Disabled Person on UC and Cohabiting

Spoonie_Turtle

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

KxMx

I think that figure probably includes the £20 per week rise which is temporary until April 2021?

Spoonie_Turtle

KxMx said:

I think that figure probably includes the £20 per week rise which is temporary until April 2021?

Yes, the original 2020/21 standard allowance was supposed to be something like £322 per month (can't remember the exact figure but within £1 either way).

Muttleythefrog

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

Thanks for your comment and the information you took the time to provide. I had been led to think that because I own my home I could not yet be moved across... but a new claim are you suggesting? And would that be possible and would it trigger a WCA? CAB say "You can choose to move onto Universal Credit at any time if you want to" - I must admit I had no idea of this and could have lost a lot of money as a result.... I imagine many have/are.

My calculations have suggested we would be better off now under U/C (even without the temporary 1 year increase) and that we'd be better off when my partner becomes eligible for public funds (likely towards end of this year). It was only before my partner moved in and I got SDP that it would have been beneficial to remain on ESA. So transitional protection doesn't seem an issue.

My pain is using the calculators because I have a partner with no recourse to public funds... so I have to use the calculator as single person and remove SDP to get current rate of ESA... now to get an updated figure for other scenarios..lol 

Spoonie_Turtle

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

Thanks for your comment and the information you took the time to provide. I had been led to think that because I own my home I could not yet be moved across... but a new claim are you suggesting? And would that be possible and would it trigger a WCA? CAB say "You can choose to move onto Universal Credit at any time if you want to" - I must admit I had no idea of this and could have lost a lot of money as a result.... I imagine many have/are.

My calculations have suggested we would be better off now under U/C (even without the temporary 1 year increase) and that we'd be better off when my partner becomes eligible for public funds (likely towards end of this year). It was only before my partner moved in and I got SDP that it would have been beneficial to remain on ESA. So transitional protection doesn't seem an issue.

My pain is using the calculators because I have a partner with no recourse to public funds... so I have to use the calculator as single person and remove SDP to get current rate of ESA... now to get an updated figure for other scenarios..lol 

That may have been the case when UC was first introduced (I don't know) but all it means nor is that you won't get help with housing costs and therefore your work allowance would be higher than if you claimed help with housing costs.

Once your partner becomes eligible the UC calculation would change to £594.04 standard allowance + LCWRA £341.92 (+ potentially carers element if your partner provides 35 hrs of care and you receive PIP or DLA). 
Any income or savings your partner has would then be taken into account and deductions made accordingly, if applicable.

Your LCWRA status should be added to the UC claim automatically and straight away, but in practice they tend to need a nudge and an explicit explanation that you're already in the Support Group and therefore have been assessed as having LCWRA as a result of your previous WCA. It *shouldn't* trigger another WCA but there's also no guarantee they wouldn't see it as a good opportunity to reassess you - however whilst things are on hold due to the pandemic, they may not bother.

This may help: https://www.understandinguniversalcredit.gov.uk/new-to-universal-credit/how-much-youll-get/ The site also explains how different forms of income are treated.
Also https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/Calculating-Universal-Credit

If you were to post on the Benefits board (explaining that calculators don't take into account your partner currently having NRPF) those who are more knowledgeable about the legacy benefits could give you a more certain answer re: different scenarios.

Muttleythefrog

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

Thanks for your comment and the information you took the time to provide. I had been led to think that because I own my home I could not yet be moved across... but a new claim are you suggesting? And would that be possible and would it trigger a WCA? CAB say "You can choose to move onto Universal Credit at any time if you want to" - I must admit I had no idea of this and could have lost a lot of money as a result.... I imagine many have/are.

My calculations have suggested we would be better off now under U/C (even without the temporary 1 year increase) and that we'd be better off when my partner becomes eligible for public funds (likely towards end of this year). It was only before my partner moved in and I got SDP that it would have been beneficial to remain on ESA. So transitional protection doesn't seem an issue.

My pain is using the calculators because I have a partner with no recourse to public funds... so I have to use the calculator as single person and remove SDP to get current rate of ESA... now to get an updated figure for other scenarios..lol 

That may have been the case when UC was first introduced (I don't know) but all it means nor is that you won't get help with housing costs and therefore your work allowance would be higher than if you claimed help with housing costs.

Once your partner becomes eligible the UC calculation would change to £594.04 standard allowance + LCWRA £341.92 (+ potentially carers element if your partner provides 35 hrs of care and you receive PIP or DLA). 
Any income or savings your partner has would then be taken into account and deductions made accordingly, if applicable.

Your LCWRA status should be added to the UC claim automatically and straight away, but in practice they tend to need a nudge and an explicit explanation that you're already in the Support Group and therefore have been assessed as having LCWRA as a result of your previous WCA. It *shouldn't* trigger another WCA but there's also no guarantee they wouldn't see it as a good opportunity to reassess you - however whilst things are on hold due to the pandemic, they may not bother.

This may help: https://www.understandinguniversalcredit.gov.uk/new-to-universal-credit/how-much-youll-get/ The site also explains how different forms of income are treated.
Also https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/Calculating-Universal-Credit

If you were to post on the Benefits board (explaining that calculators don't take into account your partner currently having NRPF) those who are more knowledgeable about the legacy benefits could give you a more certain answer re: different scenarios.

Thanks for the information. I've actually now made application so no going backwards. It is hugely stressful as don't want to make any errors and the information is poor I feel on some things like savings. I can't figure out if we divide our shared savings and give a share for each person or only input one total figure... confusing. I presume there is follow up with my wife too because although stated she is not British.. Irish etc they haven't asked questions sufficient to determine No recourse to public funds or not. The system does state partner here on Visa needs to be declared so I'm confident she needs to be set up and so has been. Unclear to me if she'll simply be discounted as a U/C claimant or included in the claim with no increased amount for couples (or the carer element) as is so with current claim for ESA.  The system does warn about fit notes being required... not clever of it... but yes hopefully they'll see my existing ESA claim and there'll be no WCA until due.

poppy12345

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

Thanks for your comment and the information you took the time to provide. I had been led to think that because I own my home I could not yet be moved across... but a new claim are you suggesting? And would that be possible and would it trigger a WCA? CAB say "You can choose to move onto Universal Credit at any time if you want to" - I must admit I had no idea of this and could have lost a lot of money as a result.... I imagine many have/are.

My calculations have suggested we would be better off now under U/C (even without the temporary 1 year increase) and that we'd be better off when my partner becomes eligible for public funds (likely towards end of this year). It was only before my partner moved in and I got SDP that it would have been beneficial to remain on ESA. So transitional protection doesn't seem an issue.

My pain is using the calculators because I have a partner with no recourse to public funds... so I have to use the calculator as single person and remove SDP to get current rate of ESA... now to get an updated figure for other scenarios..lol 

That may have been the case when UC was first introduced (I don't know) but all it means nor is that you won't get help with housing costs and therefore your work allowance would be higher than if you claimed help with housing costs.

Once your partner becomes eligible the UC calculation would change to £594.04 standard allowance + LCWRA £341.92 (+ potentially carers element if your partner provides 35 hrs of care and you receive PIP or DLA). 
Any income or savings your partner has would then be taken into account and deductions made accordingly, if applicable.

Your LCWRA status should be added to the UC claim automatically and straight away, but in practice they tend to need a nudge and an explicit explanation that you're already in the Support Group and therefore have been assessed as having LCWRA as a result of your previous WCA. It *shouldn't* trigger another WCA but there's also no guarantee they wouldn't see it as a good opportunity to reassess you - however whilst things are on hold due to the pandemic, they may not bother.

This may help: https://www.understandinguniversalcredit.gov.uk/new-to-universal-credit/how-much-youll-get/ The site also explains how different forms of income are treated.
Also https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/Calculating-Universal-Credit

If you were to post on the Benefits board (explaining that calculators don't take into account your partner currently having NRPF) those who are more knowledgeable about the legacy benefits could give you a more certain answer re: different scenarios.

  I can't figure out if we divide our shared savings and give a share for each person or only input one total figure... confusing.

It's total amount of savings you need to put.

Muttleythefrog

poppy12345 said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

Thanks for your comment and the information you took the time to provide. I had been led to think that because I own my home I could not yet be moved across... but a new claim are you suggesting? And would that be possible and would it trigger a WCA? CAB say "You can choose to move onto Universal Credit at any time if you want to" - I must admit I had no idea of this and could have lost a lot of money as a result.... I imagine many have/are.

My calculations have suggested we would be better off now under U/C (even without the temporary 1 year increase) and that we'd be better off when my partner becomes eligible for public funds (likely towards end of this year). It was only before my partner moved in and I got SDP that it would have been beneficial to remain on ESA. So transitional protection doesn't seem an issue.

My pain is using the calculators because I have a partner with no recourse to public funds... so I have to use the calculator as single person and remove SDP to get current rate of ESA... now to get an updated figure for other scenarios..lol 

That may have been the case when UC was first introduced (I don't know) but all it means nor is that you won't get help with housing costs and therefore your work allowance would be higher than if you claimed help with housing costs.

Once your partner becomes eligible the UC calculation would change to £594.04 standard allowance + LCWRA £341.92 (+ potentially carers element if your partner provides 35 hrs of care and you receive PIP or DLA). 
Any income or savings your partner has would then be taken into account and deductions made accordingly, if applicable.

Your LCWRA status should be added to the UC claim automatically and straight away, but in practice they tend to need a nudge and an explicit explanation that you're already in the Support Group and therefore have been assessed as having LCWRA as a result of your previous WCA. It *shouldn't* trigger another WCA but there's also no guarantee they wouldn't see it as a good opportunity to reassess you - however whilst things are on hold due to the pandemic, they may not bother.

This may help: https://www.understandinguniversalcredit.gov.uk/new-to-universal-credit/how-much-youll-get/ The site also explains how different forms of income are treated.
Also https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/Calculating-Universal-Credit

If you were to post on the Benefits board (explaining that calculators don't take into account your partner currently having NRPF) those who are more knowledgeable about the legacy benefits could give you a more certain answer re: different scenarios.

  I can't figure out if we divide our shared savings and give a share for each person or only input one total figure... confusing.

It's total amount of savings you need to put.

Yeah... but does it ask only once for it? I'm confused... every item in the to do list has had to be individually answered.. but the savings item? What I'm trying to avoid is them thinking we have double what we do..lol

Spoonie_Turtle

Muttleythefrog said:

poppy12345 said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

Thanks for your comment and the information you took the time to provide. I had been led to think that because I own my home I could not yet be moved across... but a new claim are you suggesting? And would that be possible and would it trigger a WCA? CAB say "You can choose to move onto Universal Credit at any time if you want to" - I must admit I had no idea of this and could have lost a lot of money as a result.... I imagine many have/are.

My calculations have suggested we would be better off now under U/C (even without the temporary 1 year increase) and that we'd be better off when my partner becomes eligible for public funds (likely towards end of this year). It was only before my partner moved in and I got SDP that it would have been beneficial to remain on ESA. So transitional protection doesn't seem an issue.

My pain is using the calculators because I have a partner with no recourse to public funds... so I have to use the calculator as single person and remove SDP to get current rate of ESA... now to get an updated figure for other scenarios..lol 

That may have been the case when UC was first introduced (I don't know) but all it means nor is that you won't get help with housing costs and therefore your work allowance would be higher than if you claimed help with housing costs.

Once your partner becomes eligible the UC calculation would change to £594.04 standard allowance + LCWRA £341.92 (+ potentially carers element if your partner provides 35 hrs of care and you receive PIP or DLA). 
Any income or savings your partner has would then be taken into account and deductions made accordingly, if applicable.

Your LCWRA status should be added to the UC claim automatically and straight away, but in practice they tend to need a nudge and an explicit explanation that you're already in the Support Group and therefore have been assessed as having LCWRA as a result of your previous WCA. It *shouldn't* trigger another WCA but there's also no guarantee they wouldn't see it as a good opportunity to reassess you - however whilst things are on hold due to the pandemic, they may not bother.

This may help: https://www.understandinguniversalcredit.gov.uk/new-to-universal-credit/how-much-youll-get/ The site also explains how different forms of income are treated.
Also https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/Calculating-Universal-Credit

If you were to post on the Benefits board (explaining that calculators don't take into account your partner currently having NRPF) those who are more knowledgeable about the legacy benefits could give you a more certain answer re: different scenarios.

  I can't figure out if we divide our shared savings and give a share for each person or only input one total figure... confusing.

It's total amount of savings you need to put.

Yeah... but does it ask only once for it? I'm confused... every item in the to do list has had to be individually answered.. but the savings item? What I'm trying to avoid is them thinking we have double what we do..lol

Oh, right, I forgot you had individual (linked) accounts - in that case just divide the savings in half, unless you have separate savings pots, or one of you put the whole lot on and the other put 0. Whatever makes the most sense for your situation.

One thing to be aware of is that under UC legislation you are liable to repay any overpayments even if THEY were the ones who made the mistake. So it's worth putting a message on your journal to makenit clear that you think your wife currently has NRPF, and if they pay you the couple's amount, keep back the difference between that and the single allowance until you know for certain whether it was a mistake or you can keep it.

Muttleythefrog

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

poppy12345 said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Argh, I typed a long reply and the internet ate it! *sigh*

@Muttleythefrog if you would be better off on UC then you can apply yourself, no need to wait to be migrated either by DWP or by a change in circumstances. If you are in the Support Group you may well be better off. Claiming UC would end any income-related ESA component, and the rest of your ESA would be deducted in full from your UC.

If you have no other income (e.g. pensions) or savings above £6000, you would be entitled to the standard allowance £409.89 + LCWRA element £341.92. (Should you be in a position to work at all and earn anything, you would have a work allowance meaning they wouldn't make any deductions from your UC award for the first £512 of what you earn.)

Even if the standard allowance of UC drops in April as planned (it was £317 pre-pandemic, and I think the original intended increase was to about £322 or something like that) the LCWRA element will not be affected.

Obviously if you would be worse off on UC then yes you should wait; if they move you over ('managed migration', not 'natural migration' due to a change of circumstances) then you would have transitional protection to make sure you're not worse off.

Thanks for your comment and the information you took the time to provide. I had been led to think that because I own my home I could not yet be moved across... but a new claim are you suggesting? And would that be possible and would it trigger a WCA? CAB say "You can choose to move onto Universal Credit at any time if you want to" - I must admit I had no idea of this and could have lost a lot of money as a result.... I imagine many have/are.

My calculations have suggested we would be better off now under U/C (even without the temporary 1 year increase) and that we'd be better off when my partner becomes eligible for public funds (likely towards end of this year). It was only before my partner moved in and I got SDP that it would have been beneficial to remain on ESA. So transitional protection doesn't seem an issue.

My pain is using the calculators because I have a partner with no recourse to public funds... so I have to use the calculator as single person and remove SDP to get current rate of ESA... now to get an updated figure for other scenarios..lol 

That may have been the case when UC was first introduced (I don't know) but all it means nor is that you won't get help with housing costs and therefore your work allowance would be higher than if you claimed help with housing costs.

Once your partner becomes eligible the UC calculation would change to £594.04 standard allowance + LCWRA £341.92 (+ potentially carers element if your partner provides 35 hrs of care and you receive PIP or DLA). 
Any income or savings your partner has would then be taken into account and deductions made accordingly, if applicable.

Your LCWRA status should be added to the UC claim automatically and straight away, but in practice they tend to need a nudge and an explicit explanation that you're already in the Support Group and therefore have been assessed as having LCWRA as a result of your previous WCA. It *shouldn't* trigger another WCA but there's also no guarantee they wouldn't see it as a good opportunity to reassess you - however whilst things are on hold due to the pandemic, they may not bother.

This may help: https://www.understandinguniversalcredit.gov.uk/new-to-universal-credit/how-much-youll-get/ The site also explains how different forms of income are treated.
Also https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/Calculating-Universal-Credit

If you were to post on the Benefits board (explaining that calculators don't take into account your partner currently having NRPF) those who are more knowledgeable about the legacy benefits could give you a more certain answer re: different scenarios.

  I can't figure out if we divide our shared savings and give a share for each person or only input one total figure... confusing.

It's total amount of savings you need to put.

Yeah... but does it ask only once for it? I'm confused... every item in the to do list has had to be individually answered.. but the savings item? What I'm trying to avoid is them thinking we have double what we do..lol

Oh, right, I forgot you had individual (linked) accounts - in that case just divide the savings in half, unless you have separate savings pots, or one of you put the whole lot on and the other put 0. Whatever makes the most sense for your situation.

One thing to be aware of is that under UC legislation you are liable to repay any overpayments even if THEY were the ones who made the mistake. So it's worth putting a message on your journal to makenit clear that you think your wife currently has NRPF, and if they pay you the couple's amount, keep back the difference between that and the single allowance until you know for certain whether it was a mistake or you can keep it.

lol... just clicking through it now... on the confirm details it gives a named person for the details or none where it seems related to neither. It does that with savings so I'm declaring full amount. Crikey this is a stressful process.. next the IDing... time for the footy instead I think.

Thanks for suggesting entries on journal... I think I'll put 2 or 3 for some clarifications!