Warning - Royal Mail items are delayed in sorting centres for 8+ weeks, no seller protection

megw

Just a note to anyone thinking about selling (or buying) during these times. We've had:

• Recorded first class items that haven't updated since Post Office for 10+ days
• International tracked Items that have not left UK for 6+ weeks
• International tracked Items that have been held in country local sorting centres for 8+ weeks
• Royal Mail requesting that we wait when filing claims on these items
• Customers opening cases for non-arrivals and getting refunds forced from eBay and/or Paypal

Royal Mail said the situation is changing constantly, so they are not posting clear cut updates on exactly which areas are effected, as it literally changes by the hour. So you are gambling a bit on whether an item will be delayed somewhere or arrive as normal.
Paypal do not refund fees on refunded items (5% + £0.3 of total sale). eBay do not refund fees when a case is escalated (10% of total sale).

custardy

Sorry,your post isnt correct.
You dont understand the system. A signed for item showing sent at Post Office isnt still at the Post Office.
International items will be delayed at both ends. Again, the item can have left the country but not had a scan in the receiving country. I doubt RM could hold 6 weeks of international packages 

soolin

Were you not getting the updates from RM with issues around posting overseas? My updates were coming thick and fast from early March telling me daily which countries I shouldn't be posting to and which were still fine.
Here is the latest update dated 2nd April:

We have lifted the suspension on Costa Rica, Russia, Romania. Macedonia, Columbia, Ukraine and Moldova. We are working hard to keep mail and parcels moving to all countries where possible.

The number of countries Royal Mail can access is changing daily, due to air capacity availability, local emergency border controls and in country operational restrictions implemented by mail operators. Unfortunately you will not be able to select any countries on suspension using a Business Contract Product.  Please consult the Intl Service Bulletin before you ship to see current status of countries we are shipping to on the link below:

https://personal.help.royalmail.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/5317/~/international-incident-bulletin

For affected countries where we have suspended service and are allowing our range of consumer products to remain open, we strongly advise not to send items and wait till the situation changes as there will be significant delays.

custardy

megw said:

custardy said:

Sorry,you post isnt correct.
You dont understand the system. A signed for item showing sent at Post Office isnt still at the Post Office.
International items will be delayed at both ends. Again, the item can have left the country but not had a scan in the receiving country. I doubt RM could hold 6 weeks of international packages 

We have an email from Royal Mail customer support that states otherwise. They have confirmed that items are being held in arrival centres for undisclosed amounts of time due to COVID19 (outbreaks, lockdowns, & staff shortages). We have tracking details that also confirms this. The items are shown as leaving UK, but have not yet scanned in by GLS (International) delivery partners. This means they have likely arrived, but not been sorted. This is not on all items, it's pretty much a gamble as to if your item will be affected. Have spent countless hours on the phone these last weeks, and eventually got a long email response confirming the issues.  

eBay support have also confirmed they are aware of the above issue and that it is causing delays in their own support system. 

Being held at 'arrival centres' isnt sitting at a Post Office,is it?
Items leaving the UK are at the mercy of the situation in the destination country. to be blunt,it was quite obvious as soon as COVID19 spread past China that international shipping would become an issue. More so once it impacted the UK.
given most of the UK has shut down,having a mail system at all is a blessing and as the sick increases one that with creak & lurch at best.

mgdavid

megw said:

@soolin Thank you. Not subscribed to email updates, as had until now just assumed they were a copy of the updates on the official RM website, which I am now seeng, they are obviously not. That's a shame as if I had gotten this information I wouldn't have shipped anything out. We are now restricting our mail to UK mainland tracked items only. Hopefully this thread will help others not make the same mistake. 

Should also add that we were informed by Royal Mail that all Italy mail is now going by surface-mail only (3 week delay). 

An excellent example of why one should never assume.

Worth noting that for larger or more important items going abroad, courier services seem to be still operating reasonably well.

custardy

megw said:

@custardy Agree with this, just think RM should have made the extent of the delays clearer, and eBay should do more to accommodate for it, rather than encouraging people to use their platform during this time. A lot of people will turn to eBay to sell old things when short of cash and should know just how bad delays are and how it can ultimately cost them. 

Its not always easy to measure what/where delays will be and who it would effect. especially relating to receiving countries 

Spoonie_Turtle

megw said:

mgdavid said:

megw said:

@soolin Thank you. Not subscribed to email updates, as had until now just assumed they were a copy of the updates on the official RM website, which I am now seeng, they are obviously not. That's a shame as if I had gotten this information I wouldn't have shipped anything out. We are now restricting our mail to UK mainland tracked items only. Hopefully this thread will help others not make the same mistake. 

Should also add that we were informed by Royal Mail that all Italy mail is now going by surface-mail only (3 week delay). 

An excellent example of why one should never assume.

Worth noting that for larger or more important items going abroad, courier services seem to be still operating reasonably well.

I don't think it's unreasonable to check the official Royal Mail service update on the official website, see that it's saying 'normal' and make an assumption from that? Even now, as I type this, Royal Mail is not making clear on their website the extent of their international delays.

How is anything you read on this page 'normal'? https://personal.help.royalmail.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/5317/~/international-incident-bulletin

"Coronavirus International delivery

We are working with our airline and postal/courier partners across the globe to maintain services. The number of countries that we can access is changing daily.

Most major export routes remain open and we continue to accept and process mail. Specifically, Royal Mail’s international services to the USA remain operational.

There are significant delays to a number of countries right now due to a lack of available transport links and suspension of certain country’s postal operations. We strongly advise not to send items to destinations listed as ‘On suspension’ below."

It then goes on to list details by country.

As for eBay, that's a separate issue and I agree they should be accommodating. I can't see how they are 'encouraging' people to use them though when there are no fee offers for private sellers and they've even made provision to suspend shop fees due to lack of sales!

soolin

megw said:

They should make clear that some items are being held for literally months due to lockdown. 'Delays' could mean anything. 
@Spoonie_Turtle eBay have actually suspended fees for new business accounts to encourage more people to join. This programme started at the end of March. "From today they are waiving fees for new businesses registering with them until 31st May and giving existing businesses a payment holiday on all fees." 
So yes, they are encouraging people to sell more than ever before despite all this going on whilst at the same time not offering any accommodation for sellers who are suddenly finding all their items being held in sorting offices for 3 months.

Actually eBay are not encouraging us to sell. Businesses have been told that if they close their shops for the whole month of April then the shop fee will be waived , the same for May. If sellers choose to keep selling then eBay acknowledge that we can’t ship a lot overseas and our sales are generally low, so will allow sellers to defer part of their fees for 2 months. There are NO payment holidays.

For private sellers who are used to weekly offers on FVF caps to encourage them to list more , these are not currently happening . 

In case you missed various eBay announcements, this one covers click and drop after Argos close their standalone stores:

https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Announcements/COVID-19-Update-25-March-Click-amp-Collect-store-closures/ba-p/6544804

this is the payment plan for fees :
https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Announcements/Payment-plan-now-available-for-your-next-eBay-invoice-UK-IE/ba-p/6544960

and this is the refund on shop subscriptions if you close your shop

https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Announcements/Get-a-refund-for-your-Shop-Subscription-if-you-close-your-eBay/ba-p/6552377

soolin

megw said:

@soolin eBay UK Twitter adverts targeting businesses and encouraging them to join and use eBay during these times
pinned tweet - https://twitter.com/eBay_UK/status/1243168057029201920
https://twitter.com/fsb_policy/status/1243144311753113603 - ad, retweeted by ebay UK
https://twitter.com/SmallBizSatUK/status/1243138163834585088
https://twitter.com/eBay_UK/status/1229728923174436864 

Follow the link and you end up with my links above telling sellers that they can close their shops and not pay any fees , or defer payable fees to a later month if they decide to keep selling.

When you have been on ebay as long as I have you will learn that what ebay say and what ebay mean are often 2 entirely different things. So there are no payment holidays unless you shut your shop up entirely or opt to pay your fees later - which does not equate to encouraging sellers to sell. I think the use of the term 'payment holiday' which is what th ebanks are also using is misleading as they are not giving anything away, just suggesting you can run up a debt that can be paid later when you start selling properly again.

The only true fee hold is this bit: From 26 March 2020, new businesses registering on ebay.co.uk will not have to pay fees to list or sell until 31 May 2020.', but note that is only listing fees , so sellers who manage to sell anything will still pay FVFs.

mgdavid

megw said:

They should make clear that some items are being held for literally months due to lockdown. 'Delays' could mean anything. 
...........
So yes, they are encouraging people to sell more than ever before despite all this going on whilst at the same time not offering any accommodation for sellers who are suddenly finding all their items being held in sorting offices for 3 months.

this reads as gross exaggeration; we've only been in lockdown for 3 weeks, and the post within UK is running reasonably well. We are getting deliveries to home at least 4 days a week including parcels ordered online. Obv if you're posting abroad to countries which have been affected by Covid-19 earlier than us then common sense will tell you to expect delays at the foreign end, which are of course completely out of the control of Royal Mail.

mgdavid

I take your point, but the lockdown could be relaxed in 3 more weeks - or could last 6 months. Nobody knows. Almost certainly our best information source for what's happening on the ground is Custardy who works for RM.