PCN from Premier Park Ltd - Mousehole Cornwall

Devon_Driver

I have received a PCN from a BPA registered company called Premier Park Ltd. for the Parade car park in Mousehole, Cornwall.

This PCN (NTK) letter is the first mention of any problem. There was no notice left on the vehicle, neither did a car park operative come forward on the day.

Premier Park Ltd. claim to have issued this PCN for "Not Displaying a Valid Pay and Display Ticket".

Timeline is as follows. PCN arrived at home address 1 week after parking in Mousehole. Currently within Premier Park Ltd's 14 day 'discount charge' period.

The letter shows two badly taken photographs - one showing the whole vehicle correctly parked beside the P&D machine. The second is a full windscreen photograph, but not close enough to see any details on the purchased parking ticket displayed on the dashboard.

The day in question was very windy (The National Trust officially closed St Michaels Mount because of it). We were sure the ticket was displayed correctly, however possible the wind flipped it over.

We no longer have the valid pay & display ticket. Having read through countless threads and the newbies section, I am unsure if this is still worth appealing without the physical proof of purchase?

We also can not remember if the pay & display machine required number plate information or was a basic coin feeder. It certainly did not have a credit card facility.

NB: A company known as Kernow Parking Solutions (KPS) had previously operated from this car park. Any posts about KPS using this site stop mentioning them post March 2019, so I must assume Premier Park Ltd. have since taken over.

Very much appreciate some advice on how to proceed, or even if I can?

Many thanks.

SuperSeagull

My wife has received one from the same company for parking in Falmouth. The sign clearly says Blue Badge Holders get an extra 1 hour free, which we took advantage of paying for 2 hours at 1.58pm but as per the PCN stayed for 2 hours 58 mins, 2 mins inside the extra hour.

I appealed but it was rejected, as apparently it always is with that company, as they say that we should have pressed a yellow button prior to inserting money. We didnt see that sign or a yellow button, which we wouldnt have looked for anyway.

I am toid that this company do not accept appeals from POPLA or any other source so I should ignore them until I receive a notice prior to court action from Northampton County Court and then file a defence. Is that sound advice

KeithP

SuperSeagull, you are probably best advised to continue your enquiries on your existing thread.

Have you seen the link to photos posted there?

Redx

Post the address of the PPC , because a few are named Premier Park , it's important to know which one , if it is the BPA one then Popla should be offered

Read this link posted over 18 months ago , following that advice in future

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/team-blog/2017/05/throwing-pay-display-ticket-away-use-cost-100/

Read the Newbies FAQ sticky thread near the top of the forum

If the dispenser instructions are not clear , then frustration of contract and de minimis may prevail , especially with a yellow button , what if the disabled person was colour blind or partially blind ???

The EA2010 is clear on this , that reasonable adjustments should be made , which one could say means upholding an appeal with proof of a valid BB , de minimis

If the reply above is a different Premier Park than yours , ignore it

I presume the correct VRM was used for the paid for ticket ??

If yes , then they recorded it , that is your proof of purchase , a SAR would flush those details out

Coupon-mad

No-one tells people not to appeal to POPLA, as it is worth a try and changes nothing if you lose. These scam PCNs are beaten in court anyway, 99% of the time on this forum, by ordinary people who are fully coached on how to win (no CCJ risk).

So think of appeal and POPLA as a first stage to try to get it cancelled.

In the OP's case it sounds like there is a lack of evidence that the permit was not properly displayed, however no doubt when you log in online as if to appeal or pay(!!) then there will be more photos, so check them first then - REGARDLESS OF OTHER PHOTOS - carry on with the keeper appeal as per the NEWBIES thread, to get the POPLA code.

In SuperSeagull's case (because I have to help someone with a username like that!) you too should try POPLA but your case is every winnable in court, and if you are Worthing or Brighton based I can help you locally in person, and turn up to court free to support people.

Devon_Driver

Redx are you replying to my original post?
(Your answers seem muddled with quesions from another?).

I usually always keep parking tickets, however this one time, it sadly appears I must have thrown it away.

My question is simple - is attempting to quash this charge without the record of the ticket, pointless? Paying £60 (or the full £100), will be a total disgrace, however jumping through hours and hours of hoops (if you guys deem my case to have a poor chance of winning), will be a waste of time.

We do not know if a VRM was asked for at the Pay & Display machine in Mousehole. We live too far away to revisit and photograph the site (Google street view does not go close enough).

The company who sent the PCN claim to be Premier Park Ltd. PO Box 624, Exeter, Devon, EX1 9JG

Thanks

Coupon-mad

See above reply. We never have a poor chance of winning in the end.

A VRM will have been asked for, BTW.

That's how these car parks 'work' (and how they scam).

Devon_Driver

Thanks Coupon-mad - We posted at the same time.
I will follow your advice this evening.

Redx

Devon_Driver wrote: »

Redx are you replying to my original post?
(Your answers seem muddled with quesions from another?).

I usually always keep parking tickets, however this one time, it sadly appears I must have thrown it away.

My question is simple - is attempting to quash this charge without the record of the ticket, pointless? Paying £60 (or the full £100), will be a total disgrace, however jumping through hours and hours of hoops (if you guys deem my case to have a poor chance of winning), will be a waste of time.

We do not know if a VRM was asked for at the Pay & Display machine in Mousehole. We live too far away to revisit and photograph the site (Google street view does not go close enough).

The company who sent the PCN claim to be Premier Park Ltd. PO Box 624, Exeter, Devon, EX1 9JG

Thanks

Yes I did reply to your original post , the other post by seagull muddied the waters , not mine

I told you the answer to your question , that a SAR would possibly solve it because pp should have a payment record , which is your proof once obtained assuming that the instructions on the payment machine were followed , apart from not using any special buttons , but correct VRM entry is paramount

Keep all paid for receipts for a minimum of 4 to 6 years in future

Can you imagine what would happen if banks started coming us for not using an ATM correctly ? You wouldn't get your money without suitable checks being made , including an incorrect pin instead of your VRM at this car park

If seagull has received a pcn from the same company , then Popla is an option in both cases

I am assuming that both car parks use a similar registration system , but either way both will probably use anpr cameras , but may use an operative on site or visiting

Not putting in the correct VRM is usually a trigger for a PCN , as is overstaying etc

Paying for a ticket is only part of the process

Devon_Driver

Redx wrote:

…a SAR would possibly solve it because pp should have a payment record , which is your proof once obtained assuming that the instructions on the payment machine were followed , apart from not using any special buttons , but correct VRM entry is paramount.

I have now submitted the approved appeal letter to Premier Park Ltd, which also requests payment records showing partial VRNs.

Redx wrote:

I am assuming that both car parks use a similar registration system , but either way both will probably use anpr cameras , but may use an operative on site or visiting.

This car park is very basic and did not have cameras. An operative manually took photographs 1 hour into a 2 hour paid visit. I have since viewed 6 photographs online showing the valid parking ticket (face down on the dash of the vehicle), the car park's signage and pay & display machine (which indeed does ask for a VRN).

Coupon-mad

OK so the long game is you will probably lose at POPLA (but try anyway) but likely win if they try a small claim in court.

Please don't panic when you read that phrase; this is what we do every day here, and no-one is put at any CCJ risk or of huge costs, in the 1% of cases we see lost in front of a person's local Judge against these scams. Even the losing Defendants just pay within 30 days, about £175 if they get unlucky, and no effect remains on their credit file at all.

No repercussions or black marks - and 99% win!