Athena ANPR Ltd and KFC advice required

Forty45

I would appreciate advice on a Civil Parking Charge Notice issued by Athena ANPR Ltd for an overstay of 25 minutes beyond the free parking time allowed of 90 minutes at a KFC in a retail park (out of a city centre). The “charge” is £100 (reduced to £50 for early payment).

I am the registered keeper of the vehicle. A family member was using it. The car park ANPR has picked up the car entering and leaving during the daytime at a weekend. 

The Notice says Athena ANPR Ltd are a member of ICP’s AOS scheme. When I checked IPC’s site it lists as AOS members Athena ANPR and Athena ANPR Limited. Both companies accreditation starts the same day but they show links to different web sites, and neither link to the website for Athena ANPR Ltd, but I have assumed they aren’t making up the membership claim. 

I found out BPA terminated ANPR Ltd’s membership on 22/1/20 (is this is the same company?). 

I have read the Newbies advice and I think I understand what is said. What I’d like is advice as to whether or not I have any/enough “ammunition” to challenge this. 

I have visited the site and found/photographed the signage. It is fairly clear in my view (speaking with the benefit of knowing I need to look for it). It says maximum free stay of 90 minutes, no return within 2 hours. Then it says breach of any term or condition will result in the driver being liable for a Parking Charge of £100, and that by entering the site drivers agree to the contractual terms and are liable to pay Athena ANPR Ltd  for a breach of them. There is a warning sign as you enter and there is a sign in the parking area setting out the terms fairly high up on a lamp post and another on the KFC building (not just by the entrance, but not too far away).

The driver (driving about 2 years with not a huge amount of mileage/experience) says they noticed nothing in the way of signs. Not a defence in my view.

Having looked at the draft letters I'm struggling to see where I can dispute/appeal this. It's happened and there are no mitigating factors I can see to challenge this on. Am I missing something or is it as I think a case of having to pay up?

 

Castle

What is the Company registration number shown on the PCN?

Forty45

it is 05678510

Redx

Athena is an IPC member , joined in 2015

Any appeal will be rejected regardless , but stage 1 for a PCN is a landowner or retailer cancellation , not an appeal

Any defence is saved for any court case

As for grounds for appeal , it's the usual suspects

No landowner authority
Poor and inadequate signage
POFA
CRA
IPC CoP

Umkomaas

Do a Google search on Christian Haertnagel MSE (Lidl MD) and read threads here on how to get him to cancel the charge. There are dozens of cases, all of which cancelled with a complaint to the MD - note, NOT the Lidl Customer Services who will just fob you off back to Athena. 

One of the easiest parking charges to kill off. 

Coupon-mad

at a KFC in a retail park (out of a city centre).

So that is who you complain to, before even trying a doomed appeal, if it's not a Lidl retail car park, but it probably includes Lidl. 

Is the NEWBIES thread that unclear that people keep missing the first thing to do:  'COMPLAIN TO THE RETAILER'?

Forty45

Thanks. 
Firstly no Lidl near the place.
I read about complaint to the retailer but couldn't see anyone reporting any success with KFC UK ( who are owned by Yum which is the parent of KFC and Pizza Hut).
The only success story I've seen is the grandmother who complained to the US CEO of KFC for  9 minute overstay. She had plenty of points on her side, grandchildren in tow, time to get to toilet, plus only 60 free minutes parking. Therefore different to my driver's situation, plus other than saying I failed to see the fines and think £100/50 is unfair for 24 minutes overstay, there isn't a lot to complain with.

Umkomaas

Sorry to have deflected you off towards Lidl - please ignore. It was a bit of a Pavlovian response on my part to seeing that the PPC was Athena - I just can't remember any Athena case that wasn't attached to Lidl. There was some suspicion that Athena was somehow part of the Lidl empire!

You can but complain to KFC at this stage. Again, as I write, Athena have never sued anyone through the small claims court, but do have 6 years to do so. 

MistyZ

Don't make potentially self-fulfilling prophecies about the landowner complaint.

For a start, complaining is no biggie.  If the landowner refuses to listen then you're one email down, that's all.  Though personally I'd be x number of emails down before I gave up, I'd persevere.  

Go into this with conviction.  If occupants of the car were customers at KFC, that's a compelling argument for cancellation.  The PPCs are employed to deter non-customers, not those who were happily chomping away on chicken nuggets and may wish to do so many more times in the future were it not for the opportunistic, predatory behaviour of Athena.

D_P_Dance

Having looked at the draft letters I'm struggling to see where I can dispute/appeal this.

Signs, wording of documentation, timeliness of ditto, landowner authority, signatures on contract, complaint to KFC, put bad stuff on social media, to list but a few, all explained in the stickies. 

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP., it can cause the scammer extra costs and work, and in some cases, cancellation.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

Forty45

Redx said:

Athena is an IPC member , joined in 2015

Any appeal will be rejected regardless , but stage 1 for a PCN is a landowner or retailer cancellation , not an appeal

Any defence is saved for any court case

As for grounds for appeal , it's the usual suspects

No landowner authority
Poor and inadequate signage
POFA
CRA
IPC CoP

Thanks. On the retailer cancelling I have posted above. Not clear who owns the land, so would have to investigate.

The sign refers to parking being at the discretion of the Landowner ( or Athena), so again with little in mitigation (other than not wanting to pay so much for so little parking), what basis do I use to ask the Landowner to cancel?
Do I ask Athena to prove they have authority from the Landowner (not KFC) that establishes Athena as a Creditor? This will presumably cost me the £50 early payment "discount"?

On the Appeal route, how do I say there is no Landowner authority when I don't know that to be the case? The sign suggests there is authority.
I can't with hand on heart say it's poor and inadequate signage from what I saw, but clearly not everyone spots the same things.

POFA - other than not being 100% sure on; 

"Has the right to enforce against the driver of the vehicle the requirement to pay the unpaid parking charges" it looks like all requirements have been met under that Act.

CRA - unsure what this is.

IPC CofP - l have looked at this.

I'd like to succeed with this, but I don't want to challenge it if there isn't much or any hope of getting anywhere and doing so costs an extra £50 for my trouble. At least a better than 50% chance of success is what I'd be wanting to know I have.