Await Court Date or Appeal? - Parking Eye

T_Modding

Hello,

I am new to this forum so apologies if anything has been done wrong. I would like to start out by saying that I have read the starting threads that state to ignore bailiff letters, but since we missed all the initial PCN letters I feel this situation is relatively unique and would like advice on whether to wait for a court date or contact the enforcement team and appeal. The operator was Parking Eye which I have heard can be rather aggressive in their approaches to "parking management".

After requesting an SAR from PE, we received back all the previous letters which included 2 PCN letters, a letter informing the early payment deadline has been reached and a Letter Before County Court Claim. We have also received the typical DCBL letter I have read about on here with a now much larger fine of £140 and the threat of PE taking us to court, which I'd imagine wouldn't happen anyway with all that is going on currently. They say that it is past the appeal stage but I'd imagine that is never the case, hence asking.

The alleged 'offence' occurred before Christmas at a hospital car park. In the hospital, see the attached image, there are 2 car parks opposite with almost identical signage and the same pricing structure. Unaware at the time, my mother had parked in one owned privately and paid a 14-hour ticket, then drove in the hospital-owned one next to it on the second visiting schedule, 2 hours later. This has been confirmed by ANPR records from PE received in the SAR. This privately-owned car park also operates using VRN machines and ANPR so at the time we were under the assumption the hospital must own both, as nothing was obvious to say otherwise (other than a small NHS logo on one of the signs, completely unnoticeable at 6pm on a winter in the dark). After contacting PE, they apparently do not manage this privately owned car park and with all that is going on, I am unable to drive there and see who manages it and receive their own data records.

I have attached images of the parking machines on each car park. If anyone has any idea as to who the management company could be on this private car park (based on the signage) so I could request similar ANPR and payment terminal records, it would be a great help.

What I was wondering was what case I have to make in this specific situation? I have attached photos of the signs for both car parks, identifying with satellite imagery which is private and which is hospital-owned. It was an honest mistake in an extremely stressful situation with all that was going on at the time but I didn't know how to play the case on in an appeal if I was advised to file one.

 Any help would be extremely appreciated.

Satellite Image:



Hospital Owned:



Privately Owned:

D_P_Dance

Appeal ever time with PE, and if they are daft enough, let them take you  to court, where, imo, if you attack their signs, which are pants., they are very likely to lose, read this

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5972164/parking-eye-signs-oxford-road-reading

Also, they must abide by this, have they?

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP, it can cause the scammer extra costs and work, and has been known to get the charge cancelled.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully, when life gets back to normal, it will become impossible for those scammers who are left to continue their vile trade, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

Umkomaas

It's too late to appeal now that it's with debt collectors. Evidence to date suggests that once PE hand a case over to debt collectors they have all but given up on collection. These seem to be cases where the car park landowner has probably refused PE permission to sue customers/clients, or in your case, patients/visitors. PE are very capable of launching their own court case, I have never seen them use a third party to do so, they employ two qualified solicitors of their own, so no need to farm out litigation. 

So my advice is that you file but ignore DCBL letters. Come back if you receive a court claim via the Northampton CCBC. They have 6 years to do so. 

Out of interest, how long ago did you receive the LBCCC from PE and did it give you 30 days to respond and include a number of information pages and a financial questionnaire?

Fruitcake

Bailiff letters are what you get if you have been to court, lost, and failed to pay. 
DCBL are acting as debt collectors. The letter will say DCBL are not acting as bailiffs.

It's a different kettle of herrings if you get anything from DCB Legal.

Complain to the landowner of the place where the car was parked. Complain to PALS and/or the hospital trust chair/CEO.
Complain to the BPA about the scammer's predatory tactics by using signs and pay machines that are near identical to those in the private car park next door to deliberately cause confusion. Even the graffiti is the same.
Include the images exactly as you have done above. Well done for getting those.

Complain to your MP about this unregulated scam. When Boris is back in charge, complain to him as well because he stated that he was going to sort out hospital parking. 

Ignore debt collectors but don't ignore real court papers.

KeithP

Which hospital?

Knowing that may help identify who owns/runs the 'other' car park.

Coupon-mad

If P/Eye have farmed it out to DCBL it's just debt collector stage.  Ignore DCBL in this case as we've never seen a case where P/Eye have not started a claim themselves.  

You know when you got P/Eye's own LBCCC?  The NEWBIES thread tells you that is a valid appeal stage with ParkingEye and you could have got a POPLA code.  Would have been appealable.  It will be again when P/Eye send you a freh LBCCC once they take the case back when you don't take the DCBL bait.

T_Modding

Umkomaas said:

Out of interest, how long ago did you receive the LBCCC from PE and did it give you 30 days to respond and include a number of information pages and a financial questionnaire?

According to the copy they sent in the SAR, the LBCCC was sent on the 11th February 2020 and was a mile long with all sorts of questions on it, regarding debt status etc. Out of all their letters, we only received the DCBL one which I have all intentions of ignoring. So I don't know if they sent the initial PCN's by carrier pigeon but our accountant or anyone else who sorts our post hasn't seen anything to do with this. One letter I can understand us missing and putting to one side, but not 4.

KeithP said:

Which hospital?

Knowing that may help identify who owns/runs the 'other' car park.

I contacted the hospital and know who owns the other car park, just it's a pub and I'm assuming they are not there to answer the phones with what is going on as I couldn't get through when I tried ringing. I have since cross referenced their signs and found out that NPS operates the car park, and so have requested the same machine and entry data from them for that car park to hopefully assist in appeal.
 

Coupon-mad said:

You know when you got P/Eye's own LBCCC?  The NEWBIES thread tells you that is a valid appeal stage with ParkingEye and you could have got a POPLA code.  Would have been appealable.  It will be again when P/Eye send you a freh LBCCC once they take the case back when you don't take the DCBL bait.

Their DCBL letter threatened 14 days, which I've took with a pinch of salt, and if I'm right was sent around 2-3 weeks ago. The original parking fine was from the back end of December and was sent out around New Years but we didn't see it. The registered keeper was in hospital at the time and has since been rather mentally incapacitated so she may have disposed of the letters unknowingly, but I still doubt all 4 were discarded as she was more than aware when the DCBL one came through the door.

T_Modding

Would it be appealable if I contact the PE enforcement email and attempt there, or is it not worth it? The registered keeper is elderly and knowing about the fine and seeing the letters coming through the door have stressed her out. Do I have any sort of way of telling DCBL to not send any more letters as she doesn't understand the fact that it's just fear tactics, and as the letters mention that TV show Cant Pay We'll Take It Away on the bottom, she is worrying thinking they're going to forcefully take assets. 

Umkomaas

as the letters mention that TV show Cant Pay We'll Take It Away on the bottom, she is worrying thinking they're going to forcefully take assets. 

But read exactly what it says on the reverse of the letter. Unless this has been to court, you've lost and failed/refused to pay what the Judge ordered (and is more than £600), you're not going to see any DCBL HEO goons knocking on anyone's door.  You're a million miles from there. 

Coupon-mad

Yes you can try emailing enforcement@parkingeye.co.uk

happybagger

KeithP said:

Which hospital?

Knowing that may help identify who owns/runs the 'other' car park.

University Hospital North Tees, Stockton on Tees, I guess looking at the map