Paid childminder fee during lockdown but childminder now closed business. Help please!

LouMitt

Hi 

Wondering if anyone could help us in regards to where we stand with this. Any advice would be a huge help!

During the coronavirus pandemic we were unable to send our children to their childminder as we were not keyworkers and were furloughed.

We spoke with our childminder and agreed we would pay a reduced payment (of over 50% of the usual fee) per month to secure our children’s places and enable her business to stay afloat during these difficult times as we wished to continue placing our children in her care as soon as we were able to.

Our childminder has since informed us she is no longer continuing with the business with immediate effect.

Where do we stand in regards to claiming back the amount paid for services not received? Payments were made voluntarily as we had a good relationship and wanted to secure their places going forwards and support her business. This was agreed (Verbally) prior to any government help scheme being made available.

Are we within our rights legally to request a refund? We have had conflicting info. Help!

Thanks in advance!

jonesMUFCforever

You can legally ask for a refund.
How did you pay?
Whether the business has any funds to repay you and everyone else is  a moot point.

Galloglass

How did you pay. Cash, standing order or credit card. You might have a chance with a CC though it will depend on the terms of the agreement. Otherwise small claims - though it will depend on the terms of the agreement.

This is more of an insurance question. Some forms of payment have inbuilt insurance e.g. CC. Some businesses have business interruption insurance, though small operations tend to self insure and wait for court claims to pay out. 

I'm guessing you paid by cash or cash alternatives, with no insurance in place.

Mrsn

Yes you can ask for the refund, your childminder has gone back on the terms agreed.

It might not be straightforward getting it but you will have the option of the small claims court if you can’t resolve it amicably.

silvercar

Mrsn said:

Yes you can ask for the refund, your childminder has gone back on the terms agreed.

It might not be straightforward getting it but you will have the option of the small claims court if you can’t resolve it amicably.

Totally agree with this.
Start amicably but speak with authority. You are sorry that she has closed, given you gave the payments in order to secure a place that is now no longer available when can you expect a refund?
If she fails to answer or evades then you need to write to her and say you expect the money to be refunded within 10 days or you will take legal action. You could add that if you need to take legal action she would be liable for your legal costs.
As a childminder she is unlikely to be registered as a separate company for tax purposes but operating as self employed, so she is personally liable to refund you.
Worth checking if you have legal insurance tagged on to your home insurance that could help with this.

Jonesy1977

Someone else had this type of query and I found the following link - it is Surrey CC so you would need to check with your own council if the childminder is registered.  https://www.surreycc.gov.uk/people-and-community/families/childcare/choosing-and-arranging/retainer-fees-and-deposits   It does look like childcare retainer fees are non refundable and not a payment for future services.  

GDB2222

Does she have any money with which to repay you? Otherwise, you are on a hiding to nothing pursuing her. Hopefully, you paid with a credit card?

phillw

Jonesy1977 said:

It does look like childcare retainer fees are non refundable and not a payment for future services.  

https://www.surreycc.gov.uk/people-and-community/families/childcare/choosing-and-arranging/retainer-fees-and-deposits

What happens if the childcare place is not taken up?

If the childcare provider is not able to offer the place under the terms of the contract or varies the terms and conditions of the placement without your agreement, then the retainer fee or deposit should be returned to you in full. If you decide not to take up the place, then the childcare provider may keep the retainer fee or deposit.

I expect this is not what the child minder thinks should happen & I'm not sure if you should accept legal advice from surrey council.

jimkelly

You can probably count on one hand the number of childminders in the country that will take credit card payments.

The majority will be cheques, bacs, government vouchers or cash in hand.

These "retainer" payments were in effect a deposit on places still being available at a future date.  They are therefore an agreement between the two parties, whether that be verbally or not.  There should be a paper trail as long as they weren't cash payments, so proving payments between the two parties should not be difficult.

I think the OP has a strong case for small claims court, but a strongly worded letter from a solicitor should suffice and I would expect they will very quickly want to resolve this as they will soon realise they don't have a proverbial leg to stand on.

silvercar

 Payments were made voluntarily as we had a good relationship and wanted to secure their places going forwards and support her business. This was agreed (Verbally) prior to any government help scheme being made available.

Thinking about this more, this possibly amounts to fraud. If she knew that she may not be able to keep her business afloat, yet still charged you to secure the places, that could be seen to be obtaining money by deception. If she had said to you that she may not be able to stay in business, but she would like you to pay her money in case she does, would you still have paid? Probably not. So by stating the payments were to keep places that could (and have) become non-existent, she was deceiving you into making payments.

LouMitt

jonesMUFCforever said:

You can legally ask for a refund.
How did you pay?
Whether the business has any funds to repay you and everyone else is  a moot point.

We paid via childcare voucher scheme through my husbands work. Money taken out of his wage tax free and put into childcare voucher account and then direct debit set up to pay childminder so there is a paper trail for proof of payments. 

We have been reasonable and offered she pay in instalments of which she can chose the amount she can afford but have been unable to resolve it amicably. 

She has since sent us a formal letter to explain why she feels she does not owe us any refund stating that we would only be able to request a refund had we cancelled the contract in March and also that she was following government guidelines. 

She has stated she has given us 4 weeks notice also but this notice period has not been worked as our children have not attended.

It was she who ended the contract with immediate effect. 

Thank you all for your replies. Very helpful.