Thomas Cook flights booked through Condor

Ganga

rossmk wrote: »

I am having the exact same issue. Condor Airlines advertised flights to GOA which I found on both Google Flights and Skyscanner.

I booked directly from Condor's website and it was only after my transaction did it show that my flights had been put through Thomas Cook airlines. I can't find any information on who is liable for this transaction.

If anyone has any advice on my rights as a consumer in this instance it would be greatly appreciate. As it is flights only I am also not ATOL protected so have begun my process with my credit card company - Monzo.

However, I do feel Condor have a responsibility in providing this transaction from their website to Thomas Cook. I can't find any laws outlining my rights - please help as I'm nearly £1,000 out of pocket!!

See post number 8,might give you the answer you need.

pamster

Just to re-cap ......I booked direct flights from Manchester to Las Vegas and returning direct from LA to Manchester with Condor. The flights are with Thomas Cook but I paid Condor. I have tried to contact Condor several times (no easy task) and have received conflicting advise. The latest is that they will offer me replacement flights at no extra charge but these aren't acceptable as instead of direct flights taking approx. 10 hours both journeys consist of 3 flights changing at various locations and adding on hours of travelling time. They have told me that I can't cancel my booking without charge but surely the booking has been cancelled by default as Thomas Cook have ceased trading? Am I right in thinking that I don't have to accept and that they should refund me in full? If so any advice on how to go about this would be appreciated.

pamster

pamster wrote: »

Just to re-cap ......I booked direct flights from Manchester to Las Vegas and returning direct from LA to Manchester with Condor. The flights are with Thomas Cook but I paid Condor. I have tried to contact Condor several times (no easy task) and have received conflicting advise. The latest is that they will offer me replacement flights at no extra charge but these aren't acceptable as instead of direct flights taking approx. 10 hours both journeys consist of 3 flights changing at various locations and adding on hours of travelling time. They have told me that I can't cancel my booking without charge but surely the booking has been cancelled by default as Thomas Cook have ceased trading? Am I right in thinking that I don't have to accept and that they should refund me in full? If so any advice on how to go about this would be appreciated.

Condor are now saying

"After our former parent company, Thomas Cook Group plc, filed for insolvency, Condor Flugdienst GmbH is in a protective shielding procedure.
Through this procedure, Condor acquires complete independence from Thomas Cook Group plc and, upon completion of the procedure, Condor will be released from any joint liability for liabilities of the insolvent parent company Thomas Cook Group plc.


Unfortunately, at this moment, a refund is not possible due to the shielding procedure.

We can offer changes on only Condor flights free of charge for example from Frankfurt to Las-Vegas and back depending on the availabilities.
We do not have flights to/from England.

We are sorry for the inconvenient this will cause"


Do I have to accept replacement flights or should my credit card company refund as I haven't got the flights I paid for i.e. direct ones from Manchester?

born_again

pamster wrote: »

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Do I have to accept replacement flights or should my credit card company refund as I haven't got the flights I paid for i.e. direct ones from Manchester?

Speak to your card provider.

See what they have to say. I have a feeling that they will say as they have offered flights you may have to take them.
Note that you may then have a S75 claim for having to book flights to the other airport. So check that out as well and make your decision.

Alan_Bowen

You must talk to your card issuer as it seems Condor are determined not to let a penny of the money they collected on behalf of TC Airlines to be refunded under any circumstances. I fear few of us are aware of German insolvency law, so cannot say whether the offer of alternative flights negates the obligation to refund and of course your card issuer may say you made no payment to TC in the first place. Best of luck, it seems you may need it

LPKait

pamster wrote: »

Condor are now saying
Do I have to accept replacement flights or should my credit card company refund as I haven't got the flights I paid for i.e. direct ones from Manchester?

I have a similar issue. We booked London to Cape Town flights, through Opodo as agent, Condor is the airline, the flight operated by TC. The flight is cancelled and Condor are no longer operating a direct flight London to Cape Town, so Condor cannot offer an alternative other than via Germany which we don’t want. I believe there is an obligation to take alternative flights if they are reasonably similar to your original booking – I don’t believe changing from direct to three flights would be a reasonable alternative so I wouldn’t fee obligated to accept that.

We’ve tried Condor and Opodo a couple of times. Today I spoke to Condor (phone number 0049 6171 6988920 – got through immediately). They said that the obligation to refund is with TC and I need to phone Opodo to process the refund from TC. I’ve also phoned Opodo today (phone number 02076 602215 – got through quickly) and they said they are waiting for an update from TC and cannot process any refunds until they get an update from TC.

I don’t believe this is true. I made the booking through Opodo, the airline is Condor and on my credit card statement the payments are made to Condor. So I believe our contract is with Condor and they owe the refund (it’s their business if the contracted the flight our to TC, but not my concern). So, I think they are just stalling until they know whether they’ll get anything back from TC. I don’t believe this should effect our refund claims.

Anyway, I’ve made a preliminary claim with my credit card (MBNA, which I believe is Lloyds) and to process the claim they need written confirmation from Condor that they will not be refunding me (because Condor appear on my CC statement). With that they say they will refund me. So I have written an email to Condor (reservation@Condor.com - Condor’s instruction) to get this in writing.

Interested to hear if anyone else has made progress?

Ganga

When we went to Grand Canaria in October ( due to TC not flying to Hurgarda out of Newcastle ) we spoke to some guests from Germany who had also had similar problems with Condor,they said that Germany insolvency law stated that they might have to wait FOUR years for a refund and then would not get 100%,do not know if this is true.

Alan_Bowen

Ganga, I suspect the people you met were on a package holiday from Germany where indeed the law on financial protection is very different to the UK. There is no requirement for a licence such as the ATOL scheme in the UK, each operator must simply take out an insurance policy in order to trade. The big problem is that no insurer and there are only 3 left in the market, would offer more than 110 M Euros cover so they have to wait until every possible claim has been made and then divide the 110 Million between them. At best it looks as though German consumers will get 25% or less of the cost of their holidays back whereas, in the UK, everyone on a package will get a full refund.

The big issue is why people were directed to Condor rather than TC Airlines own website and the more I discover, the more likely it is because the credit card processors in the UK were becoming aware of how precarious the TC group was and either wouldn't process cards at all for the airline or wanted to hold on to the funds until passengers had travelled, knowing that otherwise, with no ATOL protection, they would have to make huge repayments. Condor had better terms and was, therefore, a cheaper option for the airline

Ganga

Alan_Bowen wrote: »

Ganga, I suspect the people you met were on a package holiday from Germany where indeed the law on financial protection is very different to the UK. There is no requirement for a licence such as the ATOL scheme in the UK, each operator must simply take out an insurance policy in order to trade. The big problem is that no insurer and there are only 3 left in the market, would offer more than 110 M Euros cover so they have to wait until every possible claim has been made and then divide the 110 Million between them. At best it looks as though German consumers will get 25% or less of the cost of their holidays back whereas, in the UK, everyone on a package will get a full refund.

The big issue is why people were directed to Condor rather than TC Airlines own website and the more I discover, the more likely it is because the credit card processors in the UK were becoming aware of how precarious the TC group was and either wouldn't process cards at all for the airline or wanted to hold on to the funds until passengers had travelled, knowing that otherwise, with no ATOL protection, they would have to make huge repayments. Condor had better terms and was, therefore, a cheaper option for the airline

The German people who i spoke to albeit breifly as we were playing crazy golf and i do not speak german but i am sure they were indicating that the amount of money they were expecting/had been informed was 10% :eek: :eek: if true its places the ABTA scheme in better place than a lot of people think.
I know a lot of people are still waiting for their money back and i do not blame them for wanting the process speeded up but as has been said by others this size of operation has never been handled by ABTA before and hopefully will not have to again.

Alan_Bowen

In fact, ABTA has nothing to do with TC, it is ATOL, which is run by the Civil Aviation Authority who report to the Department of Transport. Every package by air includes a £2.50 fee which goes into a pot to pay out in situations like this, after TC, of course, the pot may be empty and we may learn in the near future that the £2.50 fee will have to change, but at least you get your money back.