Gumtree Paypal Buyer Scam

Belousik

I just want to give a heads up for a potential scammer, whose name appears in Gmail as Mullen William and who comes with these two emails: mullenwillamjohn1969@outlook.com and muwilly1969@gmail.com 
When I was searching for his email online, I couldn't find any association with scam, but later as he emailed me back - it was clear that he is a scammer, so I wanted to give you a heads up, in case someone is going to search for this email online. 

I couldn't find any other place to share this: neither Gumtree, nor Action Fraud do not have a forum to give heads up for potential scammers.
I want to start this thread, so that others can share email addresses of potential fraudsters, because if someone does an email search in Google they will at least have something to work with. Sharing is caring.

What raised red flags in the message from the above person was that:

• I received a message within an hour of posting.
• His message did not come from a number, but from a name called ItsAllSavvy;
• The message did not include the name of the product requested;
• He asked me for the price of the item, when it was clearly stated in the ad;
• I was invited to email the person back, instead of having a live phone call. 

Taken all separately, these factors wouldn't raise much of a suspicion, but all together they at least raise some concern. So I emailed back to get more info on this buyer and asked him to state the exact product he wanted from me, so I could give him the price. I didn't give him clues as to what I have put online, neither any prices. Here is an email I received in response: 

"Thanks for the swift response, I am buying this for daughter and due to the nature of my job and location... I will not be able to come for inspection, am a very busy type as I work long hours every day, I have gone through your advertisement and I am satisfied with it.As for the payment. I can only pay via the fastest and secure way to pay online(PayPal) or via PayPal wire transfer to your bank account here.I have a private courier agent that will come for the pick up after the payment has been made...You can now send me your PayPal email so I can pay in right away and also include your address in your reply. If you don't have a PayPal account, you can easily set up one...log on to www.paypal.co.uk and sign up its very easy... I would have loved to talk to you on phone but I work full time, I await your reply asap.Cheers.
Mullen."
If you don't know the essence of this type of scam, it sounds quite good and also enticing to someone, who wants to sell their item quick (I had an Urgent tag on mine). But I went online to search, if buyers can be scammers, as I didn't know how they can operate. Here is what I found:

• You get an email supposedly from PayPal to say you have received the money;
• You give your item away to the courier;
• The monies are not on your account really, because the email was fake;
• You loose your item.

Maybe there are more variations to this type of scam. But mostly you will find that they:

• Can't talk to you personally because they are deaf, too busy, etc.
• Can't come personally to check the item because they live too far and are too busy, or are in a wheelchair, etc.
• Seem to be in a rush and don't ask any questions about the item
• In my case, he didn't provide me with his phone number
• Twice he avoided calling the product by name - "what are you actually buying?"
• Was checking Gumtree right when I posted the item and yet didn't have time to talk to me + had time to reply to my email

My reply to him was: 

"Hi again,
Unfortunately, I won't be able to do that. The Gumtree seller protection rules advise that all transactions should take place face-to-face with cash on hand." (I haven't received any reply to this )

And that is what Gumtree really says. Although you can can agree to PayPal transfer, but you have to make sure that money are on your account and are cleared (not pending) - not just because some email said so, and I wouldn't trust any email that is scripted similarly, and seem to be hurrying you into shipping your item asap or passing it to their "courier". 

If you go on a Gumtree website and click Safety at the very end of the website, then click Scams on the left, you will find a guide to safe PayPal transfers. (I would have posted a link, but am a newbie here, so am not allowed to post links yet).

If it sounds too good to be true...you know the drill. 

soolin

The reason there is no list of spam email accounts is that scammers will just move on to the next throwaway account so knowing their current email is not of any use. Also by responding you may just have added your details to a list of people who might be tempted to engage in conversation and might be worth trying again.

This is a very common potential scam, it's covered everywhere already and has been featured on the TV and in newspapers - those that are comfortable online would spot it immediately as a scam, the ones who fall for it and the same people who wouldn't bother reading scam warnings, or get so desperate to sell that they forget to use any common sense. 

We have been warning about this scam on here for years and years now in its various guises and we probably still get threads from victims every other month or so. 

I's unfortunate but no amount of warnings will stop people falling for these scumbag scams.

Spoonie_Turtle

Unfortunately any list then blackmarks genuine people whose names have been used by scammers.

Btw in your post you say you can agree to PayPal transfer, but with an obvious scammer you should just run a mile. You still shouldn't accept PayPal goods&services for something a third-party courier picks up even if it sounds genuine because you're only covered as a seller if you post it yourself to the address that shows up on their PayPal.

theonlywayisup

Far better to learn of the scam than recite an email.

Rosa_Damascena

Interesting...I had a request to post an item and was considering this via PayPal as it seemed the enquirer was not able to travel. I thought about it and apart from being too risky, the size of the item would have more that doubled the cost of the item! I daresay somebody will buy it eventually...

Spoonie_Turtle

Rosa_Damascena said:

Interesting...I had a request to post an item and was considering this via PayPal as it seemed the enquirer was not able to travel. I thought about it and apart from being too risky, the size of the item would have more that doubled the cost of the item! I daresay somebody will buy it eventually...

It depends - if you are posting it / arranging the courier (so they pay you including postage/courier costs, and you the seller sort out postal arrangements) that's fine. It's if they offer to send their own courier that you're inviting trouble.

gerdo

If he doesn't know what he's buying, play along. Put a couple of bricks in a box and then tell him his "purchase" is ready for collection.

Silvertabby

gerdo said:

If he doesn't know what he's buying, play along. Put a couple of bricks in a box and then tell him his "purchase" is ready for collection.

Problem with that is that you may get the bricks back.  Through your window.

angelinaballerina_3

Received a very quick response to my gumtree ad today. Very much along the lines of that quoted above. Wanted my bank details to arrange a courier pick up. Came in by WhatsApp this time. 

 Have rejected. They obviously hadn’t even looked at the picture as asked question which was obvious from the picture. 

soolin

angelinaballerina_3 said:

Received a very quick response to my gumtree ad today. Very much along the lines of that quoted above. Wanted my bank details to arrange a courier pick up. Came in by WhatsApp this time. 

 Have rejected. They obviously hadn’t even looked at the picture as asked question which was obvious from the picture. 

The fact that this scam is still ongoing after several years suggests some sellers are still falling for it unfortunately. 

knightstyle

I have bought and sold items on Gumtree using Paypal and someone like Hermes.  To protect both buyer and seller the seller needs to do a Paypal payment request with the item plus postage stated on it.  Buyer pays, seller sends with insurance for full value.  Job done and safe as it can be.