Conveyancing - tenants in situ

Eirene88

When going through conveyancing for a property, how do solicitors determine if there are tenants in situ? For example, if the landlord was not declaring rental income and did not disclose tenants to his solicitor, how would it come to light that the property was in fact tenanted (and notice not served)?

davidmcn

Solicitors don't determine whether anybody is in situ, as (unlike several of the other people involved in the transaction) they haven't visited the property. Why do you ask?

Slithery

Were there tenants when you viewed the property?

Thrugelmir

In answer to your question on a basic level. On completion day you attempt to move in you won't be able to! 

greatcrested

Eirene88 said:

When going through conveyancing for a property, how do solicitors determine if there are tenants in situ?

They listen when their client tells them there were tenants in occupation when the property was viewed.

Eirene88

Thanks all. I'm actually the tenant rather than the buyer in this situation. I have a messy tenancy situation already but it just crossed my mind today that the buyers possibly don't know I'm here and therefore also wouldn't know if I'd been served notice correctly or not. The property was vacant when they viewed, which was quite a long time ago, so I was just wondering about it, i.e. how would they know. It sounds like the answer is, unless the landlord has told them they probably don't know.

Eirene88

To clarify, I'm not planning to stick around and make life difficult, just wondering how my landlord has pitched this to them, as technically I'm here and, due to aforementioned complicated tenancy situation, I'm not even sure he can give me notice.

davidmcn

Eirene88 said:

It sounds like the answer is, unless the landlord has told them they probably don't know.

True. Though the landlord will be in (possibly very expensive) breach of contract if they exchange contracts and can't procure vacant possession for the completion date. All the solicitors can really do is advise their clients on the implications of the contract and the remedies available if things go wrong.

Eirene88

Thanks. That all makes sense. 

[Deleted User]

As per your other thread (in case anyone is wondering what 'complicated' means in this case:

Stop making an issue out of this. All you are achieving is creating a deteriorating relationship with the landlord.

His failure to protect the deposit is to your advantage. So just accept it and keep quiet.

1) he can not serve a valid S21 Notice to evict you. If he wants you to leave in September(or indeed any time after that if you stay) he will have to first return your deposit and then serve a S21 Notice

2) you can go to court to claim a penalty from him of 3 times the deposit for non-protection. You could do that tomorrow (but why cause a fuss now?). Or when you leave (less problems). Or indeed at any time in the next 6 years!

I would not discuss this with him further at this time. If he tries to evict you in the future, you can raise the matter then. If you want to claim the penalty in the future, you have plenty of time.

Now - what else has he not done? Did you receive

* an EPC?

* a gas report (if there's gas) - HSE?

* the government leaflet How to rent?

All legally required.

And out of interest, did you get an inventory, was it accurate, and did you sign it?

Now read:

Post 3: Deposits: Payment, Protection and Return.

Note - all the above assumes you are in England/Wales.

So you are in a very good position.  How are the other tenants doing?  This is a LL who in his mind thinks you are a lodger, which you aren't.  All you have to do is stay and wait it out.  Anyone can be nasty and bullying in a text.., if he actually does anything you call the police.  But I wouldn't expect him to.  I think his prospective buyers have a nasty surprise coming, most would want to do a second visit before exchanging.  If he does want you to leave early tell him he is breaking the TA you both signed and you will only move if your moving expenses are paid and make that a very reasonable sum.  LL's like this only learn through their pockets.

[Deleted User]

As has been said by others, it's not down to the solicitor to determine if there are tenant in-situ.  Buyers should view the property prior to exchange so at that point it should become obvious that there are tenants in-situ.  It is usual for the contract to state that the vendor needs to give vacant possession at completion so the vendor would be foolish to exchange without being able to guarantee vacant possession.  There are occasions when investors may want to buy tenanted properties so such a clause about vacant possession may not be included in the contract but that is certainly not the norm.  None of this is really any of your concern though.  The property being sold doesn't end your tenancy and you already know from your previous thread that your landlord cannot serve you a valid Section 21.  However, should your landlord come to you asking you to move asap because he needs vacant possession you could name your price to go quietly.