Elderly Parents getting Ripped Off

xlnc99

Ok - thanks guys. Also just thinking i may as well do both GAS and Electricity switch now at the same time. The Electricity battle with SP will be a long one and i have just compared their prices to what my parents are paying to everyone else who is so much cheaper so cant afford to continue with SP. I will do both switch now and then fight SP separately by sending an email tonight, 

This is what CAB recommends after reading their website.

Gerry1

xlnc99 said:

Also just thinking i may as well do both GAS and Electricity switch now at the same time.

Remember to check whether separate suppliers are cheaper.

xlnc99

Yes thanks. I will do all the checks today and compare everything today and make a decision tonight on the best value one. Right now its time for a break in order to watch the final day football (big manutd fan).

Thanks for everyone's help and contribution on this thread, it has not gone unnoticed. 

I feel although we have solved one issue in the switching, the bigger battle will be the back and forth with SP so there is no doubt this saga will continue. I hope to carry on getting advice and help once the complaint goes intoday.

MWT

xlnc99 said:

 I hope to carry on getting advice and help once the complaint goes intoday.

Keep in mind that you don't have a complaint against SP, yet...

So far all that has happened is that your parents gave them the wrong meter readings and they billed accordingly.

This may end up as a compliant but it isn't there yet.

Start of with a careful explanation of the problem and see what they say...

niktheguru

Wow, I’m joining late to this party and just read through the last 28 pages. 

Several things spring to mind. Obviously it looks like the original poster is very new to this and not experienced in the energy game. Many users have been trying to help but lots of mixed messages and lots of abbreviations which have been confusing the original poster and changing her focus.

this scenario isn’t really helped by a lack of detail on a few important things such as
1. When exactly was this smart meter installed? (It sounds as though it was by a different supplier approx 2-3 years ago)
2. What was the final meter reading for the Meter with the previous supplier (as this is the ideal reference for opening meter reading with her current supplier) do her parents have that bill?
3. The fact that this liberty meter is one hell of a confusing meter with multiple readings. I’m not surprised this mess has happened!

4. The lack of clarity on when exactly a meter reader came and read the meter. 

Things can be broken down very simply. She just needs to find the “standing charge “and The “kWh unit rate” for her parents current tariff. Then find the first reading ever given to Scottish power. Now it sounds like she doesn’t have a bill with this. She needs to call them URGENTLY and ask for it.
that way all she needs to do is subtract the first reading from the latest reading and she will be able to calculate the cost of usage since they became a SP customer. She can compare that to all the direct debits/additional payments that have been made by her mother and will then be able to work out if they have over paid or under paid. (This is assuming they haven’t been on multiple tariffs with Scottish power over the last few years)

As many have pointed out the error is NOT Scottish power doing funny business or making a mistake. The error is unfortunately that your parents didn’t know how to read this excessively complicated meter and have been reading it wrong and giving incorrect readings (despite their best efforts At giving regular readings)
the main point the original poster isn’t realising is that there is a massive discrepancy in the reading for Jan 2020 and that is where she has been incorrectly billed due to her mum probably finally using the correct meter reading, rather than the previously incorrect readings. It is unlikely (tho not impossible) that there are errors in the earlier monthly readings (other than they were consistently read from a lower value), and she probably shouldn’t dwell on that too much, especially as she hasn’t got any actual bills for that period.

I would suggest that the original poster needs to do the following in this order:

1. Switch her gas urgently over to a new supplier. (I have used ebico and so energy and they are both excellent. So energy is much better for ease and customer service, Ebico is usually the cheaper But also has good customer service.) note down the unit rate and standing order for the new tariff you pick. Don’t obsess over the direct debit Amount as that’s meaningless. Look at the unit cost and the overall cost on you estimated annual usage (which from your screenshot is around 725 a year)

2. Contact Scottish power URGENTLY. Ensure your parents have given permission for you to speak to them on their behalf. Then call and explain that the January usage is outrageously high for their Normal usage Pattern and No extra usage occurred that month. Then explain you suspect it has occurred because a different meter reading from the complicated smart reader has been used after “someone” explained the correct way to read the meter. See if it can be sorted out amicably. You may need to register this as a complaint which may take a bit of time to resolve. It is imperative you contact them NOW and don’t continue to delay.
3. Try and get Scottish power to send you ALL the bills since you have been a customer with them. (You may need to look at all the monthly readings and payments as it looks like there has been a significant debt for some time) If you find this hard I’m sure one of us can look at all the bills and work this out for you.

4. I would suggest not switching the electricity until this matter has been sorted. They may be less willing to help you deal with this when you are not a customer. If you act fast with them then you may be able to sort it in the time that it takes for a switch to take place, but my feeling is that this will actually take some time to sort out, and because you are inexperienced And getting a bit confused by it all (no offence, it is a bit complicated/messy) it will take longer.

5. You need to sit down with your parents and seek ways they can make their house more energy efficient. They need to leave lights on less. If they insist on keeping lights on make sure you get an electrician in and change any halogen or fluorescent lights to led lights which are much cheaper to run. Sort out the heating and hot water timers, they are on far too long. Does the property have or need cavity insulation?

Also you mention the boiler was changed recently. Could it have been that prior to the new boiler that the old one was mega old and was really inefficient hence your gas bills were previously much higher and were contributing further to your high energy costs in previous years and thus may explain the debt accumulated then?

I hope some of this may have helped. It is definitely worth trying to get money back for that uncharacteristically high jan bill, likely due to the change in how the meter was read rather than actual change in usage. That needs to be sorted first, then try get your parents on a cheaper tariff, then changes in consumption need to be done as they are using a crazy amount of energy! 

Good luck.

Robin9

@niktheguru -  a good summary

I would like to go further back and try to narrow down the time in which wrong readings appear to have been used.

 The meter is dated 2014 so I presume was fitted by a supplier previous to SP.  I presume at that time it was actually operating in Smart mode - ie it was automatically sending readings back to the supplier (who was ?) That would have eliminated any confusion as to what button to press.

Did your parents switch to another supplier before becoming a customer of SP in 2018 ?  In which case the meter would have become "dumb" at that stage and required the parents to send readings.. As the readings that have been used are lower than what the Smart ones were I would have expected them to be rejected. 

Talldave

Agree with most of what @niktheguru says, particularly about not switching electricity until it's resolved. 

My disagreement point is the emphasis on the opening reading given to SP. If you don't know which register it was from, you're no better off. What you really need is the entire billing history from which it might be possible to reverse engineer the reading/register trail (it's what Excel was made for). This should be made easier because the elderly parents are probably creatures of habit with consistent energy use year in year out.

As an aside, I don't think the ludicrous complexity of the meter is down to it being "smart", the energy industry has a track record of totally ignoring usability stretching much further back.

xlnc99

MWT said:

xlnc99 said:

 I hope to carry on getting advice and help once the complaint goes intoday.

Keep in mind that you don't have a complaint against SP, yet...

So far all that has happened is that your parents gave them the wrong meter readings and they billed accordingly.

This may end up as a compliant but it isn't there yet.

Start of with a careful explanation of the problem and see what they say...

Yes 100% agree. When i mean complaint - i mean just that. Explanation. I will be sending it today via e-mail to SP and all the management team i.e CEO etc. Plan is basically to tell them to facts and that my mum is old, vulnerable with various medical conditions and is registered disabled. All true. Hopefully they should understand why the wrong digits were inputted

xlnc99

@niktheguru
thanks for the detailed summary. Around 2014 and yes different supplier. My mum thinks it was E-ON. I will ask my mum for the final bill of the previous supplier before she went to SP but its unlikely. I will try and get that today of E-ON. I will be calling SP and asking for the bills today from the START.

No issue with the new boiler or old boiler as they switched in OCTOBER and it is much more energy efficent. The old one was 20 years old but wasnt used as often. Cant see the old boiler being an issue as it hasnt been used since 2018 WInter time. Will need to check those bills.

Will follow your steps

xlnc99

Robin9 said:

@niktheguru -  a good summary

I would like to go further back and try to narrow down the time in which wrong readings appear to have been used.

 The meter is dated 2014 so I presume was fitted by a supplier previous to SP.  I presume at that time it was actually operating in Smart mode - ie it was automatically sending readings back to the supplier (who was ?) That would have eliminated any confusion as to what button to press.

Did your parents switch to another supplier before becoming a customer of SP in 2018 ?  In which case the meter would have become "dumb" at that stage and required the parents to send readings.. As the readings that have been used are lower than what the Smart ones were I would have expected them to be rejected. 

I believe the order was E-ON and then possibly one switch then it has been SP for the last 2-3 years. Ile get this confirmed