Civil Enforcement Limited - Scotland

H2407

Hi,

I have read the newbies forum but just want to write this because I am slightly concerned and need peace of mind.

On 24th June 2019 the keeper's car was parked in a multistory car park and levels 9,10 and 11 are where gym members can park. The keeper is a member of Xercise4less gym in Falkirk, Scotland.

In order to get a permit for free parking you have to input you car reg details into an ipad the gym has at the reception. On this date the driver forgot to input the reg details and on 30th June 2019 the keeper received a Parking Charge Notice for £100!!!!! £60 if I paid in 14 days.

The keeper emailed the manager of my gym explaining this and he was of no help at all. To gain access to Xercise4less gyms, you input your fingerprint onto a machine which then opens the barrier. The driver is a registered member at the gym in Glasgow not Falkirk therefore the driver's fingerprint only works at Glasgow. The people on reception in Falkirk buzz the driver through without a fingerprint.
The keeper explained this to the gym manager who pretty much said he was unable to help as they do not have any account of the driver's name or CCTV footage to prove that the driver was there. You'd think a company would have to know everyone who is in their building in case of emergencies etc....guess not for Xercise4less.

After that the keeper read a few forums online, asked a few people, the keeper's dad even asked a lawyer (he was dealing with something at his work) and the same conclusion was reached: IGNORE.

So the keeper have ignored the letters received since then which includes one from ZZPS and most recently one from QDR Solicitor. The letter from QDR Solicitors states that a decree could be sought against the keeper if a payment is not made within 14 days and that the keeper's credit may be affected, future lending may be impacted and it could have an affect on the keeper's current and future in employment. Absolutely disgusting.

The keeper wrote to their local MP (wrote to him on 25/10/2019) but he has not replied. The keeper emailed him again today and got an automated response:
"Parliament has now been dissolved until th General Election. Therefore there are currently no Members of Parliament. Incoming emails to this account may be received and read, however this email address is only being used to respond to urgent constituency case work..."

The keeper was hoping to get a reply from the Falkirk MP but it looks like this is unlikely anytime soon.

And today, while the keeper was at work a solicitor phoned their house and their mum answered. This has angered and worried her.

The keeper's questions are:

1. Should the keeper contact Xercise4less ? Perhaps take it further and speak to a regional manager or...?

2. If this solicitor phones the keeper - what should they say if anything?

3. Will the keeper likely get a court letter?

Thank you!!
H

Fruitcake

At the moment the specific advice in the sticky thread for NEWBIES for motorists in Scotland is up to date and correct.

Follow that advice to the letter.

Soon this will all change because Scottish MPs have sold Scottish motorists down the sewer by changing the law to make a keeper liable. Once this has been granted royal ascent it will be law (in Scotland as it has been in England and Wales since 2012).

Until then the current law applies and the new law cannot be applied retrospectively.

So, read the Scotland specific advice in the NEWBIES and follow it to the letter, but watch out for a change in the law in the near future, which you should have been and should in the future complain about vehemently to your MP.

You should also edit your post to remove information about who did what. Only ever refer to The Driver and The Keeper, who are two different people in law.

You should also always complain and complain again to the landowner, and complain to your MP about this unregulated scam.

H2407

Thank you for your quick response Fruitcake! The post has been edited and now the keeper/the driver are throughout it.

I also have a look at the Newbie thread for Scotland - this is the only part I found:


- ''I'm in Scotland/NI, so is the advice different?''

A - IF THE EVENT TOOK PLACE IN SCOTLAND OR NI, WE SUGGEST YOU DO (ALWAYS!) COMPLAIN TO STORE MANAGEMENT IF YOUR PCN IS FROM A RETAIL PARK, BUT DO NOT APPEAL, UNLESS YOUR CAR IS A COMPANY/HIRE/LEASED VEHICLE, IN WHICH CASE, APPEAL AS HIRER/LESSEE (SEE * AT THE FOOT OF THIS POST).

IN SCOTLAND/NI, CERTAINLY COMPLAIN TO THE RETAILERS, BUT IGNORE THE PARKING FIRM UNLESS YOU GET A CLAIM.

IN SCOTLAND THIS IS EXCEEDINGLY RARE, AND DEFENDABLE BY A KEEPER, WHO CURRENTLY HAS A FAR MORE PROTECTED POSITION IN LAW THAN AN ADMITTED DRIVER.

WHEN IGNORING IN SCOTLAND/NI, KEEP ALL LETTERS. DO NOT THROW THEM AWAY, FOR 5 YEARS.

I have complained to the gym but the gym is within a larger building with more shops etc so should I contact the owner of the building? I think it is the council....

Shall I keep trying to contact my local MP after that email I sent today?

Thanks

H

Fruitcake

H2407 wrote: »

Thank you for your quick response Fruitcake! The post has been edited and now the keeper/the driver are throughout it.

I also have a look at the Newbie thread for Scotland - this is the only part I found:


- ''I'm in Scotland/NI, so is the advice different?''

A - IF THE EVENT TOOK PLACE IN SCOTLAND OR NI, WE SUGGEST YOU DO (ALWAYS!) COMPLAIN TO STORE MANAGEMENT IF YOUR PCN IS FROM A RETAIL PARK, BUT DO NOT APPEAL, UNLESS YOUR CAR IS A COMPANY/HIRE/LEASED VEHICLE, IN WHICH CASE, APPEAL AS HIRER/LESSEE (SEE * AT THE FOOT OF THIS POST).

IN SCOTLAND/NI, CERTAINLY COMPLAIN TO THE RETAILERS, BUT IGNORE THE PARKING FIRM UNLESS YOU GET A CLAIM.

IN SCOTLAND THIS IS EXCEEDINGLY RARE, AND DEFENDABLE BY A KEEPER, WHO CURRENTLY HAS A FAR MORE PROTECTED POSITION IN LAW THAN AN ADMITTED DRIVER.

WHEN IGNORING IN SCOTLAND/NI, KEEP ALL LETTERS. DO NOT THROW THEM AWAY, FOR 5 YEARS.

I have complained to the gym but the gym is within a larger building with more shops etc so should I contact the owner of the building? I think it is the council....

Shall I keep trying to contact my local MP after that email I sent today?

Thanks

H

Yes of course. You should also ask if they voted to make a keeper liable in Scotland. In other words, did they sell Scottish motorists down the sewer like was done in England and Wales in 2012 when the law was changed to make someone liable who may not even have been in the car at the time of the alleged event.
This means that you could be on holiday the other side of the world because you are a vehicle keeper but someone else allegedly breached a civil contract in a privately owned car park yet somehow find themselves liable.
At the moment England and Wales are the only places in the world where someone who was not in the car can be liable for someone else's actions, but in a few weeks time this will apply to Scotland as well.

Sod Scottish independence, Sturgeon and Co have aligned themselves with private parking scammers just like their colleagues in Westminster. Some serious back hands must have occurred for that to happen.

Ask your MP if they voted for keeper liability in Scotland, and check against the Scottish parliamentary voting results to see if they are telling the truth. If they voted for keeper liability tell them how unhappy you are with them aligning themselves with unregulated scammers as defined by MPs in open parliamentary debate, and tell them you will not vote for them if they stand for re-election because of this.

Scottish motorists and Scottish courts are about to be hit by a sh1tstorm of parking charges the likes of which they will have never seen before.

In England ad Wales court cases have gone from less than a thousand a year in 2012 to over thirty thousand a year, and rising every year. The number of PCNs issue this year is expected to be about nine million.

Scotland watch out! It's coming your way.

H2407

Okay so I have written to the other MP in Falkirk. I have also written to a local Counsellor.

In the mean time what should I do if the solicitor phones again?

Fruitcake

H2407 wrote: »

Okay so I have written to the other MP in Falkirk. I have also written to a local Counsellor.

In the mean time what should I do if the solicitor phones again?

What do you not understand about ignoring if the keeper and event are in Scotland?

Do you have a young child you could give the 'phone to, or call blocking, or a pneumatic drill you could put the 'phone next to, or a dog that barks at noises, or a windowsill to park the 'phone on, or can speak a foreign language to answer any questions, or are able to speak pure gibberish, or can put the 'phone in a cupboard for an hour, or the ability to hang up as soon as you know who the call is from?

Have you written to your own MP and asked for help? Have you also asked them if they voted for keeper liability in Scotland, and told them you will not vote for them if they did?

You could also ask Ms Sturgeon the same questions and give her the same comments if she voted for keeper liability. She keeps banging on about Scottish independence but it is her lot that have voted for this scam to be allowed in your part of the UK, and therefore wants the same scammers from England the right to scam north of the border.

H2407

I am and have been ignoring it but I am just scared to get a letter with a court date on it.

Haha yes I’ll go full gibberish if they phone. Thank you for your quick replies!

Fruitcake

H2407 wrote: »

I am and have been ignoring it but I am just scared to get a letter with a court date on it.

Haha yes I’ll go full gibberish if they phone. Thank you for your quick replies!

Until keeper liability becomes law in Scotland, which it will unless the population complains to their MPs in the next few weeks, the keeper cannot be held liable.

It is possible the driver could be taken to court, if their identity is know, and be held liable. That will only happen if someone is stupid enough to tell them the driver's identity.

The keeper could be served with Simple Procedure papers (Act of Sedurant) but again, unless the driver's identity is known the keeper cannot be held liable, yet.

Again, ignore anything and everything the keeper receives except real court papers.

In the meantime, complain to the landowner, your MP and Ms Sturgeon about this unregulated scam plus the sh1tstorm motorists and Scottish courts that is heading your way.

Trust me, it WILL happen as it happed south of the border after the law changed here in 2012.

Coupon-mad

To gain access to Xercise4less gyms, you input your fingerprint onto a machine which then opens the barrier. The driver is a registered member at the gym in Glasgow not Falkirk therefore the driver's fingerprint only works at Glasgow. The people on reception in Falkirk buzz the driver through without a fingerprint.

The keeper explained this to the gym manager who pretty much said he was unable to help as they do not have any account of the driver's name or CCTV footage to prove that the driver was there.

Complain to the overall top banana, the national CEO of the chain, explaining the above and telling him that if their parking agents sue you under the Scottish courts' Simple Procedure for this farce of a 'charge' you will call upon him/her to appear as a witness in court to explain why they set this up to catch consumers then cut them loose when their own agents threaten to sue. Tell the CEO that if this is not cancelled within seven days you will consider a claim against the Gym group for their continued course of harassment, conduct which is unlawful and will be established if they allow and enable their dodgy agent to continue to send unwarranted demands.

Finish by asking him/her to nominate any dates in 2020 when he/she will be unavailable to be summonsed to the Scottish court.


(should focus the Gym top guy's mind...).

H2407

Thank you Fruitcake, will ignore and come back here with information if any court letters come through. I have a few names today that I am going to complain to so don’t worry


Thank you Coupon-Mad. I emailed the manager of the gym again last night to set up a meeting but he’s as useful as powdered water so not sure what he’ll reply. I’ll write to the CEO today and see what she/he says.

I also have the phone number for Callander Square (the building which the gym is situated in) so I will also be contacting them.

Thank you kind people

H

H2407

Hi again,

The manager of the gym got back to me tonight with this:

Hi ....

I am sorry to hear of the problems you are having.

As you may be aware the Club and Xercise4less have nothing to do with the rules or appeals in relation to parking within the Multi story.

The only option you have is to appeal to the Car Park company themselves, their details are below:

creativecarparks.co.uk


I am sorry that I am not able to offer any further assistance.

Best regards

.....

The company is Civil Enforcement Limited so not sure why he is giving me details for creative car parks?

Should I contact them?

What should I reply to him?

Thanks

H