Stocks to Hold for Next Ten Years.

AnotherJoe

Thrugelmir said:

ŴAnotherJoe said:

Thrugelmir said:

London Stock Exchange, Roche, Coca Cola, L'Oreal, Nestle, Koninklijke DSM , RWE AG, Orsted A/S, Vestas Wind System, Avon Rubber. 

Wildcard: Nikola

IMO Nikola is the Theranos of the automotive market. 

Battery power has it's limitations. Other technologies are going to come into play in the future. 

Name Just one for automotive.

Old_Lifer

Hydrogen.     There are already hydrogen powered cars  and buses ( London has ordered some).

Ciprico

Share to watch...
Ceres Power 

Thrugelmir

123mat123 said:

Share to watch...
Ceres Power 

I was also considering ITN. Though has already performed exceptionally well over the past 5 years. 

BrockStoker

123mat123 said:

Share to watch...
Ceres Power 

Someone tipped Enphase Energy, Inc. (ENPH) on another board, if you're into Energy stocks - it's not my preferred sector to dabble in with stocks so I'm passing up.

Edit: Perhaps not such a good investment after all (just noticed this!):

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/hagens-berman-national-trial-attorneys-172500191.html

kinger101

Old_Lifer said:

Hydrogen.     There are already hydrogen powered cars  and buses ( London has ordered some).

I wasn't sure whether AJ's "name just one..." related to alternatives to batteries or limitations.  I suspect the latter as hydrogen was already alluded to when mentioning Nikola.

Personally, I'm skeptical about hydrogen.  Diesel has a density of 38.6 MJ/L.  The most energy dense form of hydrogen available has a density of around 10 MJ/L.  But the reality is most vehicles will use compressed rather than liquid hydrogen.  At around 350 bar, that gives about 2.5 MJ/L.  On a par with with best lithium ion batteries.  I would seem there's more room for battery technology to improve than hydrogen technology, though charging likely needs to be part of that solution.  But that seems a more tractable problem than the infrastructure that would be required for hydrogen, and the folly of needlessly wasting electricity to covert water to hydrogen (it's not 100% efficient) and then using even more to compress it when the electric motor already exists.

As an aside, I'd question the ability to innovate for any company the called itself Nikola some 11 years after Tesla was founded. But the lack of a credibility rarely seems a barrier to raising large amounts of money on Nasdaq with which to pay oneself handsomely.
 

Ciprico

Thrugelmir said:

123mat123 said:

Share to watch...
Ceres Power 

I was also considering ITN. Though has already performed exceptionally well over the past 5 years. 

I think ITM power.
1000% growth in 3 years...!

Thrugelmir

kinger101 said:

Old_Lifer said:

Hydrogen.     There are already hydrogen powered cars  and buses ( London has ordered some).

I wasn't sure whether AJ's "name just one..." related to alternatives to batteries or limitations.  I suspect the latter as hydrogen was already alluded to when mentioning Nikola.

Personally, I'm skeptical about hydrogen.  Diesel has a density of 38.6 MJ/L.  The most energy dense form of hydrogen available has a density of around 10 MJ/L.  But the reality is most vehicles will use compressed rather than liquid hydrogen.  At around 350 bar, that gives about 2.5 MJ/L.  On a par with with best lithium ion batteries.  I would seem there's more room for battery technology to improve than hydrogen technology, though charging likely needs to be part of that solution.  But that seems a more tractable problem than the infrastructure that would be required for hydrogen, and the folly of needlessly wasting electricity to covert water to hydrogen (it's not 100% efficient) and then using even more to compress it when the electric motor already exists.

As an aside, I'd question the ability to innovate for any company the called itself Nikola some 11 years after Tesla was founded. But the lack of a credibility rarely seems a barrier to raising large amounts of money on Nasdaq which which to pay oneself handsomely.
 

Cobalt mining will undoubtably come under close scrutiny again in the future. 

AnotherJoe

Old_Lifer said:

Hydrogen.     There are already hydrogen powered cars  and buses ( London has ordered some).

Hydrogen is dead for anything smaller than trucks and most likely for trucks also (we'll see in a few months when Tesla  start shipping their large truck in the USA and see if Musks promises stand up).

H2 is fundamentally 3x more expensive to run than direct electric into a battery, and 5-10x more expensive to put filling stations in. This is why its obsolete, economics. Shanghai alone has something like 10,000 electric buses. London has pointlessly spaffed a few million on maybe a dozen H2 buses.

As an aside H2 is also (currently) not "green" in that most is made by breaking down gas and releasing CO2. To make it without creating CO2  means using electricity to electrolyse it out of H2O and then reverse the process in a fuel cell into battery, losing something like 60% efficiency along the way, hence the 3:1 advantage direct electricity into the battery has. For buses its especially pointless since you know what mileage a bus will do so there's not even the canard that you can fill a tank in 5 minutes as opposed to 5 hours for a battery, since you recharge the batteries at night (using cheap electrity to boot).and the battery is sized to do a full days work.

Real possibilities for H2 are ships and maybe larger aircraft simply because batteries wont scale that way for a considerable time.

AnotherJoe

Thrugelmir said:

kinger101 said:

Old_Lifer said:

Hydrogen.     There are already hydrogen powered cars  and buses ( London has ordered some).

I wasn't sure whether AJ's "name just one..." related to alternatives to batteries or limitations.  I suspect the latter as hydrogen was already alluded to when mentioning Nikola.

Personally, I'm skeptical about hydrogen.  Diesel has a density of 38.6 MJ/L.  The most energy dense form of hydrogen available has a density of around 10 MJ/L.  But the reality is most vehicles will use compressed rather than liquid hydrogen.  At around 350 bar, that gives about 2.5 MJ/L.  On a par with with best lithium ion batteries.  I would seem there's more room for battery technology to improve than hydrogen technology, though charging likely needs to be part of that solution.  But that seems a more tractable problem than the infrastructure that would be required for hydrogen, and the folly of needlessly wasting electricity to covert water to hydrogen (it's not 100% efficient) and then using even more to compress it when the electric motor already exists.

As an aside, I'd question the ability to innovate for any company the called itself Nikola some 11 years after Tesla was founded. But the lack of a credibility rarely seems a barrier to raising large amounts of money on Nasdaq which which to pay oneself handsomely.
 

Cobalt mining will undoubtably come under close scrutiny again in the future. 

Usually by fossil fuel interests who ignore the problem closer at hand, which is that petrol refining uses a lot of cobalt and that literally just goes up in smoke, whereas that in batteries can at least be recycled.

In any case its already being phased out, the latest Made In China Model 3 has no cobalt. More will follow suit.  Non issue.