fire and rehire

Thrugelmir

Karen1980_Lily said:

Thanks for the replies so far.. it seems that the company are saying unless they agree to the new conditions..
an extra 3hrs on the working week with no pay,
losing holiday entitlement of 2 to 4 days,
his contracted hours to be from 8 to 4 moved to 6am to 11pm
no overtime as paid at basic 7 days a week.

they will then do redundancies if people can't agree to these terms and the people left will have the accept them.

He's been told that as they are offering a contract all habit massively inferior there will be no redundancy option if they don't want to sign for it. 

it's really confusing..  I don't understand how it's legal to force inferior working conditions into propel. he's worked for the company's 15 years.

I would have thought it was reasonable to argue unfair dismissal especially as the business conditions have not been a result of covid. The union seem to think they wouldn't win as the company is still offering some kind of employment.

What do you believe is the catalyst then? The business has suffered in some form. 

Karen1980_Lily

Thrugelmir said:

Karen1980_Lily said:

Thanks for the replies so far.. it seems that the company are saying unless they agree to the new conditions..
an extra 3hrs on the working week with no pay,
losing holiday entitlement of 2 to 4 days,
his contracted hours to be from 8 to 4 moved to 6am to 11pm
no overtime as paid at basic 7 days a week.

they will then do redundancies if people can't agree to these terms and the people left will have the accept them.

He's been told that as they are offering a contract all habit massively inferior there will be no redundancy option if they don't want to sign for it. 

it's really confusing..  I don't understand how it's legal to force inferior working conditions into propel. he's worked for the company's 15 years.

I would have thought it was reasonable to argue unfair dismissal especially as the business conditions have not been a result of covid. The union seem to think they wouldn't win as the company is still offering some kind of employment.

What do you believe is the catalyst then? The business has suffered in some form. 

They are saying they are losing customers in the selling of gas and electricity side of the business. The husband is an installer and they make The company profit, as does the service department. 
I've no idea whatbthey don't just pull out of selling gas and electricity, there's no value add service..  I am not fussy who i buy mine from...

Xbigman

One thing that jumps out at me from your list of changes is the massive increase in daily hours. If that is correct it must mean less days per year worked. In that case the loss of some holidays could work out fairly neutral. 
Or could those be some sort of flexible hours?
If your husband has been working on an hour or two each day to finish off jobs at an enhanced rate of pay (overtime rate) I can see why his employer wants to stop that. In that case it looks reasonable to me, although if you've gotten used to the overtime you might see it differently. 


Darren

Karen1980_Lily

Xbigman said:

One thing that jumps out at me from your list of changes is the massive increase in daily hours. If that is correct it must mean less days per year worked. In that case the loss of some holidays could work out fairly neutral. 
Or could those be some sort of flexible hours?
If your husband has been working on an hour or two each day to finish off jobs at an enhanced rate of pay (overtime rate) I can see why his employer wants to stop that. In that case it looks reasonable to me, although if you've gotten used to the overtime you might see it differently. 


Darren

My husband doesn't do any over time, that's one thing that wouldn't make a difference to him.. The extra 3 hrs a week will add up though.. 
The decision from the members is next week so I'm sure we will find out soon enough...

gwynlas

I do not beleive it is a massive increase in hours simply that they will be required to work their hours within those times thus avoiding fixed shifts and payment of overtime. The same terms normally stated for salaried staff who are required to work to suit the needs of the business. Your husbands length of service would be good if he were offerred redundancy but the union is quite rightly looking at the saving of as many jobs as possible whether employees have been there fifteen years or fifteen weeks.
If he does not accept then he will find himself out of a job, if he is really unhappy with the changes then he can look for another role. it is often easier to move from one job to another without a break rather than from being unemployed, The new normal apparently is to have a series of jobs throughout your working life rather than the old job for life clocking up long service.

Karen1980_Lily

gwynlas said:

I do not beleive it is a massive increase in hours simply that they will be required to work their hours within those times thus avoiding fixed shifts and payment of overtime. The same terms normally stated for salaried staff who are required to work to suit the needs of the business. Your husbands length of service would be good if he were offerred redundancy but the union is quite rightly looking at the saving of as many jobs as possible whether employees have been there fifteen years or fifteen weeks.
If he does not accept then he will find himself out of a job, if he is really unhappy with the changes then he can look for another role. it is often easier to move from one job to another without a break rather than from being unemployed, The new normal apparently is to have a series of jobs throughout your working life rather than the old job for life clocking up long service.

His working week is definitely increasing by 3hrs. then in addition they can have their set hours anytime between 6am and 11 at night 
.It seems pretty clear from all the posts that there is nowt that can be done other than as you say sign the contract, get a new job and string out some sickness due to stress before he goes! (he won't do that but it certainly give it a thought! )

Thrugelmir

Karen1980_Lily said:

gwynlas said:

I do not beleive it is a massive increase in hours simply that they will be required to work their hours within those times thus avoiding fixed shifts and payment of overtime. The same terms normally stated for salaried staff who are required to work to suit the needs of the business. Your husbands length of service would be good if he were offerred redundancy but the union is quite rightly looking at the saving of as many jobs as possible whether employees have been there fifteen years or fifteen weeks.
If he does not accept then he will find himself out of a job, if he is really unhappy with the changes then he can look for another role. it is often easier to move from one job to another without a break rather than from being unemployed, The new normal apparently is to have a series of jobs throughout your working life rather than the old job for life clocking up long service.

.It seems pretty clear from all the posts that there is nowt that can be done other than as you say sign the contract, get a new job and string out some sickness due to stress before he goes! (he won't do that but it certainly give it a thought! )

Sickness record will be a factor if redundancies ensure. Unless you've confident of finding employment easily. Burning ones own bridges isn't worthwhile.