Kiwi.com flights changed to earlier time

THEV1LL4N

I might have to book something close to the airport to pick the car rental up the next day.  However, taking those flights means that the 6 days effectively turns into 4 so I'm left with the dilemma of trying to see if I can be refunded and just head up in my own car which will take a lot longer and I'll probably feel exhausted driving just getting to Scotland.   But I will have the freedom to go and come back hen I want as opposed to getting to the airport for 3am to catch my return flight home.

Just left with a horrible dilemma and wanted to make this special for my fiancee.  We have both been through a lot this past year.  It's more than about money, it's also about the psychological and emotional impact this is having.

We are not the only ones in this situation.  I would still like to be a customer but have my flights changed.
;
What are my chances of getting a refund through he credit card company?  I know they will encourage me to speak to the travel agent first, which I have attempted and as yet had no response.

[Deleted User]

have you actually checked the terms and conditions of booking to see if a change of 11 hours is classed as a significant change? Thereby entitling you to a refund?   It is a possibility.  

sheramber

I can't see the credit card covering anything as a flight is available. 
 Are you able to cancel 
If your trip hasn't been canceled by the carrier(s), but you can't or don't want to travel, pick "Cancellation" and follow the instructions. 
if you can,  book  alternative  flights   direct with the airline at a time that suits and cancel with Kiwi.com

THEV1LL4N

sheramber said:

THEV1LL4N said:

Alan_Bowen said:

Were the original flights booked with Flybe, as you know they ceased flying completely in early March and another airline has taken over? A travel agent has no control over the new airline's timetable and regrettably, many routes have simply disappeared altogether. With only one flight a day, there really isn't much option, is there? If it is a decent hotel the night staff will check you in, either change your car rental to a new company or take the bus/taxi into Aberdeen and collect the car next morning. Some car hire companies offer an out of hours collection service for an additional fee, could be worth checking as it may be less than the cost of alternative transport.
I am sorry to say your biggest mistake was using kiwi.com they are a complete nightmare, and completely pointless for a simple point to point flight that will always be cheaper if booked directly with the airline. Kiwi.com. despite the name are based in Brno in the Czech Republic, they ignore all requests for help according to all recent reviews and should be avoided like the plague

Hi Alan,
Thanks for your response.

The airline company is LoganAir. There were several flights a day and they have disappeared with only one operating each day.
There is a local lockdown in the city of Aberdeen, so that is one area I'll need to avoid.  The car rental was at the airport so meant I would not directly be affected with their local lockdown.

I really do hope that they find some sort of solution and do something.  I would have been better off not going on honeymoon and just delaying it until next year when things would have calmed down.  I am shattered and completely burnt out with everything, only having 2.5 days off from work (another issue altogether) since March and I was looking forward to finally having some well-deserved time off and going somewhere remote to the Scottish Highlands.  I hope Kiwi.com can put me on the flights I want at the very least.

Have you checked that the flights you want are operating.  There may only be that one flight each day now.

Yes, these are available at present.

What are my chances of getting a refund or a voucher if they change the flights to something unsuitable?  Kiwi are expecting me to pay for a new ticket it seems (if those flights are still available) and the honest thing here is I cannot afford to pay again.  I have requested that they offer a better resolution given the circumstances and occasion or offer a full refund.

bagand96

You don't mention when you are travelling, but Loganair are only showing one flight a day BHX-ABZ in September and October. So when you say you want to change flights, are you looking at changing the dates?

Couple of things to establish:
- is it a time change or a cancellation? Has the flight number changed? If so then it's a cancellation and you are definitely entitled to a refund. 
- if it is just a time change you may still be able to move flights/dates. Loganair T&C's state you can have a change or refund when there is a significant change. They don't however specify what counts as significant. 

Loganair may well be open to moving you onto different flights, given that 11 hours on both flights is quite a change. The problem you have is the agent being useless. Not sure what to advise on this other than keep getting at them, do they have a phone number? Or social media presence?

I would also try speaking to Loganair.  As they've said they might not be able to edit the booking but they may well talk to you and at least explain your options. That would be a start. 

Next time don't use an agent. Book direct with the airline. 

Alan_Bowen

This was an original Flybe route, Loganair took it on in June and there is only one flight a day so the arrival time cannot change, you can obviously change the day of travel but that will cost, and probably a lot more when you add the fees that Kiwi.com will add. Talk to the car rental office in Aberdeen and see how much they will charge for an out of hours collection, Europcar charged me £50 last year, it might still be cheaper than staying an additional night in a hotel

THEV1LL4N

bagand96 said:

You don't mention when you are travelling, but Loganair are only showing one flight a day BHX-ABZ in September and October. So when you say you want to change flights, are you looking at changing the dates?

Couple of things to establish:
- is it a time change or a cancellation? Has the flight number changed? If so then it's a cancellation and you are definitely entitled to a refund. 
- if it is just a time change you may still be able to move flights/dates. Loganair T&C's state you can have a change or refund when there is a significant change. They don't however specify what counts as significant. 

Loganair may well be open to moving you onto different flights, given that 11 hours on both flights is quite a change. The problem you have is the agent being useless. Not sure what to advise on this other than keep getting at them, do they have a phone number? Or social media presence?

I would also try speaking to Loganair.  As they've said they might not be able to edit the booking but they may well talk to you and at least explain your options. That would be a start. 

Next time don't use an agent. Book direct with the airline. 

Hi, thanks for your response.  Have only just read this now but that's exactly what I have done (contacted the airline separately to gain a little more clarity).

11 hours for each flight in my view is quite a significant change as that's the difference between day and night, which cut my trip two days short, impact other plans and a combined 22 hours total.  On paper, it may not seem that bad but in practical terms that would be quite significant.

• Loganair stated that I would be entitled to a full refund but I would need to arrange this via Kiwi (expected)
• Kiwi advised a refund would be a voluntary cancellation and that I would have 3 different refund options (free-assisted, priority-assisted and an instant refund) with the latter being like £8.

"Please be advised that since your flight is still confirmed and the time was only moved, if you wish to cancel the reservation, this will fall under voluntary cancellation."

I also requested a flight change initially, which they are offering to try to secure for me if that is something I am still interested in but I think I am past that point now and just want my money back as a full refund and go back to the drawing board regarding honeymoon plans.  The reason being: I would have to pay the full cost of a new ticket (with a EUR 10 discount credit applied (something like £8).  I personally find that to be an insult and what's to say that this doesn't happen all over again and it costs me even more emotional distress and financial loss?  It's just not worth it in my honest opinion.

I am all for supporting the economy and various organisations, but it needs to work both ways now more so than ever.  I know it is a tough time for airlines and other industries but the relationship and experience should be one that builds trust leaves a good impression on the consumer.  I expressed that Kiwi's handling of the situation made me feel financially exploited, feeling trapped/coerced and raising my anxiety further because the solution offered comes at a huge cost to me while still having the possibility of going tits-up again.  And on that basis, I find it hard to view it as a resolution.  Next time, I will go direct with the airline.

bagand96

THEV1LL4N said:

bagand96 said:

You don't mention when you are travelling, but Loganair are only showing one flight a day BHX-ABZ in September and October. So when you say you want to change flights, are you looking at changing the dates?

Couple of things to establish:
- is it a time change or a cancellation? Has the flight number changed? If so then it's a cancellation and you are definitely entitled to a refund. 
- if it is just a time change you may still be able to move flights/dates. Loganair T&C's state you can have a change or refund when there is a significant change. They don't however specify what counts as significant. 

Loganair may well be open to moving you onto different flights, given that 11 hours on both flights is quite a change. The problem you have is the agent being useless. Not sure what to advise on this other than keep getting at them, do they have a phone number? Or social media presence?

I would also try speaking to Loganair.  As they've said they might not be able to edit the booking but they may well talk to you and at least explain your options. That would be a start. 

Next time don't use an agent. Book direct with the airline. 

Hi, thanks for your response.  Have only just read this now but that's exactly what I have done (contacted the airline separately to gain a little more clarity).

11 hours for each flight in my view is quite a significant change as that's the difference between day and night, which cut my trip two days short, impact other plans and a combined 22 hours total.  On paper, it may not seem that bad but in practical terms that would be quite significant.

• Loganair stated that I would be entitled to a full refund but I would need to arrange this via Kiwi (expected)
• Kiwi advised a refund would be a voluntary cancellation and that I would have 3 different refund options (free-assisted, priority-assisted and an instant refund) with the latter being like £8.

"Please be advised that since your flight is still confirmed and the time was only moved, if you wish to cancel the reservation, this will fall under voluntary cancellation."

I also requested a flight change initially, which they are offering to try to secure for me if that is something I am still interested in but I think I am past that point now and just want my money back as a full refund and go back to the drawing board regarding honeymoon plans.  The reason being: I would have to pay the full cost of a new ticket (with a EUR 10 discount credit applied (something like £8).  I personally find that to be an insult and what's to say that this doesn't happen all over again and it costs me even more emotional distress and financial loss?  It's just not worth it in my honest opinion.

I am all for supporting the economy and various organisations, but it needs to work both ways now more so than ever.  I know it is a tough time for airlines and other industries but the relationship and experience should be one that builds trust leaves a good impression on the consumer.  I expressed that Kiwi's handling of the situation made me feel financially exploited, feeling trapped/coerced and raising my anxiety further because the solution offered comes at a huge cost to me while still having the possibility of going tits-up again.  And on that basis, I find it hard to view it as a resolution.  Next time, I will go direct with the airline.

It sounds a ridiculous situation.  You have an airline saying then will offer a refund (or presumably a rebooking onto suitable flights) yet the agent won't do it.  All Kiwi need to do is contact Loganair and process the refund/rebooking.  Instead it seems like they want to just process it a customer "voluntary" cancellation and refund you €10.

The problem is when you book via an agent you're stuck with the agent between you and the airline.  Kiwi.com is based in the Czech Republic, I've tried to decipher their T&Cs but they have to be some of the most confusing and vague I've ever seen.  They talk almost exclusively in terms of the Kiwi.com "Service Package" you chose when booking.  I can see nowhere where it simply says what happens if the airline cancel or change your booking.  It's a minefield.

Not sure what to suggest other than:

a) throwing yourself at the mercy of Loganair and seeing if they would be prepared to change your flights to the ones you want without reference to the agent.  It's very rare, but it can be done, where there's a will there's a way.  I don't think you'll get them to refund you directly, due to the payment arrangements with an agent.
b) Try your card provider for a chargeback or section 75 claim.  I don't know if this would be successful or not to be honest.  But if you have written proof from Loganair that you can have a refund but Kiwi.com are refusing to facilitate it you may have an outside chance.  That said, Kiwi would likely defend it quoting something in their T&Cs (which as I've said I can't make head nor tail of).

I think your best hope is pleading with Loganair to change the flights for you.

THEV1LL4N

Yes, it is a ridiculous situation.  Kiwi will rebook the flights onto an alternative date provided that I pay for the cost of a new ticket less the credit (like £8).  So that could set me back another £400.  But then I am tied down into the emotionally draining scenario of "will they, won't they change the flights again?"

I have emailed Logainair to obtain formal written confirmation from them re: eligibility for a refund, which I can then forward onto Kiwi.com or the credit card company to process.

Alan_Bowen

There is no guarantee Kiwi.com will do anything other than try and charge you again for something that should be free and people only find agents like this by searching Skyscanner or some other website that earns all its money from advertising by dodgy agencies like this. Whatever you do, do not pay another penny to Kiwi, you may have paid double the airfare in the first place for the pleasure of dealing with them