Should I appeal my PIP Decision?

Spoonie_Turtle

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Well, I knew it might happen but I was optimistic - I'm in the same boat as you now. Didn't get a copy of the report yet but just today got the decision letter with 0 points daily living and a mobility distance plucked out of thin air (still no award), with the justification for everything being a load of balderdash. Oh, and no diagnosed conditions apparently - a shame my body didn't get that memo (!). I thought requesting a copy of the report would give me a few weeks' notice at least to prepare an MR if needed, but oh well. Such is life.

This is terrifying... when people who understand the assessment criteria and benefit well and being wiped out in a poor assessment... sorry to hear it. My worst nightmare is losing PIP right now and I'm 6 weeks since I returned the forms and 6 weeks from a critical Visa application when I need it. Good luck with what I presume will be challenging the decision...

Thank you. Yes, definitely challenging the decision. I was actually wrong, because it took me about 3 rereads to understand the different pages of the letter, they actually awarded 4 points DL because apparently I can cook and shower every day as long as I sit down!! But the Blue Badge itself and the LCWRA award based on mobility should have been clues that I can't actually walk 50m ... *rollseyes*

I hope it goes well for you, there are people getting the right award from the start so you might be one of them it is very possible to prepare for the worst whilst still having hope that it will go the way it should.

Best of luck.... I know that panic looking trough these reports or decision details and sometimes not seeing the wood for trees. I used my previous WCA report from last year as it directly details some relevant claims regarding PIP... so yet again troubling your award circumstances regarding LCWRA seems to have had no impact. My problem if I did lose entire award (which admittedly is much less likely than likely I'd say) I would not have time to appeal.. and it increasingly looks likely I wouldn't even have time for  a reconsideration before all damage would be done...wife/carer gone. The timing is perilous. I wish I could take some stress off you.. because it don't think it'd make much difference to me at the moment..lol. Have confidence in yourself... 

Thank you, that's very kind. I am confident I'll gt the right award eventually, I'd just rather it be sooner and less brainpower than later! For me the most important one was the LCWRA and that went absolutely swimmingly so I really can't complain. The PIP and subsequent Carer's Allowance would free up Mum to be able to give up or change her (very part-time but frequently physically and mentally stressful) job so I'm more determined for her than for me really.

Will it matter if they haven't assessed you or made a decision by the time of the visa application?

Muttleythefrog

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Well, I knew it might happen but I was optimistic - I'm in the same boat as you now. Didn't get a copy of the report yet but just today got the decision letter with 0 points daily living and a mobility distance plucked out of thin air (still no award), with the justification for everything being a load of balderdash. Oh, and no diagnosed conditions apparently - a shame my body didn't get that memo (!). I thought requesting a copy of the report would give me a few weeks' notice at least to prepare an MR if needed, but oh well. Such is life.

This is terrifying... when people who understand the assessment criteria and benefit well and being wiped out in a poor assessment... sorry to hear it. My worst nightmare is losing PIP right now and I'm 6 weeks since I returned the forms and 6 weeks from a critical Visa application when I need it. Good luck with what I presume will be challenging the decision...

Thank you. Yes, definitely challenging the decision. I was actually wrong, because it took me about 3 rereads to understand the different pages of the letter, they actually awarded 4 points DL because apparently I can cook and shower every day as long as I sit down!! But the Blue Badge itself and the LCWRA award based on mobility should have been clues that I can't actually walk 50m ... *rollseyes*

I hope it goes well for you, there are people getting the right award from the start so you might be one of them it is very possible to prepare for the worst whilst still having hope that it will go the way it should.

Best of luck.... I know that panic looking trough these reports or decision details and sometimes not seeing the wood for trees. I used my previous WCA report from last year as it directly details some relevant claims regarding PIP... so yet again troubling your award circumstances regarding LCWRA seems to have had no impact. My problem if I did lose entire award (which admittedly is much less likely than likely I'd say) I would not have time to appeal.. and it increasingly looks likely I wouldn't even have time for  a reconsideration before all damage would be done...wife/carer gone. The timing is perilous. I wish I could take some stress off you.. because it don't think it'd make much difference to me at the moment..lol. Have confidence in yourself... 

Thank you, that's very kind. I am confident I'll gt the right award eventually, I'd just rather it be sooner and less brainpower than later! For me the most important one was the LCWRA and that went absolutely swimmingly so I really can't complain. The PIP and subsequent Carer's Allowance would free up Mum to be able to give up or change her (very part-time but frequently physically and mentally stressful) job so I'm more determined for her than for me really.

Will it matter if they haven't assessed you or made a decision by the time of the visa application?

makes me wonder just how vast the resources of mind etc are expended (often at cost of increased disability) to get to that point of the right decision. As I joke... most of my disabilities are caused by claiming benefits. On your question... yes a delay would be helpful... if I lost PIP after the Visa application (was processed?) then the only damage would be (temporary..?) loss of PIP... and in fact this application takes my wife out of immigration control so it would be the last time I need to face this 'be in receipt of PIP to avoid the financial requirements test'. Just imagine if I got an assessment by phone 2 weeks before application - virus anyone?

My advice to the Op of course is appeal... sorry to hijack the thread.

poppy12345

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Well, I knew it might happen but I was optimistic - I'm in the same boat as you now. Didn't get a copy of the report yet but just today got the decision letter with 0 points daily living and a mobility distance plucked out of thin air (still no award), with the justification for everything being a load of balderdash. Oh, and no diagnosed conditions apparently - a shame my body didn't get that memo (!). I thought requesting a copy of the report would give me a few weeks' notice at least to prepare an MR if needed, but oh well. Such is life.

This is terrifying... when people who understand the assessment criteria and benefit well and being wiped out in a poor assessment... sorry to hear it. My worst nightmare is losing PIP right now and I'm 6 weeks since I returned the forms and 6 weeks from a critical Visa application when I need it. Good luck with what I presume will be challenging the decision...

Thank you. Yes, definitely challenging the decision. I was actually wrong, because it took me about 3 rereads to understand the different pages of the letter, they actually awarded 4 points DL because apparently I can cook and shower every day as long as I sit down!! But the Blue Badge itself and the LCWRA award based on mobility should have been clues that I can't actually walk 50m ... *rollseyes*

I hope it goes well for you, there are people getting the right award from the start so you might be one of them it is very possible to prepare for the worst whilst still having hope that it will go the way it should.

Although LCWRA and PIP are different as you know there's some aspects of them that are simialar and this is one of them. I'd send your LCWRA award letter with the MR request as evidence, if you didn't already send it.

I'm assuming that you scored 2 points for each of those for using an aid? If they think you can reasonably use an aid, even though you say you need assistance then you'll score points for needing the aid, regardless of whether or not you use one. If an aid is of no help to you and it's assistance you need then you need to tell them why you need assistance and what would happen if you used an aid.

MR decision success rate has fallen in the last few weeks from 57% to about 34% so still higher than it was pre covid.

Good luck.

born_again

poppy12345 said:

MR decision success rate has fallen in the last few weeks from 57% to about 34% so still higher than it was pre covid.

Good luck.

Cynical side says that as things have started to get back to normal, so has the management pressure to not disagree with assessment's.

Wonder if they were doing them from home?

Hope Spoonie_Turtle get it all sorted at the 1st hurdle and does not require the tribunal. 

poppy12345

born_again said:

poppy12345 said:

MR decision success rate has fallen in the last few weeks from 57% to about 34% so still higher than it was pre covid.

Good luck.

Cynical side says that as things have started to get back to normal, so has the management pressure to not disagree with assessment's.

Wonder if they were doing them from home?

Hope Spoonie_Turtle get it all sorted at the 1st hurdle and does not require the tribunal. 

The HCP's have been working from home since lockdown began and are continuing to work from home.

Spoonie_Turtle

poppy12345 said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Well, I knew it might happen but I was optimistic - I'm in the same boat as you now. Didn't get a copy of the report yet but just today got the decision letter with 0 points daily living and a mobility distance plucked out of thin air (still no award), with the justification for everything being a load of balderdash. Oh, and no diagnosed conditions apparently - a shame my body didn't get that memo (!). I thought requesting a copy of the report would give me a few weeks' notice at least to prepare an MR if needed, but oh well. Such is life.

This is terrifying... when people who understand the assessment criteria and benefit well and being wiped out in a poor assessment... sorry to hear it. My worst nightmare is losing PIP right now and I'm 6 weeks since I returned the forms and 6 weeks from a critical Visa application when I need it. Good luck with what I presume will be challenging the decision...

Thank you. Yes, definitely challenging the decision. I was actually wrong, because it took me about 3 rereads to understand the different pages of the letter, they actually awarded 4 points DL because apparently I can cook and shower every day as long as I sit down!! But the Blue Badge itself and the LCWRA award based on mobility should have been clues that I can't actually walk 50m ... *rollseyes*

I hope it goes well for you, there are people getting the right award from the start so you might be one of them it is very possible to prepare for the worst whilst still having hope that it will go the way it should.

Although LCWRA and PIP are different as you know there's some aspects of them that are simialar and this is one of them. I'd send your LCWRA award letter with the MR request as evidence, if you didn't already send it.

I'm assuming that you scored 2 points for each of those for using an aid? If they think you can reasonably use an aid, even though you say you need assistance then you'll score points for needing the aid, regardless of whether or not you use one. If an aid is of no help to you and it's assistance you need then you need to tell them why you need assistance and what would happen if you used an aid.

MR decision success rate has fallen in the last few weeks from 57% to about 34% so still higher than it was pre covid.

Good luck.

Thanks, I've just checked the letter for that and it doesn't say anything about why it was awarded, although the report from that assessment did say about mobility. I can't walk 20m though so while those (BB and LCWRA) are arguments for a higher descriptor, they're not quite enough for what I should be awarded.

Aids do help but they don't enable me to do the activities daily (i.e. whenever I would need to) or in a reasonable amount of time; it is a tough one because a lot of the activities I wouldn't be able to do whenever needed even with assistance just due to fatigue and the cumulative effects of overdoing it. I would like to see the report though because it really sounded like the assessor was listening and taking on board what I was saying, and if she wrote the report accordingly then the decision ought to have been very different.

Interestingly one justification was that I have no specialist input so things can't be as bad as I claim, despite me explaining that I've been discharged from the only service that's supposed to help because I've finished active treatment and have come to the end of the follow-ups. Another justification was that I have no prescribed aids, but that's because I've bought everything I needed myself as the service that was supposed to help me didn't get involved until after I'd bought most things, and they are very against wheelchairs - despite it being my only option for doing anything outside of home (and, had I had a wheelchair sooner, I would undoubtedly be much less ill and rather more functional than I am now). Sorry, bit of a rant. It's just interesting that I sent the same evidence for both the WCA and for my PIP claim yet different views taken - one in which they believed me, and one in which they basically don't. Oh, and having attended mainstream school almost 15 years ago means my illness which developed after my school years cannot possibly affect my cognitive abilities now

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Well, I knew it might happen but I was optimistic - I'm in the same boat as you now. Didn't get a copy of the report yet but just today got the decision letter with 0 points daily living and a mobility distance plucked out of thin air (still no award), with the justification for everything being a load of balderdash. Oh, and no diagnosed conditions apparently - a shame my body didn't get that memo (!). I thought requesting a copy of the report would give me a few weeks' notice at least to prepare an MR if needed, but oh well. Such is life.

This is terrifying... when people who understand the assessment criteria and benefit well and being wiped out in a poor assessment... sorry to hear it. My worst nightmare is losing PIP right now and I'm 6 weeks since I returned the forms and 6 weeks from a critical Visa application when I need it. Good luck with what I presume will be challenging the decision...

Thank you. Yes, definitely challenging the decision. I was actually wrong, because it took me about 3 rereads to understand the different pages of the letter, they actually awarded 4 points DL because apparently I can cook and shower every day as long as I sit down!! But the Blue Badge itself and the LCWRA award based on mobility should have been clues that I can't actually walk 50m ... *rollseyes*

I hope it goes well for you, there are people getting the right award from the start so you might be one of them it is very possible to prepare for the worst whilst still having hope that it will go the way it should.

Best of luck.... I know that panic looking trough these reports or decision details and sometimes not seeing the wood for trees. I used my previous WCA report from last year as it directly details some relevant claims regarding PIP... so yet again troubling your award circumstances regarding LCWRA seems to have had no impact. My problem if I did lose entire award (which admittedly is much less likely than likely I'd say) I would not have time to appeal.. and it increasingly looks likely I wouldn't even have time for  a reconsideration before all damage would be done...wife/carer gone. The timing is perilous. I wish I could take some stress off you.. because it don't think it'd make much difference to me at the moment..lol. Have confidence in yourself... 

Thank you, that's very kind. I am confident I'll gt the right award eventually, I'd just rather it be sooner and less brainpower than later! For me the most important one was the LCWRA and that went absolutely swimmingly so I really can't complain. The PIP and subsequent Carer's Allowance would free up Mum to be able to give up or change her (very part-time but frequently physically and mentally stressful) job so I'm more determined for her than for me really.

Will it matter if they haven't assessed you or made a decision by the time of the visa application?

makes me wonder just how vast the resources of mind etc are expended (often at cost of increased disability) to get to that point of the right decision. As I joke... most of my disabilities are caused by claiming benefits. On your question... yes a delay would be helpful... if I lost PIP after the Visa application (was processed?) then the only damage would be (temporary..?) loss of PIP... and in fact this application takes my wife out of immigration control so it would be the last time I need to face this 'be in receipt of PIP to avoid the financial requirements test'. Just imagine if I got an assessment by phone 2 weeks before application - virus anyone?

My advice to the Op of course is appeal... sorry to hijack the thread.

Well precisely, and I can see why people don't have the energy to fight, especially people with family responsibilities and/or using all their energy to be able to keep working.

Oh good, in that case I shall hope for you that they either make a good decision or just don't get to you before your visa application!

born_again thank you.

Sorry OP for hijacking your thread! How's it going, have you submitted the requeat for an appeal?

poppy12345

"no specialist input" yup, that's one they throw at people quite often and would simple be thrown out of a ny Tribunal because it's complete utter nonsense. Many many thousand of people claim PIP without having any specialists imput... myself included.

Buying the aids yourself, can potentially be seen as a want rather than need but don't shoot me because i totally disagree with that complete nonsense.

Now you've had the decision, is seeing the report useful? possibly not but if this gets to Tribunal, you'll see it in with the "bundle" anyway. Although please don't get "sucked" into just concentrating on that report for the MR and Tribunal. As advised on a couple of threads here (as well as on the benefits forum earlier this evening) concentrating on that will not get you a PIP award.

Spoonie_Turtle

poppy12345 said:

"no specialist input" yup, that's one they throw at people quite often and would simple be thrown out of a ny Tribunal because it's complete utter nonsense. Many many thousand of people claim PIP without having any specialists imput... myself included.

Buying the aids yourself, can potentially be seen as a want rather than need but don't shoot me because i totally disagree with that complete nonsense.

Now you've had the decision, is seeing the report useful? possibly not but if this gets to Tribunal, you'll see it in with the "bundle" anyway. Although please don't get "sucked" into just concentrating on that report for the MR and Tribunal. As advised on a couple of threads here (as well as on the benefits forum earlier this evening) concentrating on that will not get you a PIP award.

Thanks, yes I think it's just out of curiosity more than anything at this point. I had to buy the aids myself because every GP appointment ended with 'increase the medication, we can't do anything else for you' so I didn't have any help or advice whatsoever for years (not even advice about pacing). I sort of see where they're coming from if you look at it just by itself, but they agreed I needed aids for those two activities so I don't know what the issue was with that anyway! Maybe mobility-wise, I don't know.

In the MR is it useful to address some of the relevant justifications in the decision letter? Obviously as well as pointing out which descriptors I should score and why.

Muttleythefrog

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Well precisely, and I can see why people don't have the energy to fight, especially people with family responsibilities and/or using all their energy to be able to keep working.

Oh good, in that case I shall hope for you that they either make a good decision or just don't get to you before your visa application!

born_again thank you.

Sorry OP for hijacking your thread! How's it going, have you submitted the requeat for an appeal?

Thanks..lol. 
The no specialist input is one that always worries me... narrow minded and flawed but I have in my mind the historic conditions database the DWP used for DLA and the sorts of expected impacts on disability and expected input from healthcare professionals that would be typical... so I tend to stress in the paperwork (and at assessments) that NHS options have been exhausted and my GP monitors for changes (or rather now my wife does) in my condition.

Oh and the mainstream schools (and university) has been used for me.... I'm mid forties and they too use it to say I have no cognitive or related issues.... it is extrapolation gone nuts... and misleading anyway. It's particularly frustrating when they expect your evidence of difficulties to be recent.... I'm not sure I could submit a 30 year old medical report on my mental health (if any such thing existed) and have them consider it as to indicate current mental health and associated disability.

Spoonie_Turtle

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Well precisely, and I can see why people don't have the energy to fight, especially people with family responsibilities and/or using all their energy to be able to keep working.

Oh good, in that case I shall hope for you that they either make a good decision or just don't get to you before your visa application!

born_again thank you.

Sorry OP for hijacking your thread! How's it going, have you submitted the requeat for an appeal?

Thanks..lol. 
The no specialist input is one that always worries me... narrow minded and flawed but I have in my mind the historic conditions database the DWP used for DLA and the sorts of expected impacts on disability and expected input from healthcare professionals that would be typical... so I tend to stress in the paperwork (and at assessments) that NHS options have been exhausted and my GP monitors for changes (or rather now my wife does) in my condition.

Oh and the mainstream schools (and university) has been used for me.... I'm mid forties and they too use it to say I have no cognitive or related issues.... it is extrapolation gone nuts... and misleading anyway. It's particularly frustrating when they expect your evidence of difficulties to be recent.... I'm not sure I could submit a 30 year old medical report on my mental health (if any such thing existed) and have them consider it as to indicate current mental health and associated disability.

Well exactly! Spot on, every single point.

The guidance does still encourage assessors and DMs to use their knowledge of illnesses and what would be expected. They should also know that treatment options are often exhausted regardless of functional disability.