Help needed! John Lewis won't honour a NEFF guarantee

MattMattMattUK

stuart_thefc said:

Wow! I did not expect that everyone would fall on the side of JL/NEFF.

It is not about "falling on the side" of anyone, it is about a correct statement of the law, as it applies. Being told something which you do not want to hear does not mean that it is wrong.

stuart_thefc said:

So can anyone explain why offer a 2 year guarantee if the only obligation is a refund of some sort, or even worse, a pro-rata refund! 

They have the option to replace, repair or refund, within their guarantee, that is the terms of the guarantee, if you assumed it was something else then that is your fault for not reading the guarantee.

stuart_thefc said:

These are integrated units within a fitted kitchen, so even with a refund, I will have to potentially get new units and a professional fitter in to fit/replace the defective appliances.

What you do with something after you have bought it is not the responsibility of the original retailer. You also do not need a professional fitter to replace/fit an integrated fridge or fridge/freezer, I have done it before, I am not a kitchen fitter, it took me around 15 minutes to remove the old unit and around 10 minutes to fit the new one, it is an easy task that anyone reasonably competent can accomplish. 

stuart_thefc said:

And if @Spank really thinks one year of use from a built in appliance from NEFF is 'brilliant' then perhaps the lesson is to buy cheap and unbranded rather than 'quality'.

It is not one year until failure, it is the fact that they have offered a full refund on an appliance after more than a year, that is more than you are legally entitled to.

stuart_thefc said:

Some comments suggest JL are just doing what they need to do under the 'Consumer Rights', but part of the JL brand is based on doing the right thing and exceeding our expectations. 

They are exceeding their obligations under the Consumer Rights Act 2015, I would deem that as exceeding expectations, but it is also impossible to exceed someone's expectations if their expectations are unreasonable.

stuart_thefc said:

The appliance failure is with NEFF and I'm sure that JL is a significant buyer of Bosch Siemens Home (BSH) Group appliances, of which NEFF is a sub-brand. Therefore, they should be pushing back to BSH to take responsibility of their products and to either repair or replace the defective appliance - right?

No, not right. Goods are built with an expected lifetime, that might be, as an example an expected working life of ten years for a fridge/freezer, some might last 20+ years, of course others will fail earlier, some considerably earlier. To protect against early failure there are both protections under the CRA2015, but companies also offer guarantees, under which they will repair/replace/refund, they do this to both entice and reassure customers, as well as attempt to keep them onside when something goes wrong, as it occasionally can. They are refunding you, in full, after you have had more than a year's usage from the item, that sounds like a good deal to me and it appears everyone else here, it exceeds your rights in law, they may well recover some or all of that cost under their contract with Bosch. Bosch will be aware that things occasionally go wrong, so will likely accept that cost from a major retailer as part of their contract. 

stuart_thefc said:

Finally, I'm pretty sure the guarantee is not discounted or reduced based on the discount applied against recommended retail price. I bought a new product at a discount price and I'd like that product replaced or repaired.

You are not guaranteed for the RRP, the guarantee covers repair, replace or refund, they have the choice to repair the faulty item, replace the faulty item or refund you what you paid for the faulty item, you do not have right to demand replacement or repair.

theonlywayisup

I won't go over what everyone else has quite rightly advised and taken time to expand on.

But re your last comment....

stuart_thefc said:

I bought a new product at a discount price and I'd like that product replaced or repaired.

You may prefer a replacement or a repair but it is not your choice.  Like it or lump it the retailer (JL) have gone above and beyond.  The guarantor has fulfilled the T&C of the guarantee. 

neilmcl

Is this the point the OP comes back and accuses you all for working for JL or Neff 🤣

gettingtheresometime

neilmcl said:

Is this the point the OP comes back and accuses you all for working for JL or Neff 🤣

Or comes back within 48 hrs claiming that JL have caved and a replacement is on its way?

Al_Ross

stuart_thefc said:

I don't know where else to go, so perhaps others can help me in this forum...
My wife and I bought 2 NEFF integrated fridge feeders from John Lewis in January 2020 from their 'Clearance Event' in store.
10 days ago one broke down and we arranged a NEFF engineer to visit in the hope of a repair. Unfortunately NEFF advised it need to be replaced and to contact JL.
JL have refused to replace the fridge freezer and offered to refund the money for us to buy a replacement, but...

• We got a great deal when we bought them, effectively £375 each. So a refund will not cover the cost of a replacement
• They are a pair in our integrated kitchen with a 60/40 split, so to replace one would look strange and cost more money to replace the panels

Any thoughts or legal know-how to help us get what we thought were great products from a great retailer?
Ideally we want it repaired or replaced. At worst a replacement with no additional cost.
Thanks and I hope you and yours are keeping safe and well in this mad world!

Hi Stuart,what is the model number of the Neff Freezer?

stuart_thefc

Thanks for all your comments and points on the law.
I guess in this new world, we all have to lower our expectations of what we thought were brands that went above and beyond the letter of the law. Having had IKEA appliances for nearly five years and had one only last November repaired with no quibble or delay, I thought both NEFF and John Lewis would be equal if not better in the way they resolve what I thought would be a simple repair.
NEFF state 'With our expert advice, your NEFF fridge or freezer will perform to the high standard you expect for a long time to come.'. I don't think 12 months is a long time. Five years is a long time and IKEA could still repair my oven.

Here is what John Lewis say...
'If we can't repair your item, we'll replace it with an item of equivalent specification. If no equivalent product is available, we'll either offer you the nearest equivalent specification or its selling price value , and we'll always do our best to make sure you're satisfied with the outcome.'. I think in this case, I should be offered a product of 'equivalent' specification if they truly want to make sure I'm 'satisfied with the outcome'.

So, as the original OP, I'll let you know what happens

Handyknowledge

I think you bought a end of line unit hence the price if you think it's premium to pay £375 I paid £2k for my one that is not premium. You bought as low price the price you can afford to spend.

jon81uk

Have you tried claiming on the Neff warranty Warranty Terms and Conditions | NEFF UK (neff-home.com) says they should repair or replace.

DiddyDavies

jon81uk said:

Have you tried claiming on the Neff warranty Warranty Terms and Conditions | NEFF UK (neff-home.com) says they should repair or replace.

But if it can't be repaired and a direct replacement isn't available, they state:

• We are not obliged to provide a replacement which matches the other appliances in the household. The replacement will be from the local product portfolio.

So if the OP was to try to insist that NEFF follow the warranty terms, they may end up with an appliance that is totally different in appearance to their requirements.

unholyangel

This is one issue with buying heavily discounted, and especially clearance, goods. 

It's not possible to get a replacement, as they no longer stock them and it's too costly to repair compared to refund. 

Check the terms of their own guarantee to see if it applies to clearance goods and if so, see what they say. I've found most retailers accommodating as long as you're reasonable in your requests and clear on what those requests are.