PIP Chaos, Need Advice

IIKazzII

Hi guys, will try keep it to the point, basically I was on DLA for life, I have social anxiety, agoraphobia and manic depression. When the system changed over to PIP, like everyone else I had to have a medical. I took my daughter with me and was a nervous wreck, I rarely leave the house and the anxiety was rough building up. On the day I answered everything truthfully, but all the questions were aimed at physical ability, nothing related to mental health, whilst answering questions the examiner was playing with her phone, and hardly wrote anything down.


When the result came in the mail, I had lost my entire DLA income, the woman had lied on her report about everything, reading the report described someone totally different to me, she said I went alone which I did not. She awarded me 0 points and I lost everything, this put a huge financial strain on me not to mention the stress, within a few weeks I was behind with bills and debts and still am now. I did appeal and was awarded Mobility at the lowest rate, but for someone with Agoraphobia, giving me Mobility is almost a bad joke (although it's at least something).


I issued a formal complaint about the examiner, but it was swept under the rug, and despite chasing it up, the whole things fizzled away. So I decided to go to the tribuneral route, I've waited 56 weeks and finally got my appointment the other day. The original plan was for my partner to come with me, but that's not possible now. I was told by CAB that I need to aquire evidence to back my tribuneral hearing, the only place I can aquire such evidence is my doctors (obviously). My surgery has flatly refused to get me a letter wrote from a GP to support my claim, I have asked them so many times and they just wont budge. Having tried to reach oout to past therapists etc I have reached total dead ends there too. Long story slightly shorter, I just can't seem to get anything to back my claim, I'm stuck in what many online are calling the Benefits Trap.


Having spoke to CAB again they basically told me just lay it all down and hope they are understanding on the day, but I have also been told because of the nature of my issues (Agoraphobia etc), just turning up to the hearing could be shooting myself in the foot. The CAB advisor seems to think I have a better chance not actually going and instead send in a written statement. She seems to think people with Agoraphobia and other mental issues are having some luck letting the tribuneral do it solo.


Question is what's the best path to take here? I really have no idea what to do, if I turn up, it's like an instant fail, if I don't I only have a written statement to fight for me (if this is even allowed). Topped with the fact I have been blocked at attaining any evidence I am at my wits end! Any advice?

poppy12345

Appearing in person will give you the best chance of a decision in your favour. About 74% of those that appear have a decision in their favour, against a percentage as low as between 5-8% for those that have a paper based decision.



The panel will always prefer to see you so they can see and hear for their self how your conditions affect you. You will be able to tell them in your own words how your conditions affect you.


Have you written your submission? If so did you include some real life examples of what happened the last time you attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to you?



You can request digital copies of your medical records free from your GP and take a look through to see if there's anything you can use as evidence.



It's not unusual for a GP to refuse to write a supporting letter for a benefit claim, many GPs just don't have the time. It's not really the nest evidence to send anyway, in my opinion because a GP will very rarely know how your conditions affect you against the PIP descriptors. Those that will write one will more than likely charge you.



You could ask someone that knows you well to write a support letter, as well as a diary written by yourself. Any extra evidence you do plan on sending needs to arrive no later than 10 days before the hearing date, otherwise your hearing could be adjourned because they may not have time to look at the evidence on the day. I've certainly heard of this happening many times.

antrobus

IIKazzII wrote: »

Hi guys, will try keep it to the point, basically I was on DLA for life, I have social anxiety, agoraphobia and manic depression. When the system changed over to PIP, like everyone else I had to have a medical.

The PIP assessment is not a 'medical'

The assessment for PIP looks at an individual’s ability to carry out a series of everyday activities. The assessment considers the overall impact of a claimant’s health condition or impairment on their functional ability, rather than focusing on a particular diagnosis. PIP is not a compensation payment for ill health /disability; it is to help people with the increased costs of daily living in cases of long term ill health or disability..

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/809406/pip-assessment-guide-part-1-assessment-process.pdf

IIKazzII wrote: »

...
I did appeal and was awarded Mobility at the lowest rate, but for someone with Agoraphobia, giving me Mobility is almost a bad joke (although it's at least something).,,,

It seems logical to me.

As far as Daily Living is concerned, how does suffering from "social anxiety, agoraphobia and manic depression" affect your ability to cook a simple meal, attend to your toilet needs etc?

You have to go through the descriptors and decide where you think you can score points.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/Global/Migrated_Documents/adviceguide/pip-9-table-of-activities-descriptors-and-points.pdf

Where do you think the DWP got it wrong? That's what the tribunal wants to hear.

tacpot12

The DWP should have sent you all the information they hold on your PIP claim to you and to HMTCS (aka "the bundle"). Have you received this yet? I assume you have because you have a tribunal date.

Have you been thorough the bundle to make a list of the mistakes that the assessor and/or decision-maker made?

If not, you could ask at your Citizens Advice again for help to prepare for your tribunal

It will help you if you can get evidence of the mistake that has been made. Others have suggested how you might gather this evidence.

poppy12345

Pointing out the errors in the report will not help a PIP Tribunal because the panel won't be interested in any of those. They will only be interested in where you think you should have scored those points and your reasons why.

Alice_Holt

Why can't your partner accompany you to your hearing?
Is there anyone else who could take you there? Support worker / other family member / friend / even arrange a taxi if all else fails?

I would not advise failing to turn up for your hearing, if you previously requested an oral hearing.
As poppy says you are much more likely of success if you turn up, your oral evidence will be very important to the panel in coming to their decision.

Have you sent the Tribunal Service (TS) your submission, detailing which PIP points should apply and why?
Have you sent the Tribunal Service evidence from family members carers, etc confirming the difficulties you have with the relevant PIP activities?
Have you got your medical records from your surgery (google GDPR and requesting medical records) and sent these to the TS?

If you haven't done any of these things, then the panel's only evidence for a paper hearing will be the DWP evidence bundle. If you want a better outcome than the award you currently have, you need to attend and explain why you can't do the disputed PIP activities reliably.

What preparations have you made for your appeal?
https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal

If you really can't attend to put your case to the panel, then I would suggest:
- Write to the TS explaining why your partner can't come, and you can't get anyone else to take you, and you are unable to get there without this support (if this is really, really the case); request a telephone hearing instead and ask that the if this can't be arranged then the hearing date is postponed to when your partner is available.
- If you are lucky enough to get a second date, then use the time wisely to prepare fully for your appeal. Understand which PIP points apply and why, write a compelling submission, prepare a diary / examples to take to the hearing, get your medical records, get evidence from family members, etc.

You are completely and totally wrong in saying - " if I turn up, it's like an instant fail". I cannot emphasis enough how absolutely mistaken your are with this statement.
If you don't turn up the only evidence (it seems) that the panel will have is the DWP papers. The tribunal panel has to make its decision on the evidence before it. How do they know the assessment is flawed if you haven't told them?

ISPIPTHATBAD

So sorry to hear about your experience.

Alice_Holt

Couple of additional points:
The tribunal will be looking at the claimants condition at the date of the DWP decision, not at his condition on the day of the hearing.
PIP looks at what you can do (or not) on the majority of days.

Presumably the OP will be arguing for a Daily Living award due to social phobia, anxiety and depression?
The mobility award (on reconsideration) recognises the difficulties his agoraphobia brings. To get the enhanced rate requires 12 points (i.e Descriptor f. Cannot follow the route of a familiar journey without another person, an assistance dog or an orientation aid. 12 points).

What DLA award did you have, OP?
The fact that you went from 0 points to a mobility award on reconsideration, suggests to be that the assessment may have been flawed. If you were in receipt of middle rate DLA care, it could be worth making as strong a case for a PIP Daily Living award at the tribunal that you can
It will help to know the PIP activities, and criteria, to do this - https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/808855/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria.pdf

BTW - there is not a "low" mobility award. There is standard and enhanced. Look carefully at the descriptors listed here - https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-points-system.

It would help if the OP could respond to these points, and the other points raised in his thread.

If the OP has really been advised by his CAB that, as an agoraphobic he would have a better chance of success by not attending his hearing, he should complete a feedback form as this is very unhelpful advice for a Citizens Advice office to give to clients.

calcotti

IIKazzII wrote: »

I did appeal and was awarded Mobility at the lowest rate, but for someone with Agoraphobia, giving me Mobility is almost a bad joke (although it's at least something).

It's precisely because you get distressed if you go out that you have received some points on this descriptor. The points are gained for things you can't do, or have difficulty doing.

IIKazzII

Hi again guys, my partner cannot attend as an important hospital appointment falls on the same date for one of the kids that we have been waiting for a long time. What is the bundle someone mentioned, prep bundle? I have literally received nothing?


I was on DLA Middle rate for life, failed my first PIP claim, then appealed, I scraped by on points and got mobility basic. I was going to accept that and be done with it even though financially still leaves me in a mess, but was told by everyone and their grandmother because how I'd been treated, to pursue it, I applied for the tribuneral online. I have had 3 messages from them in 56 weeks:


1 To confirm my tribuneral application
2 Around the 40 week mark to say there will be a delay but I'm still on the list to be seen
3 Last week to confirm time and date


I'm not sure what the prep bundle is I've not gotten anything in the mail etc. I contacted them via email the other day asking what to bring, they just suggested my medication and ID. It doesn't even say on the appointment letter I need these things, I'm literally clueless about it all, all I know is I have to turn up with my meds and ID. I asked my doctors again today for medical evidence and was told no sorry. So no evidence on my claim at all, which is frustrating as I have had these issues for over 20 years, and seen several therapists etc, and also passed 4 medicals previously on DLA before being awarded for life. It's disgusting how one woman who wanted her bonus payout for failing people not only puts me back at square one, but in a hugely disadvantaged way, then my supporting evidence is totally blocked.

poppy12345

The "bundle" is everything you sent to support your claim and includes the original form and the assessment report, as well as DWP's response. You should have received this from HMCTS. As you haven't received it then you need to contact them urgently and tell them. You also need to take it with you on the day of the hearing.



What about your submission, have you written this? Have you explained where you think you should have scored those points and your reasons why? Given real life examples alongside that?



When is the hearing date? A poorly presented case can lead to refusal.



Have you looked at the link Alice posted above? This one?

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria


You need to forget your DLA award because that no longer exists and PIP is different to what DLA was.