First Steps to Solvency

monetxchange

Not going to diagnose, but definitely think it'll be worth talking through with your counsellor the stuff with your dad. It's funny you have loads of memories of your dad being a mess in your youth, but just your mum doing nothing but mum stuff. In reality she was holding the entire family together and trying to make life stable for you. I wonder if this reflects on your view of your wife - it's got to be big and impactful or she's not playing a role. I don't think you'd want your son to grow up taking everything his mum does for him for granted and only having memories of dad kicking off over his car getting dirty or arguing with grandad etc. You are worth it, you've proved a lot to yourself and nobody else matters. You've come so far.

alt80

Decent family day in today so far just chilled, played with son and watched a Christmas film lol. Still not 100 with my foot definitely annoying not being able to get out much so def easy to sit speccing cars and looking at houses with wife and son gone for a walk with dog. Couple of tenants causing a few problems too lol.

I’m not really interested in money for the sake of it building up doing nothing. I like it for the things I can buy with it. Sometimes do think about giving up on the chase staying static, less work, more chill. Payback debts and once they’ve gone use spare income to buy some toys. Few more holidays, stay in current res home etc. Doesn’t excite me though. Still want the AM, the 7 figure house and everything else it doesn’t go away for me. Know I need to put the work in to get it and am doing this but also know I’m in danger of clearing this debt and just starting the next cycle - it becomes a need it now scenario, wake up one day and think f**k it can pay for it later. Terrifies me that I’m going to do that at some point and it really be one step too far everything comes crashing down - main reason I’m on the debt journey and trying to work out how to be more sustainable for the future. Catch 22.

Sounds bad but whilst I like the family time, no buzz compares to that day I get the keys for new res home / brand new car etc. Always been houses and cars for me. Will agree it’s short lived, always the next thing and the thing after I know contributes to never satisfied. I get the same big highs from buying houses to rent/ flip too and when things are happening business wise it makes me feel untouchable absolutely love the feeling of the money rolling in so not just the spending on myself but that’s why I do it no doubt.

I’m addicted to it - I know its mad not great for my family as I’d rather be working or buying stuff but when I’m trying to pretend I’m not bothered about buying stuff and making the money to get it I find other highs in things more destructive chasing the same hit. Don’t want to wind up doing blow everyday or getting into casinos. Could see how I could become one of those people far too easily and don’t want to hurt my family like that. Read so many articles about how to stop doing stuff for a high but don’t like the answers that basically revolve around stop feeding the monster.

Know it’s not fair on my wife. She has stuff she likes too but can’t really blame her as she can take it or leave it. Lot of pairs of shoes and lip fillers to add up to the stuff I get off on anyway.

ryanm8655

katsu said:

Morning @alt80.  It's fabulous seeing how far you've come from your first postings.  I've talked about you with Mr Katsu and thought a lot about your situation. 
We don't know your wife but you said "Wife has said before she doesn’t think she’d feel at home anywhere bigger don’t get that at all. Probably just says it because she thinks I’m not good enough to get it.".
If you think that's really true,  I really think you are wrong. Just because you don't understand why your wife might think or feel that way,  that doesn't mean she's lying to you or that she thinks you aren't "good enough" at what you do.  
I'm another person whose life you'd probably find surprising. I'm a high earner (employed not SE), with an unambitious partner on a much lower income,  living well below our means in an ordinary house in a working class area. Mr katsu and I often laugh about what our neighbours must think we earn as our money isn't out on display.  When we did some big works the other year, someone in the area assumed our house had been sold to new owners!

We like having "stealth" money. We feel amused when people assume we must have a lower income as we don't need them to be impressed by our achievements. 

 Our decision to pay the mortgage off early (got our initial 30 years paid off in 12) and do everything from savings not spending was a conversion we came to over the years.  I don't think you need to live like us and I don't think our life is better than yours will be when you've got debt free. What I hope might be interesting for you is another perspective on a high earning life. 

My goal was to be secure,  to own our house and have savings. It gives me freedom, an "F-off" fund. I don't feel trapped in my job.  If I want to walk away any time,  I can.  I've worked with too many execs who had to earn big money to pay for the house, horse, school, wife lifestyle,  their lifestyle etc. I watched the desperation in a nice guy who had a wife like yours who didn't work but who had very expensive horse and lifestyle costs. It put him under a lot of pressure and affected his decision making at work as he was desperate to keep earning to keep his house of cards from falling down.  He couldn't get off the treadmill and is still making some dumb choices because he can't think clearly. His wife really seems to love his wages more than him. I don't think that's true about yours. 

So maybe there's a thought that your wife is an asset not a hindrance? She doesn't burn up as much cash as she could and she's not another stressor,  but maybe someone who can support you if you and she grow closer on this journey? 

I won't lie,  I've thought at times that if Mr katsu earnt what I earn, our life would be amazing (I actually have no idea what we'd do with all the money over years and years). But he wouldn't be Mr katsu. He's the laid back one that balances my drive and has the time to spend with me when I'm not working and I want him to hang out on my schedule. Having him home when I'm home and not having to accommodate two demanding jobs is really helpful.  He's not as good at housework as Mrs alt80 though 😂 And I don't think he'll every take over washing my car! 

This post made me smile.

I don’t think I would ever live in the way you do,  I’m a you only live once kind of guy and the things I enjoy involve spending money (though I never want to be in debt again) but I can completely appreciate your way of thinking and love the fact you chuckle at those who assume you’re struggling because you choose to live a more humble lifestyle. Love it.

getmore4less

A lot of your buzz come from the delusion it is impressing others.

Some of the rest of the buzz seems to be the chase of paying for it.

Very little from the actual spend.

Very little from what you actualy buy. 

No wonder the buzz wears off very quickly. 

alt80

Managed 20 minute walk and came home. Seriously thinking about seeing doctor about my foot now. Wife thinks I’m being silly and just need to be more patient. Slowly getting better but hurts walking, hurts driving and son being silly running around wanting me to chase after him made me smile at least. If this is what being old is like FML.

Not a bad winter afternoon toasted marshmallows over fire and made a Christmas hot chocolate not gonna lie helped wife put a couple of strings of lights up on gable of garage, few decs inside the house and ordered the tree £94.99 delivered. Yeah I know 100% cheesy haha but I’m enough of a child to enjoy this type of stuff. Entertainment budget blown but groceries not close so might still just about be able to balance the books with having bought the tree. Next year should have some kind of money for Christmas stuff.

@KxMx Yeah she’s got a low opinion of me lol definitely has issues with her self confidence obsessed with her looks. Tbf she’s getting better with that and quite glad she’s ditching the fake look. 

Don’t think she’s lying to me as such just think she doesn’t want me feeling any worse than I already do iyswim. 

Definitely have impossible to satisfy standards though. 

@getmore4less Gaming terms - haha yes lol that is basically where my life is right now. Really frustrating.

Suppose a lot now is about impressing others - don’t need a bigger house now just want one. Do want it for the house itself but its fussy reasons nothing that really matters just extra car storage for cars I don’t have any could actually store at my commercial and a bit of a high ornate ceiling fetish not gonna lie. 

Definitely get a buzz from making money too yeah to pay for my lifestyle I suppose.

Not sure how to keep the drive but leave the need for highs behind though or end the acquiring stuff highs without getting my thrills from other more destructive stuff that gives me a similar buzz.

@tjp70 Never stopped lusting after all of it. Wife is getting into the whole self improvement kind of stuff - all do what makes you proud of the way you’ve spent your day and a better person rather than focusing on stuff / image. House spotless right now and she’s started taking on an original built-in cupboard in the dining room. 

@ryanm8655 You’re probably right idk. Suppose I do partly think I’ll prove I can get the 7 fig res home less about parents turning up don’t think they would. Tbf where I grew up if it were converted to a house it’d be worth over £1M these days and my dad was 42 when we moved there. Bit different being their livelihood too but my dad thinks I’m doing well in life. Doesn’t sounds great re you not seeing your mum again but a few of the things you’ve written on here I can see why. 

I find the not working stuff odd tbh. Probably is my upbringing tbf. My mum is the hardest worker I know - 6am-11.30pm every single day apart from two weeks when we went on holiday, the odd day at the races but that was business (pub days out) and one day in December when she used to have the day off to take me and my sister to London spent a stupid amount of money from takings she hid from my dad lol. Still works similar hours at 71 really do think that’s mental- I might plan to work at a similar age but what she does is graft not looking round a few buildings, making a few deals and dealing with staff / tenants. Dad is a hard worker too but never put the same graft in.

Think you’re right about trying to live like I’m single, spent a lot of years taking wife and son for granted - not something I’m proud of at all. You’re right no way could I cope with son for a week on my own haha. Enjoyed recent day out with him but massive sense of responsibility. Driving up the motorway thinking !!!!!! I really am a dad. Yeah I know only took 7 years FML. 

@ladyholly Don’t think I’ve denied I struggle with the respect side sometimes. Spent a lot of time feeling a bit trapped because I care about her very much but feel she has taken the p*** with the not working etc. Yeah know I went along with it. Tbf you’re right she does a lot I’m very lucky and have an easy life in someways shouldn’t take for granted in the way I do. 

FIL is a nightmare again you’re right I should try to make an effort to have a civil relationship. Managed it Halloween over zoom lol was a lot more pleasant for everyone.

@enthusiasticsaver Haha yeah you’re right about what I mean. Not as bothered about that as I used to be bit shallow really tbf. I do want to give my son a much more secure upbringing than I had and am doing that but yes different life goals to wife definitely she just wants a boring life - exercise, cleaning, some clothes/ beauty stuff and family holidays would go every time son off from school if she had a say and we had the money haha. I like a holiday once / twice a year and she can do the rest so she’s happy anyway.

Tbf you’re right about the res home. Not going to lie I’m concerned about the next 1-5 years generally. 100% reliant on property in some way or another said before to you I know I should be more diverse but am not.

@Retireinten My wife has always been a lot calmer than me, likes the lifestyle but doesn’t need it lol. 

Actually one of major things in this journey so far has been working to the budget. Hate it. Do it in business always have but that’s business and easy because it’s not personal - it’s not you’re not good enough it’s just the right thing to do for the company at that point in time.  

Yeah I know I could probably have the 7 figure house if everything else had been sacrificed. Would still have my old RRS and 911 be better off. Son wouldn’t be at school he is actually have a lot of guilt over that he loves it there and whilst I don’t see it being vfm I don’t want to take him out now know it’s given me a massive commitment though. 

Hard to get driven to pay for stuff already bought haha got it a bit do want to clear debts. Measure net worth in businesses love seeing the figures going up generally part of what’s tortured me about the panic remo tbh. I couldn’t care less about net worth in personal life though for me it just means I’m paying stuff off rather than getting anything new and probably having a boring time lol.

@ZaSa1418 well wife wants to pay this place off in full not release any money for portfolio or move. Stupid imo to have all that equity doing nothing - get’s it from her dad haha. 

@katsu I’m with Ryan your lifestyle not for me but if you’re happy with your ‘stealth wealth’ good on you. Do know what you mean about the pressure though tbf not gonna lie I fall into desperately needing the income. Agree wife could have more expensive hobbies lol. Gives me an easy life in some ways definitely and not going to pretend she doesn’t hold me up because she does.

@monetxchange You’re right about my mum 100 hardest worker I know that was my point always working hard putting everyone else first still does. I’ve actually got many fond memories growing up don’t think my son will have that much to smile about tbh his life is quite boring really but also don’t think that’s a bad thing either. Definitely don’t want his only memories of me to be kicking off do get far too angry and definitely trying to work on the anger.

enthusiasticsaver

alt80 said:

@ZaSa1418 well wife wants to pay this place off in full not release any money for portfolio or move. Stupid imo to have all that equity doing nothing - get’s it from her dad haha. 

The equity isn't doing nothing.  It provides a roof over your head.  I expect she is looking for the security of knowing she cannot lose her home given your Dads history and her worries about you taking on too much debt.  Not unusual to want to be mortgage free.  

alt80

@enthusiasticsaver If I’d paid the res home off not moving. I could refinance at 75LTV and buy 10-12 BTLs with no PGs. Absolute no brainer and not about remoing the res home for stupid stuff. She just doesn’t get why I want more property lol. Dream would be portfolio in the hundreds. Thousands probably stretching it.

NorthernSoulSouthernLife

I’ve thought long and hard before I write this post but perhaps it might add some reality & perspective about where your wife is coming from. I haven’t read your whole diary so forgive me if I make unfair assumptions, I’ve been reading along since October.

Please believe your wife when she says she doesn’t want gifts, it’s not about being nit picky and trying to make you feel guilty she just personally doesn’t value them as highly as she would Value spending quality time with you ..... you have different ‘love languages’ and perhaps you BOTH should invest some time into really understanding what makes each other feel loved. 
You mention that your wife keeps nagging you or bringing up snarky comments re the debt, I promise this isn’t her trying to put you down, she is scared, terrified even of your current financial position. The average person has a fear and respect for money/ debt which you appear not to have. My husband was exactly the same, He would live in the moment spending as If we earned Infinite amounts of money and If the hard cash wasn’t in our pocket a credit card would do just the same job.  We had a successful business so for years it worked out ok. Then we fell pregnant after 10 years of being told it wasn’t possible, out little miracle, all I’D ever dreamed of. I then got Ill needing to have brain surgery whilst pregnant , baby came 5 weeks prematurely & I almost died whilst having her. 3 days after getting home my husband needed life saving abdominal surgery lost 3ft of his colon and was left with a stoma at 39 !!! So here we were brand new Parents to a premature baby both recovering  from life saving surgery unable to Run our business properly, in debt upto our eyeballs ( much of which my husband had kept from me, but I found out about whilst he was in intensive care on a ventilator For 3 weeks). 

Our house of cards collapsed dramatically we lost our business , our home & our cars. 

I went from holidaying in the Maldives At £15k+ a week, to using food banks To feed myself and put nappies on our baby. I’d spent years donating food to the food bank boxes in Waitrose to suddenly needing to find my local one and use it.
my husband like you was addicted to spending but suddenly with absolutely no route to access any money to get that ‘fix’ , he became addicted to prescription pain meds which the GP suddenly stopped. His mental health deteriorated and on Christmas Eve 2019 the very worst happened ... he took his own life .
He died believing I didn’t love him ... I loved him more than life itself , I hated Some of the choices he’d made, lies he’d told but I 100% LOVED him !!! 

On the day he died there was 36p left in his bank account, we had no life insurance policies ... you see when you are struggling to feed yourself insurance doesn’t even get a look in. So with an 18 month baby I found myself totally alone, bankrupt living in temporary accommodation eating from a food bank .......THIS IS WHAT YOUR WIFE IS SCARED OF !!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

You are a risk taker , you ‘gamble’ (for want of a better word) your Families security and safety net To get your next big boys toy!  

What would happen if you got sick  Or your wife got sick? 

Your wife will ‘fight’ you she is trying to get you to see the light , I did the same with my husband too , I failed and he lost his life and I carry that everyday for the rest of my life, I am falling apart but have to pull it together for my little girl.
Dont Let this  !!!!!! Narrative that you tell yourself about needing to level up  be the legacy you leave behind for your family, they just want YOU!!! 

There is so much in what I read in your diary that is a reflection of my old life . It’s not healthy for you , your wife or your boy, your anger & need for a ‘buzz’ ... it could be my husband writing this diary.

Your wife is getting stronger , she will start to set boundaries that work towards keeping her and her boy ‘safe’ These boundaries will hurt you but will be a necessity for her wellbeing and yours. Try not to inflict more pain on each other, you need each other xxx

TheAble

It's not a no-brainer. You'd be risking what you have and need for what you don't have and don't need. That's just crazy. You say it's not for stupid stuff, but with all due respect, stupid is exactly what it is.

lostmyusername

Is your wife names on the deeds?