Sold car to dealer - threatened with legal action

EosSeller

Hi all,
Looking for some advice. I privately sold a 2011 VW Eos with 48000 on the clock via Motorway.co.uk a couple of weeks ago. Noted all known defects in the listing, including paintwork chips, small dents and scuffed alloys.

An offer was made by a dealer in the Midlands (will avoid specifics for now) for £4,150. They arranged to come and collect the car from my home (I live in Kent). The car was collected late last week. 

The person who came was not the buyer but their “driver”. This person checked the roof function, the climate control, looked around the exterior and tyres and took the car for a brief test drive. They never opened the bonnet. On return this person called the buyer and said all was OK and it ran well, except that the rear brake pads needed doing and there was some paintwork defects, which meant I and the buyer negotiated down to £3,900. The full balance was transferred by the buyer by BACS and the car was low loadered away. I informed DVLA straight away of the change in keeper. No receipts were signed by either party. 

A few hours later I get a call from the buyer to say once the car returned to the Midlands, they did another test drive, got a mechanic to run diagnostics and found a fault with the turbo not boosting, and asks me what “we” need to do about it. I tell them I will speak to Motorway as they brokered the sale in an attempt to mediate. Motorway tell me to cease contact with the buyer so I block their number. 

The next day I start receiving withheld number calls, calls from other numbers, emails, Whatsapp calls and Whatsapp messages (and before 8am the day after that). I do not engage with the buyer. The contents of the written messages accuse me of being a conman who is ripping them off, and they talk about returning the car and wanting a full refund. I have no intention of taking the car back as legally I don’t have to and the buyer could have changed anything on the car since owning it. I also feel like I owe them nothing. 

I maintain I knew nothing of the turbo fault as I am not at all mechanically minded. I only owned the car for 7 months and did only 3000 miles in it, mostly all town driving. The service history I was provided with made no mention of any problems. In any event the buyer’s representative was given the chance to inspect the vehicle and did say to the buyer that all was well, hence the transfer of the agreed price. 

The day after being called before 8am, my old car without warning appears outside my home address on the back of the same low loader that took it away, and the driver of the low loader starts banging on my door to demand I come out and sort the matter “amicably”!!! Could have been the same man who picked the car up but I don’t remember. Naturally I call the police and after 90 minutes the man is removed from site under threat of arrest should they return. I receive another email saying that my listing mentioned no mechanical faults, threatening court action that will prove “expensive” for me, and that they have a solicitor’s appointment booked for this week. I haven’t heard from them since. 

Of course after this incident I am now very safety conscious and more afraid to conduct normal daily life. I live with my elderly father who owns the property; he was assaulted by this man when he tried to lock the outer door and the person who drove down was verbally cautioned by the police for that. The fact that someone took the bother to drive 200 miles to confront me at my door on a Sunday morning is intimidating to say the least. I had no way of knowing if this person came down alone or with backup. 

Should the buyer’s appointment have gone ahead, in my view any solicitor should look at the overall story and tell their client that their chances of winning are slim at best; as a trade seller buying from private a lot more due dilligence should have gone ahead, and particularly after what happened outside my home. I feel I have strong grounds after what happened with the calls, messages and at my home address for a counter claim for harassment, distress and defamation of character should they decide to proceed. I have photo and video evidence of the man lurking around my front door and shouting at me through the window, and he was also smart enough to knock on all the neighbour’s doors and alert their attention to what was happening, and I know I can ask them for witness statements. I already know he told neighbours that he knew where I worked. 

Naturally I don’t want this to end up in court; I know that if proceedings are started it is best practice to attempt ADR first which buys time but to be honest I could do without the stress of it. Does anyone have any advice on how best to proceed? 

Would the buyer stand any chance of getting anything in the end? 

Many thanks in advance,
EosSeller

prowla

A dealer didn't do due diligence and check the car out.

JustAnotherSaver

So Joe Bloggs sent his mate to look at the car and now he's whinging that it isn't what he wanted?

If he's happy to lose out on a few grand then that's his choice. If i was shelling out that money on something then i may have someone with me who can do something i can't or know something i don't but you best believe that i'll be there in person.

In what way was your dad 'assaulted'? I'd be doing these for anything i could and go fire-with-fire so would reporting them for assault only lead to a "don't do that again please sir"? Or are you going down the route of "we don't want to inconvenience and just want this to be over"? I'd be taking the assault as far as i could. I'm happy to admit i could be wrong - i usually am, but i would've thought it could go further than "mind your future conduct please".

EosSeller

JustAnotherSaver said:

So Joe Bloggs sent his mate to look at the car and now he's whinging that it isn't what he wanted?

If he's happy to lose out on a few grand then that's his choice. If i was shelling out that money on something then i may have someone with me who can do something i can't or know something i don't but you best believe that i'll be there in person.

In what way was your dad 'assaulted'? I'd be doing these for anything i could and go fire-with-fire so would reporting them for assault only lead to a "don't do that again please sir"? Or are you going down the route of "we don't want to inconvenience and just want this to be over"? I'd be taking the assault as far as i could. I'm happy to admit i could be wrong - i usually am, but i would've thought it could go further than "mind your future conduct please".

That is exactly how it was. I was surprised the guy who came wasn’t the buyer. I sure as hell would never buy a car without looking at it and I’m not in the trade! 

When he went to shut and lock the outer door the man outside grabbed hold of him to try and stop it, so not a serious assault, but a common assault all the same. 

I think it would certainly convince a civil judge that the intentions of the man’s visit were anything but pleasant. Right now I’m only really looking to avoid any financial losses myself. My Dad has no desire to press charges.

Grumpy_chap

As a private individual you sold your car to a trade garage purchaser.

The garage is deemed to be the subject matter expert and to do their own due diligence, which they did and even negotiated you down by £250 from the agreed price before the expert buyer completed the due diligence.  (That may prove to be the best £250 you never had in the highly unlikely event this were to go to court - which I doubt it will.)

These sound like scammers and nothing more to me.  A professional garage would not be sending the "heavies" around and acting in such an unprofessional manner as al this behaviour would go against them in any legal case the garage may try to pursue.  You have done the correct thing in reporting the events to the Police, and you should continue to keep a log of any events.

You should also provide a report to the internet middle-company of what is happening and continuing to happen.  They may not be any assistance, but may stop this "garage" from remaining on their site, so protect others. It is also worth checking the T's&C's with the internet site as to whether there is any cover they afford you in this type of circumstance.

Another thing that does not seem right is that you are in Kent and the purchaser is in the Midlands.  They sent a "driver" to get your car and drive it back to the Midlands on a low loader (is that correct, or did the "driver" drive the car back to the Midlands?).  Then identified a fault with the turbo - not sure what that would cost to fix.  The cost of bringing the car back from the Midlands on a low loader, and then another "thug" sent to intimidate you again.  I doubt all this time is being spent travelling down (and bringing the low loader) from the Midlands, as that is disproportionate cost to a garage repairing a turbo, if there is actually a turbo fault (which may not have been present when you last had control of the car).  It is possible that the purchasing garage "in the Midlands" is not actually in the Midlands at all.

Where is the car now?

The advice that Motorway gave is probably sound, in that just ignore the buyer and await their Solicitor to make contact.  I doubt that will happen.  In the mean, time keep logging any contacts by any means, just don't respond.  Keep prints or screen dumps of texts / WhatsApp etc incase they are deleted from the other end.  

This whole thing must be pretty awful to live through.  A remote scammer 200 miles away is one thing - a scammer that turns up with the "heavies" is quite another.  Good luck getting it sorted.

EDIT - I'll add in light of other posts that I don't think it is uncommon for trade buyers (garage owners) to buy a car 'unseen' - that is really what they do at auction...

EosSeller

To Grumpy_chap,

I may well not be the first person they have tried this on. It seems the buyer has no concept of reputational damage and the effect a loss of a claim could have on the continued security of their business. If they are so concerned about minimising loss the vehicle can always be flogged on to We Buy Any Car or similar; I valued the car last night with the faults they claim added to what I reported and still came back with a £2,500 offer. 

Motorway have been kept informed of all the developments; they tell me they have contacted the buyer to express how much they do not condone what occurred at my home address, but what else they have told them I don’t know. I have encouraged them to review their continued relationship with their client as a result of this situation. One thing I would say about Motorway for anyone interested is that they can be quite pushy before a sale is finalised and then not quite available enough when you want things from them afterwards when things go wrong such as proof of listing or their T&C’s. A little more transparency in the aftersales side could do them a lot of good. 

The person who collected the car drove down from the Midlands with a lowloader van and drove the car onto it and drove the van back. The dealership has a proper website, legitimate premises, listing with Companies House and has good reviews on AutoTrader, but I am reluctant to name names at this stage in case it counts against me. 

Not sure exactly but it’s nowhere near me and I am not the current registered keeper. I fully intend to document all call logs and contacts made to assist me in any counter claim. Just hope common sense prevails and I can move on quickly. Many thanks for the support. 

Flight3287462

Why did you only keep the car 7 months?

Herzlos

Hunyani_Flight_825 said:

Why did you only keep the car 7 months?

They bought it just before lockdown and now it's nearly winter?

EosSeller

Herzlos said:

Hunyani_Flight_825 said:

Why did you only keep the car 7 months?

They bought it just before lockdown and now it's nearly winter?

Precisely that. Bought it for a holiday in the Scottish highlands which got cancelled, already had another car, time to downsize now it’s out of season. 

Dr_Crypto

If a crime has occurred contact the police.
Tell them to stop harassing you and that if they don’t you’ll make a report to
the police of harassment.