Plumber Bill Dispute

bjf02031986

Hi, we purchased a house in the summer and hired a plumber to install central heating and a new bathroom. We sent plans, 3D models and the exact products that we’d like to fit to the plumber, who produced two quotes, one for the heating and one for the bathroom. The work took them four months in the end, as they were so disorganised and would just pop in here in and there spending the odd hour on it, despite them originally saying approx one week. Their estimate quotes were 6k for heating, 4k for the bathroom which was roughly what a few other plumbers quoted. He was vague with how accurate the estimate was so I sent a thorough list saying clearly that were happy to proceed for a set fee of 10k and fully listed again any specific details, he accepted this and verbally said any extra we’d deal with at the time but it should be there or there abouts. First invoice received for 7k a month or two later, promptly paid. Second invoice received today, completely out the of the blue as we’ve not seen them for two months and the downstairs heating is being finished when the plastering is done, for £4800 so £1,800 over budget saying that’s how long it took them. Long story short I reeled off 50% of the bathroom quote that he produced for things he didn’t do, his only extra was to replace a cast iron svp internally with a upvc one (I expected maybe £400 more for this but he didn’t say a price).  The boiler hasn’t been signed off by gas safe because they’ve forgotten to do it, wasn’t wired even and was connected using a multiplug running from a bedroom even though the quote said all associated electrical works with the boiler, and all sorts of other issues.  I’ve said I’m happy to pay the outstanding £3,000 once the boiler is gas safe signed off but won’t be paying the extra £1,800, do this sound fair and where do I stand legally? Thanks

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/section/51/enacted

Reasonable price to be paid for a service

(1)This section applies to a contract to supply a service if—

(a)the consumer has not paid a price or other consideration for the service,

(b)the contract does not expressly fix a price or other consideration, and does not say how it is to be fixed, and

(c)anything that is to be treated under section 50 as included in the contract does not fix a price or other consideration either.

(2)In that case the contract is to be treated as including a term that the consumer must pay a reasonable price for the service, and no more.

(3)What is a reasonable price is a question of fact.

The plumber would need to demonstrate the increase in costs. 

DiddyDavies

bjf02031986 said:

Their estimate quotes were 6k for heating, 4k for the bathroom which was roughly what a few other plumbers quoted. He was vague with how accurate the estimate was so I sent a thorough list saying clearly that were happy to proceed for a set fee of 10k and fully listed again any specific details, he accepted this and verbally said any extra we’d deal with at the time but it should be there or there abouts. 

That may be the biggest problem.
If you received estimates for £10k for the work and the final bill came to £11,800. that's an increase of 18% above the estimate and many people would find this acceptable.
If however you can prove that they agreed to the £10k set fee then you have every right not to pay anything above this amount.

bjf02031986

DiddyDavies said:

bjf02031986 said:

Their estimate quotes were 6k for heating, 4k for the bathroom which was roughly what a few other plumbers quoted. He was vague with how accurate the estimate was so I sent a thorough list saying clearly that were happy to proceed for a set fee of 10k and fully listed again any specific details, he accepted this and verbally said any extra we’d deal with at the time but it should be there or there abouts. 

That may be the biggest problem.
If you received estimates for £10k for the work and the final bill came to £11,800. that's an increase of 18% above the estimate and many people would find this acceptable.
If however you can prove that they agreed to the £10k set fee then you have every right not to pay anything above this amount.

The additional expenses are all being claimed on the bathroom, which was a £4k quote, so this is an increase of 50% which I don’t think many people would consider acceptable.  I would consider acceptable extras to be £500 or under, anything taking it above this should be explicitly confirmed imo 

Aylesbury_Duck

bjf02031986 said:

DiddyDavies said:

bjf02031986 said:

Their estimate quotes were 6k for heating, 4k for the bathroom which was roughly what a few other plumbers quoted. He was vague with how accurate the estimate was so I sent a thorough list saying clearly that were happy to proceed for a set fee of 10k and fully listed again any specific details, he accepted this and verbally said any extra we’d deal with at the time but it should be there or there abouts. 

That may be the biggest problem.
If you received estimates for £10k for the work and the final bill came to £11,800. that's an increase of 18% above the estimate and many people would find this acceptable.
If however you can prove that they agreed to the £10k set fee then you have every right not to pay anything above this amount.

The additional expenses are all being claimed on the bathroom, which was a £4k quote, so this is an increase of 50% which I don’t think many people would consider acceptable.  I would consider acceptable extras to be £500 or under, anything taking it above this should be explicitly confirmed imo 

Ok, but you didn't set that out in your original post.  If the two estimates (and be careful here, because estimates and quotes are different things) were separated and one has come in accurately and the other is over by 45%, I would challenge it.  But DiddyDavies still had a point - the verbal agreement of the set fee and extras is unfortunate because it's a he said, she said situation.  I suspect you're going to end up meeting somewhere between the 10k and 11.8k, or he'll take you to court for the extra or he'll just give up. 

bjf02031986

Aylesbury_Duck said:

bjf02031986 said:

DiddyDavies said:

bjf02031986 said:

Their estimate quotes were 6k for heating, 4k for the bathroom which was roughly what a few other plumbers quoted. He was vague with how accurate the estimate was so I sent a thorough list saying clearly that were happy to proceed for a set fee of 10k and fully listed again any specific details, he accepted this and verbally said any extra we’d deal with at the time but it should be there or there abouts. 

That may be the biggest problem.
If you received estimates for £10k for the work and the final bill came to £11,800. that's an increase of 18% above the estimate and many people would find this acceptable.
If however you can prove that they agreed to the £10k set fee then you have every right not to pay anything above this amount.

The additional expenses are all being claimed on the bathroom, which was a £4k quote, so this is an increase of 50% which I don’t think many people would consider acceptable.  I would consider acceptable extras to be £500 or under, anything taking it above this should be explicitly confirmed imo 

Ok, but you didn't set that out in your original post.  If the two estimates (and be careful here, because estimates and quotes are different things) were separated and one has come in accurately and the other is over by 45%, I would challenge it.  But DiddyDavies still had a point - the verbal agreement of the set fee and extras is unfortunate because it's a he said, she said situation.  I suspect you're going to end up meeting somewhere between the 10k and 11.8k, or he'll take you to court for the extra or he'll just give up. 

Yes you’re right, he’s just replied saying can I just send him the 3k and we’ll discuss the rest, I said again he’ll receive it promptly upon receipt of a gas safe certificate . The only thing he mentioned that might come up as an extra prior to works starting was the svp, which we’re of course happy to pay extra for because we agreed to this and it was a days work, if he came back say £400 over there’d be no dispute, £1800 claiming things that are clearly listed in his quote seems absurd though as they’re clearly not unexpected additional costs that have arisen.  We explicitly said at the time we’re hiring you to do 10k of work that’s our budget, if anything comes up that will take it above this then flag it up because we’ll look at doing bits ourselves to bring the cost down.