Likelihood of a good bargain from a private many-car seller

Mickey666

Could be the type of Daley dealer that asks exactly what you're looking for, right down to the colour and trim, and then replies that they've got one exactly like that coming in next week and hey presto they're as good as their word . . . hmm.

jimjames

alihd said:

couriervanman said:

If/when you do buy via Facebook/gumtree which I think you will take someone along with you to give the car a good once over/test drive ideally a mechanic, but don't come back on here 1 week later complaining the head gasket has gone 

This is a bit off-topic to the question, but still an interesting point. Nonetheless, I don't understand what is your conclusion?

I understand that I could be unlucky, but how do we compare the expected loss (statistically) with the potential gain/profit?
For example, if I buy this car (an automatic Peugeot 107 2008, 42K Mileage) for £2000 (or probably a few hundred less after haggling), then obviously it is a bargain because dealer prices on Autotrader for the same car is about £2800-£4500. Now the question would be how much is it likely that I inspect and test the car (with my moderate knowledge), don't see an issue, buy it, and then some issue raises and I have to pay to fix it. If, on average, the car costs another £1000 for repairs after the purchase, then it still costs the same as buying from the dealer. Am I missing something?

My son bought a car from a dodgy backstreet dealer. Car cost £2000. It's now cost more than £2500 in repairs and that's mainly doing the work at home so parts. He could have bought a different private sale one for £3000. It's not a bargain if you have to pay more in repairs that it would have cost for similar car without faults.

The extra £1000 from a dealer will give you warranty for any other faults, you could find it's much more expensive than £1000 to repair and you're without a car in the meantime.

Of course you might get lucky. But you might not.

alihd

I was mostly worried about haggling power and whether it is safe to deal with private many-car sellers. Apparently, most of the comments are about the repair costs of the car.

I just learned that some companies like AA provide 3- or 6-month warranty. Is it possible to ask the private seller to sell the car WITH one of those reliable warranties?
- Firstly, is it a common thing to ask the seller for this? Not sure who pays first then? Does the seller pay for the warranty first, or do I pay for the car? (in case they might refuse to warranty later on)
- Secondly, does adding a short-term warranty to the car allay the concerns of buying from a private seller? In practice, do those warranty companies resolve most of the issues for free?

AdrianC

alihd said:

I was mostly worried about haggling power and whether it is safe to deal with private many-car sellers.

They're as likely as any other seller to move on price. It all depends on how likely they think they are to get more from somebody else.

What do you mean "safe to deal with"? You give them money, they give you the keys and paperwork for the car. End of.

Apparently, most of the comments are about the repair costs of the car.

I just learned that some companies like AA provide 3- or 6-month warranty. Is it possible to ask the private seller to sell the car WITH one of those reliable warranties?
- Firstly, is it a common thing to ask the seller for this? Not sure who pays first then? Does the seller pay for the warranty first, or do I pay for the car? (in case they might refuse to warranty later on)
- Secondly, does adding a short-term warranty to the car allay the concerns of buying from a private seller? In practice, do those warranty companies resolve most of the issues for free?

Sorry, you want a private seller to cover the cost of the warranty?
No, if you want a warranty they aren't actively offering, you pay for it yourself.

And, no, warranties do not cover anything that's wear-and-tear related. And on a 13yo car that's the cheapest of its type on the market, that'll be just about everything. Save your money.

Remember - any aftermarket warranty is a gamble that your car is going to have more covered faults than the warranty provider expects. They are selling the warranty not to provide some social service, but solely in order to make profit out of the money that's left from your premium after they've paid out claims, their admin costs, tax, etc etc.

Grumpy_chap

alihd said:

I just learned that some companies like AA provide 3- or 6-month warranty. Is it possible to ask the private seller to sell the car WITH one of those reliable warranties? 

You can ask anything.
The seller is most likely to say no.
Often the warranties require a mechanic to say the car is OK first.  How do you get that from a private seller?
In any event, have you established what is actually covered by these after-market warranties?  What loop-holes are there that avoid a successful claim?

Ectophile

Aftermarket warranties aren't worth the paper they are written on, even if they come with a usually reputable name at the top.  They are designed so that they don't pay out on anything, ever.

If something does go wrong, and you try to make a claim then:-

• It's a component that is not covered by the warranty, or
  
• It's a wear-and-tear part and it's worn out, or
• It's a pre-existing fault from before the warranty was issued.
  

ontheroad1970

OP, please don't be offended.  Instead of coming here and asking fifty questions, why not go somewhere like Honest John's and other websites and do a bit of reading around, and then come back with some questions to fine tune things.  People have told you gain and again that this dealer and other scrotes like him aren't reliable and generally sell sheds and put sold as seen on the receipt.  Look for a genuine private seller, or buy from someone with an actual registered address and listed in companies house.  You will pay a little more for the former and a bit more again for the latter.  Dealers selling cash in hand pretending (and not pretending particularly well) to be private sellers will open top a whole world of financial pain to you.

Herzlos

alihd said:

 In practice, do those warranty companies resolve most of the issues for free?

They cover almost nothing, and will do nothing to help you buying a car from a private dealer or a pretend private dealer.
Buying from a pretend private dealer is the most risk - the car may be OK, or it may have hidden faults.

Buying from a real private seller is less risky as it probably doesn't have hidden faults.

If you want a warranty, then buy from a franchised dealer (and pay appropriately for it).

You've been driving for years, right? Passed the UK test yet? Just go look at a car, try it out and buy one that seems to be in decent condition. That's really all you can ask for in the sub £3000 category.

angrycrow

OP don't buy from the seller you linked to. I have a pretty good idea how he gets his cheap cars.

A few years ago I had a diesel car that suffered what on the face of it was turbo failure. Further investigation established it was blowing past the piston rings and pressurising the crank case and this was the likely cause of the turbo failure. Not worth fixing. DMF was also on the way out. 

Car was sold on ebay with all the issues listed, sold for £450 to a trader from 100 miles away. He came confirmed the faults and drove it home, it was smoking so bad it is a miracle he did not get pulled on the way home. Less than 2 weeks later he advertised it for sale on Gumtree as private sale £2000. Reason given he had bought it for his wife but she did not like it. She had not liked the 3 previous cars of the same make and model he had sold in the last 6 months. 2 weeks after it sold I started getting calls from the new owner because the turbo had failed. 

The trader had fitted a cheap recon turbo and sold it on posing as a private sale to avoid his responsibility when it inevitably failed. He made around £1000 on it.

There is a reason the seller is trying to present his cars as private sale. 

noclaf

Op I would say you are over thinking a lot of this.
There is an element luck involved at the lower budget end of the used car market, you could easily get a lemon whether you buy from a genuine private seller or a fake private seller or a garage. I'm not sure any deep statistical analysis is really needed here.
As others have suggested, honest John and other used car review website's would be useful. If you are looking at cars at dealers then do as much research as you can on the dealer, granted not always easy with a lack of information available. 
Some cars esp older Jap ones tend to be able to take a bit more abuse and patchy service records without it necessarily causing huge issues later or throwing up huge bills. I would say it's the same for a lot of older n/a petrol cars due to the simple design.
As a final point if something seems to good to be true then it probably is...FB marketplace for cars should have a huge banner with those exact words/warning! For those who are handy with spanners it's less of a risk if you buy a car that needs work but for everyone else can be big bills and time spent at the garage being repaired.
The private car market now seems like the wild west compared to many years back..there are always dodgy sellers but it seems much worse than before at least it feels that way and by the same token for genuine sellers you have to deal with all sorts of pondlife and chancers. I for one will try to find a way to flog my shed via p/X as the idea of trying to sell privately puts me right off.