Should we renegotiate

MamaBunny

Hi 👋 My partner and I are buying our 1st house together. We had an offer accepted on a house in July and due to the impact of Covid it has taken until now to finally receive our mortgage offer. Despite us being in the hands of our lenders, our seller, or more so their new home builders have been unrealistic with completion dates and I have been constantly hounded by the estate agents. The builders have apparently been very difficult with our sellers and have been applying pressure to have the sale completed. They have passed their completion deadline (which was plucked from thin air, before we'd even heard from our lender) and are pushing for a definite completion by the end of this month. Its all been really stressful and now we are facing another obstacle. 

The property was listed at £255,000, after a bit of to-ing and fro-ing a price of £250,000 was mutually agreed.  Our mortgage offer has just come back with a valuation of £246,000, however, they are still agreeing to lend us the full amount we applied for. I'm assuming because their risk is mitigated by our over 20% deposit, but ultimately the mortgage devaluation hasn't meant that we can't afford to buy.

So, my dilemma is deciding whether to try and negotiate a lower price for the property as we of course don't want to pay more than its worth, or whether doing this will risk the sale falling through due to impatient builders (Bellway Homes) and should I just concede the proposed mortgage valuation loss of £4,000? Is there another option I haven't thought about? 

Its worth mentioning that the property is very well presented,  and I'm not entirely sure that our lender hasn't just carried out a desktop valuation.  I am aware of another house on the street recently being advertised at £245,000, however, admittedly this house needed some redecorating and also had the family bathroom downstairs, although I'm not sure what the actual agreed sale price was as its now Sold STC.

The property we are buying isn't a rare and unusual find, other similar (maybe not as well presented) homes come up in the area regularly. Some are higher prices, some are lower, but all between £245 - £260.  Also, we're not looking at this as a forever home, maybe more of a 5-10 year option.  Who knows. 

As an indication to our mood on this, here's a few notes:
1. The sellers have refused to budge on the inclusion of integrated kitchen appliances, and are charging us £300 for the fitted dishwasher and fridgefreezer. (Lesson learned on including this when we offer in future). They are also removing all of the curtain poles as well as the kitchen light fixture. Although they are selling the living room curtains, which match the Statement wallpaper to us for £70, I'm guessing they'll be folded on the floor as the pole is not part of this purchase. 

2. The seller's solicitor has been obnoxious in his responses to our solicitor and has been unhelpful in answering some of our questions (asked to avoid a delay of proper investigation - eg. A quick question about the existence of a soakaway)

3. I have been in direct contact with the seller and have a level of rapport, but I am concerned that I am too easily manipulated and am often too soft or too nice for my own good.  I'm probably too worried about annoying her than I should be over such an important purchase. 

Ultimately, we're in unsettling times and I fear that we could overpay on a house which may drop in value further if a recession hits.  

So, any advice, guidance, shared experience welcome to help me decide on how to proceed with this. 

Thank you 😊 

Angela_D_3

£4,000 is !!!!!! all in the grand scheme of things. 
I mean yes definitely try and renegotiate but I wouldn’t loose any sleep or the house 

moneysavinghero

You agreed at £250,000.Your mortgage provider has confirmed that this is about right. Just pay £250,000 as agreed. Don't go messing your seller around for the sake of £4,000 (1.6%).

PassElephant

MamaBunny said:

Hi 👋 My partner and I are buying our 1st house together. We had an offer accepted on a house in July and due to the impact of Covid it has taken until now to finally receive our mortgage offer. Despite us being in the hands of our lenders, our seller, or more so their new home builders have been unrealistic with completion dates and I have been constantly hounded by the estate agents. The builders have apparently been very difficult with our sellers and have been applying pressure to have the sale completed. They have passed their completion deadline (which was plucked from thin air, before we'd even heard from our lender) and are pushing for a definite completion by the end of this month. Its all been really stressful and now we are facing another obstacle. 

The property was listed at £255,000, after a bit of to-ing and fro-ing a price of £250,000 was mutually agreed.  Our mortgage offer has just come back with a valuation of £246,000, however, they are still agreeing to lend us the full amount we applied for. I'm assuming because their risk is mitigated by our over 20% deposit, but ultimately the mortgage devaluation hasn't meant that we can't afford to buy.

So, my dilemma is deciding whether to try and negotiate a lower price for the property as we of course don't want to pay more than its worth, or whether doing this will risk the sale falling through due to impatient builders (Bellway Homes) and should I just concede the proposed mortgage valuation loss of £4,000? Is there another option I haven't thought about? 

Its worth mentioning that the property is very well presented,  and I'm not entirely sure that our lender hasn't just carried out a desktop valuation.  I am aware of another house on the street recently being advertised at £245,000, however, admittedly this house needed some redecorating and also had the family bathroom downstairs, although I'm not sure what the actual agreed sale price was as its now Sold STC.

The property we are buying isn't a rare and unusual find, other similar (maybe not as well presented) homes come up in the area regularly. Some are higher prices, some are lower, but all between £245 - £260.  Also, we're not looking at this as a forever home, maybe more of a 5-10 year option.  Who knows. 

As an indication to our mood on this, here's a few notes:
1. The sellers have refused to budge on the inclusion of integrated kitchen appliances, and are charging us £300 for the fitted dishwasher and fridgefreezer. (Lesson learned on including this when we offer in future). They are also removing all of the curtain poles as well as the kitchen light fixture. Although they are selling the living room curtains, which match the Statement wallpaper to us for £70, I'm guessing they'll be folded on the floor as the pole is not part of this purchase. 

2. The seller's solicitor has been obnoxious in his responses to our solicitor and has been unhelpful in answering some of our questions (asked to avoid a delay of proper investigation - eg. A quick question about the existence of a soakaway)

3. I have been in direct contact with the seller and have a level of rapport, but I am concerned that I am too easily manipulated and am often too soft or too nice for my own good.  I'm probably too worried about annoying her than I should be over such an important purchase. 

Ultimately, we're in unsettling times and I fear that we could overpay on a house which may drop in value further if a recession hits.  

So, any advice, guidance, shared experience welcome to help me decide on how to proceed with this. 

Thank you 😊 

Only once paid for an integrated dishwasher and cooker. They were filthy and didn't work. 

Jeepers_Creepers

The sums involved are trivial, and won't affect the value of the house whenever you come to move on. So, if this is the house for you, then I suggest just go with it.

But, man, these sellers are a-'oles. How mean?! How penny-pinching!

I'd certainly love to tell them where to stick their curtain poles, but obviously I'd do this only if I were backing out of the purchase... 

numbercruncher8

The thing is, if you declined to buy the appliances, what would they do with them? Chances are they would have been left anyway.

If you're having nagging doubts about the big picture, then paying £246,000 as opposed to £250,000 is not going to go very far into making you feel different.

I'd expect people will be giving you anecdotes instead of advice 'If you did that to me, I'd tell you to &&&& off' ,etc.... but truth is, not enough info here.

Recession doesn't really matter too much for house prices unless you intend to sell, but it is meaningful for your continued employment and consequently level of savings. If your job isn't going to be secure and/or you don't have a reasonable buffer it is prudent to not push the boat out too much.

If you're going to negotiate, IMO the greater power will be whoever needs it least. At this small level of discrepancy, I reckon the sellers would blink if it meant the difference between deal or no deal, but then it might also lead to petty revenge on completion.

Mickey666

The sellers have refused to budge on the inclusion of integrated kitchen appliances, and are charging us £300 for the fitted dishwasher and fridgefreezer. (Lesson learned on including this when we offer in future).

As ever, it depends how much you really want the property.  I'd also love to tell the vendors where to stick their poles.  Trying to sell integrated kitchen appliances is like trying to sell you the 'integrated' windows or the 'integrated' front door!

I wonder what their reaction would be if you refused their kind offer for the kitchen appliances and told them you'll be expecting them to remove them and take them when they move out

But hey ho, there's nowt as strange as folks.  I've heard of people taking all the lightbulbs and toilet rolls with them when they move out. 

Fortunately, not all sellers are !!!!!! holes - when we moved into our previous house the vendor had left us a bottle of champagne, flowers, chocolates and a card welcoming us into our new home.

leonj

If the valuation was 246k and they didn't even go inside, then that 4k difference can easily be accounted for and then some, the sellers will probably say the same thing.

Flugelhorn

what a gem! selling you the curtains but taking the curtain pole...
Trying to sell you the integrated appliances is a good one - think they might struggle to get them out on moving day

FreeBear

I'm assuming this is an older property you are buying - If it is more than say 30 years old, do consider getting a full survey done.

The older the property, the more likely it has been messed around with. Not all "improvements" are sympathetic to the building, and some could compromise the structural integrity - Thinking 1930s with a knock through lounge without building regs and minimal support...

maisie_cat

I'd be inclined to say that you no longer want the extras, chances are they'll leave them, has happened to me in the past because people run out of time. I have never tried to charge for an integrated or freestanding appliance, I've left them all in the last 2 moves.