Self-Employed - Those Who Have Missed Out

IanNicholls

Hi Guys
Apologies if this topic already exists.
Does anybody have any positive news regarding those self-employed individuals who have, so far, missed out on a government grant?
I fall into that bracket, not because I have not yet sent in a tax return, but because my first return (2018/2019) contained a PAYE element that is greater than my declared self-employed profit. I simply do not understand why the PAYE element has any bearing whatsoever over the PAYE element. If the PAYE element was less, I would have qualified. Where is the logic in that?
I have written to my MP but heaven knows what weight that will hold. I received an encouraging acknowledgement followed by what looked to be a standard response.
I do hope the government changes its tune as I am losing money with zero income.
I'll certainly appreciate any help and/or advice given.
Cheers
Ian

hb2

I'm sorry, I can't see the scheme being changed to include more people at this stage. Unfortunately, there are people who, like you, have fallen through the net.  All you can do is look at the help that is available via Universal Credit, loan holiday etc and try to pick up other sources of income. 

mobilejo

I would guess the reason for the 50% test was to ensure that those whose self employment was a 'side-line' to their regular employment don't get the grant, because they would qualify for furlough under from their employer.

The problem with blanket tests like that is certain people (like you) who WERE employed in 2018/19 and earned more than 50% of their income from employment in that year, could very well have left employment since then and now rely 100% on their self-employed income. Now they have no employer to furlough them, and no self employed grant.

Its another situation that is a casualty of the system, rather than a target I imagine. The problem being the way they have implemented the system is the quickest way to get a system running that can be (a) automated (because they don't have time to manually validate claims) and (b) reduce fraud by not looking at 2019/20 tax returns, which people could submit after the scheme was announced and overstate earnings just to get the grant.

Grumpy_chap

The OP may qualify for BBLS and / or the property related business grants.
I think the reason for the 50% self-employed is that was a specific intent to rule out claims from people with a full-time job PAYE but doing a bit of 'hobby' work on the side (small ebay trader, or small craft stalls etc) from claiming the SEISS.   As @mobilejo also said.

nodesc55

Grumpy_chap said:

The OP may qualify for BBLS and / or the property related business grants.
I think the reason for the 50% self-employed is that was a specific intent to rule out claims from people with a full-time job PAYE but doing a bit of 'hobby' work on the side (small ebay trader, or small craft stalls etc) from claiming the SEISS.   As @mobilejo also said.

I’m in the exact same position, became self
employed Half way through 2018 so my employed income was 800 more than self employed. I’ve been self
employed ever since with no paye income and still don’t qualify for anything. 

Where as lads at my work who were previously self employed but have been employed fully on paye only since September last year recieved furlough off employer and still claimed the self
employed grant, even thought they haven’t traded self employed for months and don’t intend to the rest of the tax year. So they’ve claimed both grants, yet we can’t even get a penny of help. So the way they set it up to stop fraudulent claims is actually quite easy to find a loophole and get 2 lump
sums of cash, even thought you haven’t lost a penny of income. 

Grumpy_chap

@nodesc55 - as in your thread https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6151068/been-paid-furlough-off-employer-but-also-claimed-self-employed-grant#latest, the people who ceased being self-employed but still claimed the SEISS grant fail the eligibility and will eventually get found out and suffer the consequences of their fraud.