Self employed income support help

Jesterrmum1703

My partner is self employed as I LTD company but there is only him he works as a hgv driver with different agencys when applied for the above he got told he couldn't get it as he was a director of a LTD company anyone else had this and know how to help us last year he had earnings of just over £8000 for 6 months work but we are struggling as there is hardly any work out there at the minute plus he has to self isolate until 30th June as he's high risk please help

Jeremy535897

Your partner is not self employed, which is why he does not qualify for the self employed help. He is an employee of his own company. Unfortunately the last date someone could be furloughed was yesterday. If you are not claiming tax credits, you need to look at universal credit (if you are already claiming tax credits, a claim for universal credit will end tax credits forever).

unholyangel

He may work for his own company but he is not self employed if he is working via a company. 

If he was paying himself a salary under PAYE then he may be eligible for CJRS. Does he have premises for SBRR or has he applied for a loan under BILS? 

Jeremy535897

unholyangel said:

He may work for his own company but he is not self employed if he is working via a company. 

If he was paying himself a salary under PAYE then he may be eligible for CJRS. Does he have premises for SBRR or has he applied for a loan under BILS? 

The time limit for furlough for CJRS ended yesterday. I was hoping that where no duties had been performed, so that backdating was possible, it would still be possible to furlough someone, but this guidance is unhelpful:
"This means that the final date by which an employer needs to agree with their employee and ensure they place them on furlough is 10 June. Employers will have until 31 July to make any claims in respect of the period to 30 June."

From https://www.gov.uk/guidance/claim-for-wage-costs-through-the-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme

unholyangel

Jeremy535897 said:

unholyangel said:

He may work for his own company but he is not self employed if he is working via a company. 

If he was paying himself a salary under PAYE then he may be eligible for CJRS. Does he have premises for SBRR or has he applied for a loan under BILS? 

The time limit for furlough for CJRS ended yesterday. I was hoping that where no duties had been performed, so that backdating was possible, it would still be possible to furlough someone, but this guidance is unhelpful:
"This means that the final date by which an employer needs to agree with their employee and ensure they place them on furlough is 10 June. Employers will have until 31 July to make any claims in respect of the period to 30 June."

From https://www.gov.uk/guidance/claim-for-wage-costs-through-the-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme

It's always been the rule that you can't backdate a furlough period - it's legally impossible. I've been advising of that since April - that you can backdate a claim under CJRS but you can't backdate the furlough itself. 

But this is essentially why I said may - because he'd only be eligible if he had furloughed himself already. 

Jesterrmum1703

unholyangel said:

He may work for his own company but he is not self employed if he is working via a company. 

If he was paying himself a salary under PAYE then he may be eligible for CJRS. Does he have premises for SBRR or has he applied for a loan under BILS? 

No he doesn't have any premises we always got told as he had started a LTD company he was self employed as he works for agencys they pay him into a business account  and he just transfers what we need for that week 

calcotti

Jesterrmum1703 said:

unholyangel said:

He may work for his own company but he is not self employed if he is working via a company. 

If he was paying himself a salary under PAYE then he may be eligible for CJRS. Does he have premises for SBRR or has he applied for a loan under BILS? 

No he doesn't have any premises we always got told as he had started a LTD company he was self employed as he works for agencys they pay him into a business account  and he just transfers what we need for that week 

For tax purposes he is a employee of the limited company.

Grumpy_chap

Jesterrmum1703 said:

My partner is self employed as I LTD company but there is only him he works as a hgv driver with different agencys when applied for the above he got told he couldn't get it as he was a director of a LTD company anyone else had this and know how to help us last year he had earnings of just over £8000 for 6 months work but we are struggling as there is hardly any work out there at the minute plus he has to self isolate until 30th June as he's high risk please help

There is some confusion here and that creates lack of clarity so limiting the help any of us can give.  We are now 3 months into lock-down, so it is quite a late question to be asked.

With regard to self-employed:

• the agencies may say he is "self employed", but what they really mean is he is an "independent contractor" to them, paid gross and responsible for managing his own tax affairs.
• for HMRC, he is only "self employed" as a sole trader and completes the self employment pages of tax return.  Based on your OP, your husband is not "self employed" and not entitled to SEISS
• As your husband has his own Ltd Co., he is a Director of, and employed by, that Ltd Co. that he owns.  He completes the employment pages of the tax return so is not self-employed.

When did you husband last work?  This part is also confusing as you say "struggling as there is hardly any work" but also "he has to self isolate as he's high risk".  Is your husband working or shielding?

Icequeen1

unholyangel said:

Jeremy535897 said:

unholyangel said:

He may work for his own company but he is not self employed if he is working via a company. 

If he was paying himself a salary under PAYE then he may be eligible for CJRS. Does he have premises for SBRR or has he applied for a loan under BILS? 

The time limit for furlough for CJRS ended yesterday. I was hoping that where no duties had been performed, so that backdating was possible, it would still be possible to furlough someone, but this guidance is unhelpful:
"This means that the final date by which an employer needs to agree with their employee and ensure they place them on furlough is 10 June. Employers will have until 31 July to make any claims in respect of the period to 30 June."

From https://www.gov.uk/guidance/claim-for-wage-costs-through-the-coronavirus-job-retention-scheme

It's always been the rule that you can't backdate a furlough period - it's legally impossible. I've been advising of that since April - that you can backdate a claim under CJRS but you can't backdate the furlough itself. 

But this is essentially why I said may - because he'd only be eligible if he had furloughed himself already. 

When you say it isn't legally possible - can you point to anything supporting that? Why can't the contract be varied from an earlier date if the person hasn't been doing any work?

Jeremy535897

I find this area hard to understand. The CJRS allows claims to be backdated to 1 March, but the scheme did not exist on 1 March, so it is hard to see how they could have been furloughed from 1 March within the CJRS definition. It seems it must suffice to behave as if you were on furlough, that as an employee you had agreed with your employer to do no work from 1 March.

Grumpy_chap

While it is not strictly in the rules, if all other parameters were met, then it is possible that Jestermum's husband could write himself a letter from his Ltd Co dated 9th June and return that to himself with the signed agreement also on 9th June and hence furloughed from 9th June which is before the last date for furlough.  This would need to be before the June pay-run RTI. 

Sadly the OP is not clarifying whether her husband is working or shielding.  If he is working, he cannot claim CJRS from any date.  The business will have records of the dates he was working, so that is not worth bending the facts for.

The OP is also not clarifying the husband's status, so we cannot even comment as to whether other support such as BBLS would be available.