Residents permit fell in private car park

Kayleigh1988

Hi all I am really hopping I can get some help here as it seems Google is abit of a minefield.
Basically I live in a flat with a private car park and my permit fell and landed upside down. (typical.)
Received a letter and appealed explaining the situation thinking that as I am a resident with a permit they would be understanding, how wrong was I. Appeal refused.. So I have opened a case through the ias. So I have a few points I have brought up with them so far the fact that I am a tenant being the first. Parking is not included in my tanancy it just says some basic stuff like I must not park in a way to cause obstruction and my car must be taxed etc, nor does it mention anything about requiring a permit.
I have also brought up a point that the permits are not labelled which way up they need to be (I know it's obvious) but who are they to assume they I know what way the right way is.
Lastly I have said that the permits are not fit for purpose or supplied as advertised as they state in a letter sent with the permit that they are designed in a way that will stick to the windscreen, however mine didn't a fell off hense we are here now.
Lastly I asked them for proof they were allowed to ticket on the land as I have not seen any evidence e to this affect.

I have just received their response through ias and now I have hit a wall. Do I just pay the fine am I going to have bailiffs at my door or my car clamped. I can't afford hundreds of pounds in fines or late payment fees and it seems its easier to just pay the £100 now here's the catch as I received another ticket 2 days later where they haven't even bothered to take a picture of my permit just of my wind screen at an angle where u can see just the corner of the permit so its now £200 worth if parking fines.

I have just recieved atest response

It is appreciated that the appellant may have parked in a bay that is allocated to their property. However, the terms require a permit to be displayed at all times. By receiving and accepting this permit (and having shown an intention to comply with the terms of the permit), the appellant has indicated a consent to the parking scheme, which is, in part, for their benefit. In taking this benefit (i.e. in having the parking bay managed), the appellant must accept their part to play, which was to simply display a permit and park in the appropriate bay.

The appellant has alleged that the operator does not have the required authority to operate on this site. The charge arises from a contractual relationship, the terms of which are stipulated by the signs. It will be noted that we, as the operator, are a principal (not an agent) in this contract. This site has been audited by the IPC and a copy of the landowner's authority has been provided to them as part of the audit process. However, whilst we maintain that we do, in fact, have the authority of the landowner to operate upon this site (being the principal in the contract); the existence of this document has no legal bearing on the contract with the motorist. See Vehicle Control Services v HMRC [2013] EWCA Civ 186, para 22 per Lewison LJ.As this is a commercially sensitive document, and is irrelevant to the issues at hand, this is not provided as evidence in this appeal.

The PCN was issued for failing to display a valid parking permit. It is necessary that the permit be clearly and properly displayed in order that all the information pertaining the permit is visible. If it is not then how are we to establish that the bay is being appropriately used & that the permit is valid? If a driver displays a permit then it their responsibility to ensure that it is displayed according to the terms and conditions by which it is issued.


Thanks in advance

Coupon-mad

I have just received their response through ias and now I have hit a wall.

Of course, IAS is a kangaroo court and was pointless, as you've now discovered. Whilst it looks like you haven't lost yet, you will, LOL! You can't win at IAS.

Do I just pay the fine

No. It is not a fine, and NO don't pay!

am I going to have bailiffs at my door

No! Do you realise that only happens if people LOSE in court, the Judge orders them to pay and then the person refuses to pay! That is NOT happening to you.

or my car clamped.

Nope, clamping by private firms is illegal, and has been since 2012.

I can't afford hundreds of pounds in fines or late payment fees

Nor can we, nor can many people, and luckily, that won't happen.

and it seems its easier to just pay the £100 now

Don't let the side down, or yourself down, by finding the scammers for an easy life! On this forum, paying is NOT an option unless a Judge tells you to and there are no huge costs added. And we win 99% of cases here.

here's the catch as I received another ticket 2 days later where they haven't even bothered to take a picture of my permit just of my wind screen at an angle where u can see just the corner of the permit

OK, another scam PCN then. No point trying the IAS!!

so its now £200 worth if parking fines.

No it's not. It is £200 of scam invoices, well worth winning in court.

Which PPC?

UKCPM, PCM or Link Parking are my 3 guesses!

Kayleigh1988

Pcm.. I'm shocked they are even allowed to do this!?do I follow the ias appeal through now it's started even though I know I will loose I don't know if I've started something that I should follow throigh? Or just ignore both? . I read about complainimg to the land owner which I have 3 times on the phone they don't care either so I am going to try in writing, and also local MP. Not really sure what to say to her though LOL

nosferatu1001

No, dont continue with it. Withdraw if you can. Ignore the IAS.

The_Deep

… the terms require a permit to be displayed at all times.

Which terms, the lease, the AST, or the scammers self serving signs? If the latter, do they apply to you? It is highly unlikely that they do, read this,

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/11/residential-parking.html[/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]what does your lease/AST say about parking? Does it mention the need to display a permit? If not then it may take primacy over the self serving TnC of the scammer, and interfere with your lawful right to “quiet enjoyment” of your property, possible an offence under The Landlord and Tenants Acts.[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP., it can cause the scammer extra costs and work, and in some cases, cancellation.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.[/FONT]

Kayleigh1988

nosferatu1001 wrote: »

No, dont continue with it. Withdraw if you can. Ignore the IAS.

There is no option to withdraw, i can send straight to an adjudicator or just ignore from now which i guess I will do, and with regards to the other ticket I won't even bother with the IAS.

Kayleigh1988

The_Deep wrote: »

… the terms require a permit to be displayed at all times.

Which terms, the lease, the AST, or the scammers self serving signs? If the latter, do they apply to you? It is highly unlikely that they do, read this,


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]what does your lease/AST say about parking? Does it mention the need to display a permit? If not then it may take primacy over the self serving TnC of the scammer, and interfere with your lawful right to “quiet enjoyment” of your property, possible an offence under The Landlord and Tenants Acts.[/FONT]



My tenancy does not say anything about displaying a permit, however it does not say my property comes with a parking space.
There is a paragraph on parking with some general rules, mustn't cause obstruction, mustn't park in the garden must have road tax etc etc.

I am really frustrated with housing association at the moment as they are refusing to get involved, hoping once I have emailed them this may encourage them to do something.

Kayleigh1988

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.


I will do this now, is there any legislation that PCM have actually broken or not following then as I'm not sure what to actually say to the PM

nosferatu1001

That being harassed outside your own house is abominable? That these scammers have been found IN PARLIAMENT to be unscrupulous fraudsters? That there is no effective regulation or monitoring of their scam? etc.

Kayleigh1988

I have emailed landowner and MP. Pcm have taken my ias to the adjudicator so I guess that will be rejected as I asked them to stop wasting my time. What usually happened after that's rejected?

Kayleigh1988

It's funny because they have said I agreed to their contract by displaying a permit but the ticket is for not fully displaying a permit.. Apperently my contact is with them as I displayed a permit which over rides my contract with the land owner and still should pay my fine for not displaying a permit

It doesn't even make sense