Best way to prep for grammar school entry in Year 3

alwaysskint2020

Fireflyaway said:

peachyprice said:

Fireflyaway said:

peachyprice said:

You don't need to prepare for Prep School,  they'll take your money regardless of your child's ability.

I thought OP was meaning they want their son to attend a state maintained grammar school? Or are you suggesting they send him to a fee paying prep school to prepare him to get into a state grammar? I do know of people who have done that. 

There are no state maintained grammar schools for year 3 children. 

From the OP
We would love for him to go to a grammar school and found that there is a grammar school where we live that offers entry in Year 3.

That will not be a state grammar school, it will be a private Prep school, perhaps feeding into the state grammar at year 7.

Exactly this. I went into the prep department of a grammar school aged 7  this was selective. When we got to 11 we still had to do 11+  Anyone that failed could not continue there

GlasweJen

fred246 said:

I think you have to class Eton and the other top boarding schools differently to your local private school. I think some people pay privately thinking they are sending their child to Eton. They aren't. They are paying for something that's very similar to that on offer at state funded schools.

I don't think this is true for everyone.

My husband for example, he's from a nice posh area with "good schools", we don't have grammar schools or an 11+ in Scotland. By primary 5 his mum realised that he "wasn't flourishing" in his nice suburban primary school and went looking for a high school for him. He spent primary 6 touring private schools and sitting entrance exams, passed a few and changed schools in primary 7 (transitus in his world), going to a private boarding school for "focus on the world outside of academics".

I went to the local high school and our educations couldn't have been more different, he spent his days sailing, horse riding and shooting while I tried to avoid being hit by a car and begging mad religious teachers to please give me the missing pages from the higher human biology book.

He's now a surgeon, despite "not being academic" so something worked. 

Fireflyaway

I disagree that private schools 'prop up' the state selective school system. We have removed ourselves from state education sector altogether because where I live the upper schools (comprehensive) are not very good. Why would I send my child to a failing comprehensive if I don't have to? If state schools were not selective it might even out, so you don't have very good schools and very bad schools. 
The school our child goes to is non selective. There was no entrance exam. The kids tend to come out with good exam results because of the discipline, environment, extra help and a good attitude, not because they were more able at the point of entry. As much as I'm happy we can chose a good school, I feel it's wrong that the local school is so bad that we have taken this route. 

maman

Fireflyaway said:

I disagree that private schools 'prop up' the state selective school system. We have removed ourselves from state education sector altogether because where I live the upper schools (comprehensive) are not very good. Why would I send my child to a failing comprehensive if I don't have to? If state schools were not selective it might even out, so you don't have very good schools and very bad schools. 
The school our child goes to is non selective. There was no entrance exam. The kids tend to come out with good exam results because of the discipline, environment, extra help and a good attitude, not because they were more able at the point of entry. As much as I'm happy we can chose a good school, I feel it's wrong that the local school is so bad that we have taken this route. 

While I respect your right to make this choice for your child, even a 'non selective' private school can alter the range of ability in the surrounding schools. Children who go to the private school will often have parents with a very positive attitude to education, will care for their child, feed them properly, want them to do well, support homework, buy them books, make sure they have lives rich in experience and conversation  etc etc as well as the fact that many of them will have had a good education themselves and be in a job that pays well enough to afford the fees.  These children have huge privilege compared with others before they even set foot through the school door. 

I'm not expecting any individual parent to address all these issues, that's the government's job. Although there are ways parents can help without being able to afford private schooling . 

peachyprice

Spendless said:

Fireflyaway said:

fred246 said:

I think you have to class Eton and the other top boarding schools differently to your local private school. I think some people pay privately thinking they are sending their child to Eton. They aren't. They are paying for something that's very similar to that on offer at state funded schools.

This may depend on the area in which you live. I'm against grammar schools so it may seem hypocritical to some that my child attends a private school. The reason we went down that route is because our child didn't achieve the pass mark for the grammar schools and the local upper schools are not good. I'm talking something like only 24% of kids in the upper school near us achieve 5 or more GCSE's. There is an issue with drugs, the school has had maybe 5 different head teachers in as many years. Attendance, discipline and academic achievement are  all poor. If we can afford to pay to avoid this why wouldn't we? My child is happy at school. Discipline is good, the school instills good values, class sizes are small, facilities are good and there is extra support for those who need it. I do feel annoyed that we are paying because I think every child should be able to access a good state school. I also feel fortunate that we are able to avoid the local school. I would be happy for my child to attend a state school if it was providing a good education / environment. It's not about being snobby or expecting our child to be a high flyer. I think schools would level out a lot more of the 11+ was abolished. 

Didn't your child have to sit an entrance exam for the private school? They do here for entry to Secondary years including their own pupils that are in the Primary years. I have heard of their own pupils not getting a place in yr7 because they didn't pass the exam for Secondary entrance. 

Not all private schools are selective.  There are many who will take anyone's money but will also offer scholarships for less well off children by way of passing an entrance exam. 

Spendless

peachyprice said:

Spendless said:

Fireflyaway said:

fred246 said:

I think you have to class Eton and the other top boarding schools differently to your local private school. I think some people pay privately thinking they are sending their child to Eton. They aren't. They are paying for something that's very similar to that on offer at state funded schools.

This may depend on the area in which you live. I'm against grammar schools so it may seem hypocritical to some that my child attends a private school. The reason we went down that route is because our child didn't achieve the pass mark for the grammar schools and the local upper schools are not good. I'm talking something like only 24% of kids in the upper school near us achieve 5 or more GCSE's. There is an issue with drugs, the school has had maybe 5 different head teachers in as many years. Attendance, discipline and academic achievement are  all poor. If we can afford to pay to avoid this why wouldn't we? My child is happy at school. Discipline is good, the school instills good values, class sizes are small, facilities are good and there is extra support for those who need it. I do feel annoyed that we are paying because I think every child should be able to access a good state school. I also feel fortunate that we are able to avoid the local school. I would be happy for my child to attend a state school if it was providing a good education / environment. It's not about being snobby or expecting our child to be a high flyer. I think schools would level out a lot more of the 11+ was abolished. 

Didn't your child have to sit an entrance exam for the private school? They do here for entry to Secondary years including their own pupils that are in the Primary years. I have heard of their own pupils not getting a place in yr7 because they didn't pass the exam for Secondary entrance. 

Not all private schools are selective.  There are many who will take anyone's money but will also offer scholarships for less well off children by way of passing an entrance exam. 

Yeah, I only discovered that when I read Fireflyaway's previous answer. There's only one private Secondary in my town which requires all pupils to take a yr7 entrance so I thought all private schools were like that. . 

mark1234567890

Thank you for all of the replies everyone.

The school I was referring to is the Manchester Grammar School, so Grammar in name but not by nature it would seem.

Here is a link to information on their Junior School: https://www.mgs.org/204/junior-school-1

John_

onwards&upwards said:

The thing that puzzles me about grammar schools is that kids aren't either good at everything or bad at everything, are they? 

What about a child who's fantastic at maths but struggles with English?  They go to the secondary modern/comp and their potential in maths is just ignored?  Or a child who has a real gift for foreign languages but hates science?  

Its an insane system, divisive, distressing to kids and parents, and on top of that its not even especially efficient or effective, I have no idea why so many people are so attached to a fundamentally bad idea. 

My school was a large one, so was able to have eighteen separate streams for ability, and it did tend to the the case that those in the top stream for one subject were it it for many. This was especially the case in the academic subjects, if you were good at maths you tended to be good at physics, geography, English, and French.
Arts and technology stood apart, but there were clearly some children who were academic, and some who weren’t.

onwards&upwards

John_ said:

onwards&upwards said:

The thing that puzzles me about grammar schools is that kids aren't either good at everything or bad at everything, are they? 

What about a child who's fantastic at maths but struggles with English?  They go to the secondary modern/comp and their potential in maths is just ignored?  Or a child who has a real gift for foreign languages but hates science?  

Its an insane system, divisive, distressing to kids and parents, and on top of that its not even especially efficient or effective, I have no idea why so many people are so attached to a fundamentally bad idea. 

My school was a large one, so was able to have eighteen separate streams for ability, and it did tend to the the case that those in the top stream for one subject were it it for many. This was especially the case in the academic subjects, if you were good at maths you tended to be good at physics, geography, English, and French.
Arts and technology stood apart, but there were clearly some children who were academic, and some who weren’t.

Sometimes that's just an assumption, I think.  I was good at English and a few other subjects.  I got put in the top set for maths too and I absolutely did not belong there!  I muddled through and got a B in my GCSE, I'd have been better off in the middle set.  

silvercar

mark1234567890 said:

Thank you for all of the replies everyone.

The school I was referring to is the Manchester Grammar School, so Grammar in name but not by nature it would seem.

Here is a link to information on their Junior School: https://www.mgs.org/204/junior-school-1

It is a grammar school at secondary level. What will happen in practice is that the parents of anyone in the junior school who will struggle in the senior school will be told by year 5 or 6 that MGS wouldn't be the right secondary school for them and will be advised and assisted in obtaining a place at a more appropriate school.