Estate agent legal action for unpaid fee - will this affect credit file etc?

GrumpyDil

Op. 
Just to provide a little clarity are you able to provide the section of the agreement which covers exactly what happens when the tenancy reaches the end of the fixed term period.
Also I would be asking the agent to explain the exact basis on which they believe the fee is payable given that no new agreement was entered into. 

itwasntme001

GrumpyDil said:

Op. 
Just to provide a little clarity are you able to provide the section of the agreement which covers exactly what happens when the tenancy reaches the end of the fixed term period.
Also I would be asking the agent to explain the exact basis on which they believe the fee is payable given that no new agreement was entered into. 

We have asked the agent and all he has replied back with is the relevant section of the terms and now is threatening legal action.

The terms the agent has highlighted just say fee is due on renewal or extension of the tenancy.  Nothing about a new or SPT tenancy.  According to NRLA, a SPT is a new tenancy.  There is nothing else said about what happens after the end of the fixed term.  Just that on renewal or extension a fee is due (which is what the agent has highlighted to me).

GrumpyDil

Hm,
I'd argue that allowing a tenancy to continue as a periodic tenancy is neither an extension or renewal.
If they wanted to cover your situation off they really should have covered extension, renewal and continuation onto a periodic tenancy. 
If I was having this discussion I would probably tell them that I was not paying and if they want to take it further then that is their choice but that's just me.

As I said previously it would make sense to get this moved to the home buying, selling, renting board. 

Jumblebumble

dahj said:

itwasntme001 said:

dahj said:

I would suggest she offer the agent the fee if they get these (or other Tenants) to sign up for another year or more.
She could offer them say 1/4 of the fee for the existing rolling arrangement on a goodwill basis.
This should also strengthen her case should it go to court. 

Why should she offer anything on a goodwill basis?  She does not think she owes any fee and the agent did no work at all to deserve any such fee.

1 - It's called a settlement? They are obviously concerned that they will have the hassle of legal proceedings - even if they believe they will win.
2 - They are very vague about the actual contract wording - it's possible since the tenants are still in property (using the existing tenancy agreement without a break) it could be deemed to be a type of renewal. 

So if a tenant decided to stay for one more month on a rolling contract and then move out you think the landlord  should pay £1000 to the agency.
If the tenants are using the existing tenancy agreement it is not a renewal and cannot be as the periodic tenancy has no end date 
This is what Shelter say
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/renewing_your_private_tenancy
Your tenancy becomes a periodic tenancy automatically if you stay past the end of the fixed term without a renewal agreement

itwasntme001

GrumpyDil said:

Hm,
I'd argue that allowing a tenancy to continue as a periodic tenancy is neither an extension or renewal.
If they wanted to cover your situation off they really should have covered extension, renewal and continuation onto a periodic tenancy. 
If I was having this discussion I would probably tell them that I was not paying and if they want to take it further then that is their choice but that's just me.

As I said previously it would make sense to get this moved to the home buying, selling, renting board. 

Thanks a lot.  Yes I did post on that board as well and the response was that I should not have to pay anything since a SPT is not a renewal or extension.

So will ignore the agent threats and if it does end up going to court I will be confident enough to defend myself.

itwasntme001

Jumblebumble said:

dahj said:

itwasntme001 said:

dahj said:

I would suggest she offer the agent the fee if they get these (or other Tenants) to sign up for another year or more.
She could offer them say 1/4 of the fee for the existing rolling arrangement on a goodwill basis.
This should also strengthen her case should it go to court. 

Why should she offer anything on a goodwill basis?  She does not think she owes any fee and the agent did no work at all to deserve any such fee.

1 - It's called a settlement? They are obviously concerned that they will have the hassle of legal proceedings - even if they believe they will win.
2 - They are very vague about the actual contract wording - it's possible since the tenants are still in property (using the existing tenancy agreement without a break) it could be deemed to be a type of renewal. 

So if a tenant decided to stay for one more month on a rolling contract and then move out you think the landlord  should pay £1000 to the agency.
If the tenants are using the existing tenancy agreement it is not a renewal and cannot be as the periodic tenancy has no end date 
This is what Shelter say
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/renewing_your_private_tenancy
Your tenancy becomes a periodic tenancy automatically if you stay past the end of the fixed term without a renewal agreement

Thanks for this, gives me a lot more confidence in defending my position.  Certainly looks like the agent are trying it on.

[Deleted User]

Jumblebumble said:

dahj said:

itwasntme001 said:

dahj said:

I would suggest she offer the agent the fee if they get these (or other Tenants) to sign up for another year or more.
She could offer them say 1/4 of the fee for the existing rolling arrangement on a goodwill basis.
This should also strengthen her case should it go to court. 

Why should she offer anything on a goodwill basis?  She does not think she owes any fee and the agent did no work at all to deserve any such fee.

1 - It's called a settlement? They are obviously concerned that they will have the hassle of legal proceedings - even if they believe they will win.
2 - They are very vague about the actual contract wording - it's possible since the tenants are still in property (using the existing tenancy agreement without a break) it could be deemed to be a type of renewal. 

So if a tenant decided to stay for one more month on a rolling contract and then move out you think the landlord  should pay £1000 to the agency.
If the tenants are using the existing tenancy agreement it is not a renewal and cannot be as the periodic tenancy has no end date 
This is what Shelter say
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/renewing_your_private_tenancy
Your tenancy becomes a periodic tenancy automatically if you stay past the end of the fixed term without a renewal agreement

Kindly don't put words in my mouth as it would depend what contract has been agreed to.
It's the original tenancy that has rolled over, it's not a new tenancy agreement.

itwasntme001

dahj said:

Jumblebumble said:

dahj said:

itwasntme001 said:

dahj said:

I would suggest she offer the agent the fee if they get these (or other Tenants) to sign up for another year or more.
She could offer them say 1/4 of the fee for the existing rolling arrangement on a goodwill basis.
This should also strengthen her case should it go to court. 

Why should she offer anything on a goodwill basis?  She does not think she owes any fee and the agent did no work at all to deserve any such fee.

1 - It's called a settlement? They are obviously concerned that they will have the hassle of legal proceedings - even if they believe they will win.
2 - They are very vague about the actual contract wording - it's possible since the tenants are still in property (using the existing tenancy agreement without a break) it could be deemed to be a type of renewal. 

So if a tenant decided to stay for one more month on a rolling contract and then move out you think the landlord  should pay £1000 to the agency.
If the tenants are using the existing tenancy agreement it is not a renewal and cannot be as the periodic tenancy has no end date 
This is what Shelter say
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/renewing_your_private_tenancy
Your tenancy becomes a periodic tenancy automatically if you stay past the end of the fixed term without a renewal agreement

Kindly don't put words in my mouth as it would depend what contract has been agreed to.
It's the original tenancy that has rolled over, it's not a new tenancy agreement.

I have already mentioned what the contract says.  The original tenancy technically was not rolled over as a SPT is a new tenancy.  This seems to be what is unanimously mentioned by other board members so it appears your opinions are perhaps just made up?  What are you basing your opinions on exactly?

PaulW922

itwasntme001 said:

Thanks.  So if she lost and she pays on time, she would not have ever had a CCJ against her name?  I ask because some employer checks questions ask whether you have ever had a CCJ even if settled.

To clarify previous answers, if this happens she can definitely, 100% say she has never had a CCJ. The point of the 30 days period is not to give debtors one final chance as such, but to allow for a situation where a debt is disputed, a court makes a judgement and all sides accept the outcome. 

unforeseen

From https://www.landlordzone.co.uk/information/periodic-tenancy-mean-new-tenancy-every-month/

The periodic tenancy rolls on indefinitely if the parties wish it to. Interestingly, a determination in a test case (Superstrike Ltd v Marino Rodrigues 2013)1, contrary to what many in the industry believed at the time, a statutory periodic tenancy is a new and distinct tenancy, not a continuation of the tenant’s previous fixed-term status.