A Brave New World

[Deleted User]

thriftwizard wrote: »

Education: whatever happened to evening classes? Can we bring them back? My dear-departed stepfather became a well-respected industrial chemist by attending evening classes whilst working a day-job. People learnt to cut hair, maintain their own cars, do a bit of carpentry, learnt languages etc., usually in the classrooms & labs of their local secondary school.

I didn't have the time or energy to sign up for anything whilst they were still available here, as I had small children & a shift-working husband, but I really looked forward to learning a new language or something once I had the time. But now I do, there's nothing...

I agree adult education has been severely cut in my area,unless you want to do belly dancing, or basket weaving etc actual evening classes where folk who missed out for whatever reason in education has almost vanished around here. its not only helpful to educate and inform people it brings all sorts of people together which itself is great in making friends.I met a smashing couple around 18 years ago at an Adult Ed history class and we are still good friends, and our old tutor runs a class from her house now which I go to every Friday and really enjoy. They are also in my pub quiz team on a tuesday night and are both in their early 80s and very lively and we enjoy each others company.

thriftwizard

Well, I'm always happy to do belly-dancing! It's one of my main hobbies & a great sparkly fun way to keep fit & make friends. But possibly not a practical skill, or particularly money-saving, which is what a lot of the old classes were.

unrecordings

PipneyJane wrote: »

I had a brilliant idea the other night, while I was driving home. It covered three things: farmers complaining that they can't hire local people to help on their farms; how many of our long term unemployed are supposedly work shy; and that many of the people who harvest or process the food produced on our farms travelling in from Eastern Europe and potentially not being able to obtain visas post B*****. (Apologies, I can't make that sentence grammatically correct, however hard I try.)

I was mulling over the concept of food security and the issues around it. I think I've come up with a couple of solutions. Do you remember how, back in the dim-and-distant-past, London's poor would spend their annual holiday in Kent harvesting hops or apples? Well, how about we partner each secondary school with a farm, so that in the spring, summer and autumn each class spends a week on rotation working at "their" farm? The class would go for the entire week and camp in either large tents or the barns. They would be paid minimum wage for the work that they did, with a savings account being opened for each child when they started secondary school and their wages paid directly into it. Room and board would be deducted to a maximum of £30/week.

It would be a bit like a working school camp. As well as learning a work ethic, think of the lessons they could have re botany, biology, ecology, animal husbandry and food safety. They could also have lessons in money management and budgeting. And because they go back to the same farm each time, they'll be invested in its successful outcome.

My second thought was around the long term unemployed and processing the harvest. Our current benefit system actively discourages people from taking on low paid jobs like farm work at harvest time. How about we incentivise them instead? Any person who has been unemployed for six months or more and signs on to the "harvest scheme" will a) keep all their benefits for the duration of their participation in the scheme, and b) earn taxable wages of at least minimum rate less room and board of no more than £30/week. The person would have to commit to the harvest scheme for a minimum of 2 weeks with the maximum period per year being 2 months. They would also receive a bonus of a free class of their choice at their local higher education college, to enable them to learn new, more employable skills (which might include literacy, numeracy or even plumbing).

What do you think?

- Pip

Broadly love it, especially the bit that ties in a little with wartime evacuees - only going on the rose-tinted documentaries, it (the non bombing bit) seems to have created fond memories. I'd be worried about the scheme evolving into work for welfare though - remember anyof these pie in the sky ideas mooted by 'our government' could easily be repurposed by 'the next one'

unrecordings

dreaming wrote: »

No I don't see them as obselete either but it seems our council might. I am part of a group that has just spent the past 2years fighting to save our library (one of 21 in our county scheduled for closure) and finally it seems we may be able to take it over as a community library and run it with volunteers. Without being too "political" the council have not exactly been at all helpful in this and have not only moved the goalposts regularly but seem to have uprooted and taken them away so no-one else can play. In fact it took legal action to get them to rethink their oriiginal plans to close the 21 libraries and get a consultation period.

Did they cite budgetary concerns, that seems to be the usual, then they get entrenched in their own dogma, then the courts end up getting involved. Politics ? Nope: Amateur Hour
(huge slice of irony available if you can get it through customs)

Anyway, good luck with your own library fight

PipneyJane

unrecordings wrote: »

Broadly love it, especially the bit that ties in a little with wartime evacuees - only going on the rose-tinted documentaries, it (the non bombing bit) seems to have created fond memories. I'd be worried about the scheme evolving into work for welfare though - remember anyof these pie in the sky ideas mooted by 'our government' could easily be repurposed by 'the next one'

Hmmm.... I hadn’t considered welfare-to-work. It wasn’t part of my thought process - I was thinking that they could work on a farm, earn some money and some self-respect, without putting their benefits in peril. (Too many people who do seasonal work - say at the seaside during the summer season - report going through hell with the benefit system when their summer job finishes.)

- Pip

unrecordings

thriftwizard wrote: »

Education: whatever happened to evening classes? Can we bring them back? My dear-departed stepfather became a well-respected industrial chemist by attending evening classes whilst working a day-job. People learnt to cut hair, maintain their own cars, do a bit of carpentry, learnt languages etc., usually in the classrooms & labs of their local secondary school.

I didn't have the time or energy to sign up for anything whilst they were still available here, as I had small children & a shift-working husband, but I really looked forward to learning a new language or something once I had the time. But now I do, there's nothing...

My parents took evening classes. I never did, preferring the pub, though I've been able to demonstrate to my oncology team that my experience in pretending not to be drunk was actually quite valuable in mitigating the physical effects of brain tumour

In the 21st Century have evening classes been replaced to some extent by the online expansion of The Open University ? Do people prefer dip in/dip out shorter term courses these days ?

Wednesday2000

VJsmum wrote: »

I guess, for some people, these things are less significant as they can pay. THat's where the politics comes in.

I think the Swedish system is pretty good. There's a suburb of Stockholm, Hammarby-Sjostad which is an experimental eco village / town. I visited a few years ago and was given some insight into their eco credentials - things like their recycling system are a wonder as is their car pool ideas. however, Stockholm is an easy city to cycle round..

https://www.thenatureofcities.com/2014/02/12/hammarby-sjostad-a-new-generation-of-sustainable-urban-eco-districts/

Additionally, whilst the Swedish system is good (free health, free education), I believe they pay 50% or 55% income tax

This is the problem though, people want all these nice socialist ideas in principle but they don't want to pay the taxes that come along with them!:rotfl:

unrecordings

Brambling wrote: »

We have a fortnightly rubbish collection which as a single person household works for me however if you combined that with a local authority tip which is now opened only 5 days a week with restrictions (they count the bags in your car and more than 10 regardless of the size will not let you back the same day) and from December we will need to produce proof of residency in the county. I drive to 12 miles to work via country roads and it's not unusual to see fly tipping which must cost more to clean up than keeping the tip open full time.

I'm sorry to say I think the tipping will only get worse once the new rules come in - I think there was an article I read a year or so ago where this was documented in Barnsley, or Rotherham (or both). Yes, it's very short sighted. Short sighted case in point Number #15: There's a lovely park in Sheffield that you travel past if you come in via train from the South. For some unknown reason the council decided the two car parks were not value for money or something, so installed pay & display. Now both car parks are always completely empty and everyone parks on the road, generally disgorging their kids, dogs & scooters onto the busy dual carriageway first

Blue_Doggy

I think one of the things that put paid to many evening classes was the government deciding that they should all lead to a qualification by exam, not everyone wanted to take (or pay for) an exam, so participants dropped off and courses folded.

Pipney Jane I like your idea, but as others have said it could be difficult to blend with the benefits system. Two other sources of seasonal workers could be asylum seekers, who currently aren’t allowed to work and are given only a tiny pittance to live on while their cases drag on through the system. And all those poor migrants from Africa and Asia who risk their lives crossing the seas. They want to come here, take shocking risks to achieve their aims. It might keep them out of the clutches of the traffickers and modern slavers.

But there are probably objections to all those groups being enabled to contribute to society with dignity.

unrecordings

thriftwizard wrote: »

Well, I'm always happy to do belly-dancing! It's one of my main hobbies & a great sparkly fun way to keep fit & make friends. But possibly not a practical skill, or particularly money-saving, which is what a lot of the old classes were.

Here's an idea. Why should the serious wellness/mindfulness endeavours get all the NHS funding (if that's where it's coming from in our New Atlantis *) - belly dancing on the NHS ? Fund it by the calorie burn potential I say...

(* Possibly the first work of science fiction, circa 1620 someything by Sir Francis Bacon)