a difference to responses.  How did exec 2 sort probate out without the co-operation of exec 1? Exec 2 can apply for certified grant copies, they just cost a bit more if not ordered at the time probate was applied for. 

Sounds a bit like a trust issue between 1 & 2, can't say I'm surprised, why 1 volunteered to get it underway, & why 2 failed to spot nothing was happening fairly quickly, is a bit odd. Nothing worse than execs who can't work well together, just all round aggravation! Good luck.

HSBC have said they can do the account, as probate has been passed, but the MIA (missing in action) executor refuses to allow the other executor to open the account unless they can sign also. 

there is a lot of trust issues. the MIA executor lives away, while the other is local as well as one of the siblings, the other sibling also lives away. The MIA does not longer speaks to any of they're siblings. My grandfather was very old school and simply with his will, and had it drawn up many years ago, with the two eldest being the executors. 

all parties for billing etc have been informed we are awaiting probate. it's not a massive amount of money thats needs to be divided. 

a few days after my grandfathers passing MIA came back here and set up camp in his fathers home. 1& MIA went through all the forms and online forms for probate. things were already strained between MIA and the rest of the family (which does go back years). Though during this time, the family thought MIA was following his fathers wishes. He left again and left the country without informing anyone. it was this same day when looked into he hadn't actually progressed with the forms. it was very difficult as he would only allow 1 into the house at certain times when it suited and only into the kitchen and nowhere else in the house. 

This was all done between middle of April when they came back down and July when they left. it was all done during first lockdown and restrictions. 

Things have gotten worse, and at a stale mate as to where to go to next. All documents posted to him are being sent to his previous address as won't supply current address. they will not send back bank forms until a copy of probate assent to them. (we do have two copies). However, with the amount of tension with the family, 1 and siblings have agreed to send copy of probate until MIA sends back forms, as they are afraid they will open the bank account and dis out funds if and when it suits them, or even hold onto it. MIA is also refusing to respond to putting the house on the market. 

p00hsticks

There wasanother thread on executors accounts a few days ago

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6235740/executors-bank-account#latest

emmajayne.roberts

p00hsticks said:

There wasanother thread on executors accounts a few days ago

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6235740/executors-bank-account#latest

MIA won’t allow 1 to open account or even put the funds into another account, even though the other two siblings have written a letter and signed it to say 1 can do it. 

We have probate, just MIA refusing to open an account where only ones person signs for things. 

I’m wanting to know, if they can open an account and accessing my grandfather funds using a copy of probate or does it have to be the original. 

naedanger

Is your question can MIA open an executor account in just his name and with just a copy as opposed to the original probate form?

If so, then I think whether or not a bank will open an account with just a copy of the probate is up to them. In practice I suspect it would be difficult to find a bank which would do this if the amount in the account exceeds their internal limit at which they require probate, but if one did then I don't think they would have done anything wrong (since probate does exist).

I suspect a bank would be wrong to open an account with just one executor's name on it, if the will states that both executors need to act. I also think that in the UK banks generally are not keen to open executor accounts so I suspect it would be difficult to find one that one open it in just one name. Nevertheless I would not wish to guarantee it. 

Where is the money currently? Executor accounts are not necessarily needed to access money.

xylophone

Let's say that Grandfather was James Green and he had named his son Paul Green and daughter  Mary Black as the exors of his will.

Does the Grant say

The administration of James Green's estate is granted by this court to the following executors

Paul Green of 6 Honeysuckle Lane .......

Mary Black of 8 Rose Avenue  ......

 Or is it granted to Mary Black of 8 Rose Avenue......
with power reserved to another executor?

emmajayne.roberts

naedanger said:

Is your question can MIA open an executor account in just his name and with just a copy as opposed to the original probate form?

If so, then I think whether or not a bank will open an account with just a copy of the probate is up to them. In practice I suspect it would be difficult to find a bank which would do this if the amount in the account exceeds their internal limit at which they require probate, but if one did then I don't think they would have done anything wrong (since probate does exist).

I suspect a bank would be wrong to open an account with just one executor's name on it, if the will states that both executors need to act. I also think that in the UK banks generally are not keen to open executor accounts so I suspect it would be difficult to find one that one open it in just one name. Nevertheless I would not wish to guarantee it. 

Where is the money currently? Executor accounts are not necessarily needed to access money.

The money is currently sitting in my grandfathers bank account, which was closed by the bank. 

The dispute is putting it into another account so it can be equally distrusted and bills can be paid from it, ie the funeral etc. 

MIA wants full control of everything. While 1 and siblings are trying to the best way they know how, none of them trust MIA. 

While my grandfather was alive, I dealt with most of his billing queries helping and supporting him. MIA did nothing to support him, but like mentioned by granf was old school and MIA was second born. 

MIA did like to control situations, and everyone around them. 

Which was why, I wanted to know what he could do with just a copy of probate. 

They’re name is second listed on probate and will states everything is distributed between 1 and MIA. However, as seen MIA doesn’t like 1 have some control also. 

emmajayne.roberts

xylophone said:

Let's say that Grandfather was James Green and he had named his son Paul Green and daughter  Mary Black as the exors of his will.

Does the Grant say

The administration of James Green's estate is granted by this court to the following executors

Paul Green of 6 Honeysuckle Lane .......

Mary Black of 8 Rose Avenue  ......

 Or is it granted to Mary Black of 8 Rose Avenue......
with power reserved to another executor?

It’s the first one. With 1 listed first and then MIA listed as second. 

MIA likes being on control, very controlling person. 1 and siblings are trying to do it the way they’re father wanted, but MIA wants all the control. Which is not how my granf wanted it. 

naedanger

Is the amount in the account greater than the bank's probate limit? If not then the bank won't require probate and there is a possibility any close relative (so MIA or any other of the deceased's children) acting alone might be able to move the money to their own personal account.

Personally I think the bank would be wrong to do so (since the will says there are two executors) but in my own experience I got control of money in an account based on being a close relative alone. (The bank did not ask to see the will - though that may have been a failure - possibly because normal processes were not being followed because of Covid. In my case I was the sole executor but the bank had not seen evidence of this.)

If this is the case you need to be careful if you are concerned MIA might grab the money. Alternatively the other executor might be able to take sole control of the money. (Of course they should be careful to ensure they follow the letter of the will as they might be required to justify taking such action.)

getmore4less

Who got named on the grant?