Excel - Car Park with Two Schemes- "Wrong" Ticket Displayed

D_P_Dance

Also read these

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contra_proferentem

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reasonability

and, if you have not already done so, complain to your MP.

Snakes_Belly

This is a comment from tripadvisor about the state of the Excel car park and how badly it is being maintained. It also mentions that the car park is a hot spot. It will support your defence in the WS.

Parking arrangements ruins this hotel

Firstly, this hotel is OK. Typical Travelodge with nothing great and nothing dreadful about the room. It was cold on arrival but soon warmed up once I cranked up the heating. I didn’t eat breakfast so can’t comment on that. The building is an old warehouse and the landings and stairwells are cold and draughty. The sheets were clean, as were the pillows and towels.

Booked for one night to attend a meeting the following morning in Burton town centre. I experienced a 4 hour delay on the motorway and arrived at around 2am.

Having driven once around the block because the entrance to the hotel wasn’t particularly well signed, the first thing I noticed when I arrived was the poor state of the car park. There were pot holes filled with water and on a wet and dark night it was difficult to navigate from the car to the hotel without getting dirty.

I was greeted by a rather surly lady on reception on arrival and I asked about the parking arrangements. She gave me a pass which allowed me to park free of charge only until 8.00am the following morning. She said that if I needed to park any later than 8am I would have to go back outside to the machine and purchase a ticket.

I was tired and I was laden down with my belongings with nowhere to put them down other than the floor so I decided to put the permit in my car then go to bed. I would get up early in the morning rather than trying to find the ticket machine in the dark, the rain and the mud.

My room was at the front of the hotel and overlooked the car park. I have to say that in the daylight the next day it was even worse than I had thought it was the night before. The spaces were very tight and a car had parked beside me so I could hardly open my door. It was very muddy and full of puddles. However, what really shocked me was that at exactly 3 minutes past 8 the parking warden appeared and started taking photos of all cars that had a red Travelodge pass in the window.

It is clear that Travelodge guests are easy pickings and at £100 fine for staying longer than 8am I think there should be a warning stated very clearly on the hotel booking page. It is for this reason that I will not use this particular hotel again.

Snakes_Belly

"Having driven once around the block because the entrance to the hotel wasn’t particularly well signed, the first thing I noticed when I arrived was the poor state of the car park. There were pot holes filled with water and on a wet and dark night it was difficult to navigate from the car to the hotel without getting dirty."

Noticed on the above review that the driver had difficulty in finding the Travelodge. Excel's signage is also by the Travelodge sign along with several other random signs which block one another from view. Difficult anyway when you are coming in from the ring road onto Miller's Lane. you probably did not even see any signage until you parked up especially if you went down the left hand side of the Travelodge.

YogaCat

Thanks all for your comments, I've incorporated them in my defence and submitted it by email as per the template defence thread.  Do I need to do anything regarding my defence on the MCOL website where I filed my Acknowledgement of Service?  I'm sure the answer is no as there is no mention of it on the thread, however please humour me as I am feeling very nervous about this!  

Le_Kirk

Absolutely not, do not touch it, except to look for updates about the progress of your defence.  Type nothing, not even a full stop in the defence box.

Redx

As above , do not touch that site , consider it read only from now on

You should have had an email auto reply from the ccbcaq acknowledging receipt of the defence submission

Keep checking the MCOL website every few days until it's changed , then after it says the DQ has been posted , do that stage as well , to the ccbcaq email address plus to the claimant too

After that the CCBC allocate the chosen Court and have no further involvement

nosferatu1001

As above. treat it purely as INFORMATION until it is transferred to your local court
Keep checking it so you know WHEN the DQ has been sent to you. Then you can fill out your own neat version from the gov website. 

Snakes_Belly

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6190443/finding-of-fact-win#latest

The OP of the above thread has obtained a transcript of their hearing and kindly posted on the forum. I think that it will be useful for your WS particularly in relation to the formation of the contract.

In their WS Excel will say that the contract is formed on entry and by entering the car park you are agreeing to their terms and conditions.  They will cite a case that involves a barrier car park where the driver stops at the barrier and the signs are in full view. Nothing could be more far removed from the signage at the Derby Street car park. There is no way that a contract could be formed on entry to that car park. 

The sign is obscured by other signage. You would not have driven directly past it when entering the car park. You would have parked before even seeing any signs.

"23. Furthermore, I find the placing of the sign on the entrance of the car park in the manner described, being on the edge of the building and above immediate eye level, would be unfair if it was to be found to create a contract.  Therefore, considering Section 71 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, I find any purported contract on this basis would therefore render the relevant terms pertaining the imposition of the penalty charging notice to be unfair."

Decisions at County Court level do not set a precedent but that judgment may have some influence. They have applied statute law. 


 

Helsy72

Hi, found your post really interesting and the fact that it is from 2020 and the issue has still not been addressed.  In October 2024, I got caught out with the ambiguous floor markings, received a fine, lost my appeal and will be obviously taken to court.  Yogacat did you win your case?  

Coupon-mad

Snakes_Belly said:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6190443/finding-of-fact-win#latest

The OP of the above thread has obtained a transcript of their hearing and kindly posted on the forum.

I think that it will be useful for your WS particularly in relation to the formation of the contract.

In their WS Excel will say that the contract is formed on entry and by entering the car park you are agreeing to their terms and conditions.  They will cite a case that involves a barrier car park where the driver stops at the barrier and the signs are in full view. Nothing could be more far removed from the signage at the Derby Street car park. There is no way that a contract could be formed on entry to that car park. 

The sign is obscured by other signage. You would not have driven directly past it when entering the car park. You would have parked before even seeing any signs.

"23. Furthermore, I find the placing of the sign on the entrance of the car park in the manner described, being on the edge of the building and above immediate eye level, would be unfair if it was to be found to create a contract.  Therefore, considering Section 71 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, I find any purported contract on this basis would therefore render the relevant terms pertaining the imposition of the penalty charging notice to be unfair."

Helsy72 said:

Hi, found your post really interesting and the fact that it is from 2020 and the issue has still not been addressed.  In October 2024, I got caught out with the ambiguous floor markings, received a fine, lost my appeal and will be obviously taken to court.

@YogaCat did you win your case?  

Good bounce.

Had forgotten this case and transcript.