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EastGate Wharf Lewes Parking Fine Court Case Won
Sand26
Posts: 10 Forumite
A couple of months ago I replied to a thread where a case had been won as I had my own court hearing coming up.
What is so great about this forum is that as soon as I'd posted I started to get offers of help - thank you. I started to work with Coupon Mad on my case and this made all the difference to what I was looking at and how I was preparing. The level of knowledge was immense and it turned what was an uninformed but determined stand whatever the cost, into a case that looked winnable.
I thought it would be useful to share some of the things that happened during my hearing in case it's helpful for anyone heading into a similar situation.
For anyone reading this looking for hope and help with their own case you'll get it on this forum. For anyone hoping that this forum will do the work for you then think again. Coupon Mad advised me brilliantly and sent me off to look for all the things I needed for my case - and I had to read them and understand them. I've probably spent in excess of 25 hours preparing for the case and writing my Witness Statement (WS). For me it was worth it. It was never about the money or the time - I wanted to stand up to these firms that operate on the margins and who use intimidation and fear to get money, and I figured that even if I lost it would cost them more than me.
One thing I've noticed over the last 30 months is that each time OPS or one of their affiliated debt collectors or solicitors got in touch it felt more serious and scary than it had before. And each time I looked into it I found out that it's only that way if you don't understand their language. Much of what they write is designed to intimidate. This happened again when I received the letter from the County Court Business Centre in Northampton informing me that I had a case to answer. This must be serious - it's court! However, anyone can issue a claim through the County Court Business Centre - it doesn't validate their case. From this moment onwards this forum was an invaluable source for me - I wish I'd come here sooner.
So a few details about the case and the hearing. Around 30 months ago my wife stopped my vehicle for less than 5 minutes in Eastgate Wharf Lewes to attend to a matter within the vehicle. She was half in and half out of a poorly marked bay. The engine was running and she didn't leave the vehicle except to attend to something in the back seat. The usual ensued after that - 2 PCN/NTKs that I didn't receive, debt collectors and solicitors letter and a notice before claim. I ignored all of these - this is not advice - I should have asked here what to do with them. Eventually I get the notice from the County Court Business Centre and the case is in the system and I needed to reply. I ticked the box that gave me additional days to prepare my initial defence and then I found a defence in this forum that applied to my case and used it to respond to the court. I also asked that the hearing be local to me as I disputed the claim and felt the case should be tried in the area the incident occurred.
As the date for the hearing got closer I started to prepare my Witness Statement and Evidence Bundle which would effectively be the case I would be arguing.
My argument was as follows:
Their PCN was non POFA - they had failed to adhere to the law as stated in the Protection of Freedom Act. Mainly due to having issued the notice after the 14 day maximum allowed in the act. It was ultimately this that lead to the case being dismissed. We also argued that their wording was not compliant with the act and that they had deliberately mislead the court.
The parking bay, the signs and the alleged BPA audit - parking bay unclearly marked, no road markings, insufficient signage and the claimant submitted a BPA audit as evidence that occurred 22 months after the incident.
No landowner authority - the contract appears to be between the Director of One Parking Solution and One Parking Solution - the director of OPS has leased the land to himself. He does not own this land.
No reasonable grace period as per the BPA CoP - less than 5 minutes was not enough time to read the sign.
This would have been a harder case without their breach of the 14 day notice period. Not un-winnable.
I was lucky enough to live fairly close to Coupon Mad who offered to accompany me on the day and to act as Lay Representative in the court. Coupon Mad really knows their stuff!! We were also joined by ParkingMad who arrived with additional information and sat at the back and watched everything unfold. The case took about an hour and the judge, and we, took time to read and ensure the right words were used and the points we raised were understood.
A few learnings for me as someone new to this:
Whatever the law says - don't expect the judge to know it - you have to call their attention to it in a legally compelling manner. The judge would not have known or spotted the 14 day breach.
Over prepare everything, know what you're going to talk about, be able to explain your points, have evidence to back them up and be clear on how the claimant's case or WS is inaccurate or in breach - this is less scary than it sounds - just don't wing it.
When the judge asks you a question or challenges your point it doesn't mean you're wrong - it means they need more detail or haven't understood your point.
The claimant against you may happily mislead in their own WS and on the day because they've a good chance of getting away with it. They can provide shoddy, inaccurate evidence and if unchallenged it may well pass as truth. The judge is often not an expert in this field.
And lastly - it's mainly all about the law. Fairness, unfairness, mitigating circumstances don't really come into it - it's about how you can show that they have not adhered to the law or have applied the law inaccurately.
I don't profess to be an expert on this and the above is just my experience and my view - I'm sure some of the regular posters on this forum will have much more to add and they'll almost certainly be right.
The end result was case dismissed and I was awarded £106 costs.
As I said at the start - this was not about the money - these parking firms take advantage of people all too often and it shouldn't go unopposed. Huge thanks to you Coupon Mad - absolutely brilliant and this would have been a very different result without your help.
If anyone needs any help with style - i.e. how to present your documents, where to look for stuff and wants to talk about how much work's involved then please get in touch. If you want help with substance then ask someone better qualified than me on this forum.
What is so great about this forum is that as soon as I'd posted I started to get offers of help - thank you. I started to work with Coupon Mad on my case and this made all the difference to what I was looking at and how I was preparing. The level of knowledge was immense and it turned what was an uninformed but determined stand whatever the cost, into a case that looked winnable.
I thought it would be useful to share some of the things that happened during my hearing in case it's helpful for anyone heading into a similar situation.
For anyone reading this looking for hope and help with their own case you'll get it on this forum. For anyone hoping that this forum will do the work for you then think again. Coupon Mad advised me brilliantly and sent me off to look for all the things I needed for my case - and I had to read them and understand them. I've probably spent in excess of 25 hours preparing for the case and writing my Witness Statement (WS). For me it was worth it. It was never about the money or the time - I wanted to stand up to these firms that operate on the margins and who use intimidation and fear to get money, and I figured that even if I lost it would cost them more than me.
One thing I've noticed over the last 30 months is that each time OPS or one of their affiliated debt collectors or solicitors got in touch it felt more serious and scary than it had before. And each time I looked into it I found out that it's only that way if you don't understand their language. Much of what they write is designed to intimidate. This happened again when I received the letter from the County Court Business Centre in Northampton informing me that I had a case to answer. This must be serious - it's court! However, anyone can issue a claim through the County Court Business Centre - it doesn't validate their case. From this moment onwards this forum was an invaluable source for me - I wish I'd come here sooner.
So a few details about the case and the hearing. Around 30 months ago my wife stopped my vehicle for less than 5 minutes in Eastgate Wharf Lewes to attend to a matter within the vehicle. She was half in and half out of a poorly marked bay. The engine was running and she didn't leave the vehicle except to attend to something in the back seat. The usual ensued after that - 2 PCN/NTKs that I didn't receive, debt collectors and solicitors letter and a notice before claim. I ignored all of these - this is not advice - I should have asked here what to do with them. Eventually I get the notice from the County Court Business Centre and the case is in the system and I needed to reply. I ticked the box that gave me additional days to prepare my initial defence and then I found a defence in this forum that applied to my case and used it to respond to the court. I also asked that the hearing be local to me as I disputed the claim and felt the case should be tried in the area the incident occurred.
As the date for the hearing got closer I started to prepare my Witness Statement and Evidence Bundle which would effectively be the case I would be arguing.
My argument was as follows:
Their PCN was non POFA - they had failed to adhere to the law as stated in the Protection of Freedom Act. Mainly due to having issued the notice after the 14 day maximum allowed in the act. It was ultimately this that lead to the case being dismissed. We also argued that their wording was not compliant with the act and that they had deliberately mislead the court.
The parking bay, the signs and the alleged BPA audit - parking bay unclearly marked, no road markings, insufficient signage and the claimant submitted a BPA audit as evidence that occurred 22 months after the incident.
No landowner authority - the contract appears to be between the Director of One Parking Solution and One Parking Solution - the director of OPS has leased the land to himself. He does not own this land.
No reasonable grace period as per the BPA CoP - less than 5 minutes was not enough time to read the sign.
This would have been a harder case without their breach of the 14 day notice period. Not un-winnable.
I was lucky enough to live fairly close to Coupon Mad who offered to accompany me on the day and to act as Lay Representative in the court. Coupon Mad really knows their stuff!! We were also joined by ParkingMad who arrived with additional information and sat at the back and watched everything unfold. The case took about an hour and the judge, and we, took time to read and ensure the right words were used and the points we raised were understood.
A few learnings for me as someone new to this:
Whatever the law says - don't expect the judge to know it - you have to call their attention to it in a legally compelling manner. The judge would not have known or spotted the 14 day breach.
Over prepare everything, know what you're going to talk about, be able to explain your points, have evidence to back them up and be clear on how the claimant's case or WS is inaccurate or in breach - this is less scary than it sounds - just don't wing it.
When the judge asks you a question or challenges your point it doesn't mean you're wrong - it means they need more detail or haven't understood your point.
The claimant against you may happily mislead in their own WS and on the day because they've a good chance of getting away with it. They can provide shoddy, inaccurate evidence and if unchallenged it may well pass as truth. The judge is often not an expert in this field.
And lastly - it's mainly all about the law. Fairness, unfairness, mitigating circumstances don't really come into it - it's about how you can show that they have not adhered to the law or have applied the law inaccurately.
I don't profess to be an expert on this and the above is just my experience and my view - I'm sure some of the regular posters on this forum will have much more to add and they'll almost certainly be right.
The end result was case dismissed and I was awarded £106 costs.
As I said at the start - this was not about the money - these parking firms take advantage of people all too often and it shouldn't go unopposed. Huge thanks to you Coupon Mad - absolutely brilliant and this would have been a very different result without your help.
If anyone needs any help with style - i.e. how to present your documents, where to look for stuff and wants to talk about how much work's involved then please get in touch. If you want help with substance then ask someone better qualified than me on this forum.
0
Comments
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Well done and coupon mad is the dogs *******
Just a shame about the football team!0 -
Super synopsis of the excellent win against the neutered c0ckhen!
Well done.
Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .
I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.
Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street0 -
The DJ was unimpressed with OPS' undated pics of signage, but the POFA point won, on a lovely sunny day out in Brighton on Friday, where all three of us walked cheerfully alongside the beach and back to our cars afterwards.
The OPS kiddy (learning the ropes - poor kid to have to 'work' in that industry) left the room so quickly he left his file of papers on the desk!PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD0 -
well done , Another one bites the dust
post #1 needs editing to Northampton , not Nottingham !! (ped ant ic , lol)
and the CCBC in Northampton is not a court , its a government office , a Business Centre to administer the initial paperwork stages and to allocate a local county court , which is the real and actual court0 -
I was awarded £106 costs.
£106 for all the hassle, time and stress is an insult imo.
Did you know that a few years ago OPS had to pay some £26,000 to motorists whom they bothered?
https://www.expressandstar.com/news/2011/03/31/26000-fine-for-parking-firm/You never know how far you can go until you go too far.0 -
well done , Another one bites the dust
post #1 needs editing to Northampton , not Nottingham !! (ped ant ic , lol)
and the CCBC in Northampton is not a court , its a government office , a Business Centre to administer the initial paperwork stages and to allocate a local county court , which is the real and actual court
Thanks Redx - duly noted and changed - all pedantry much appreciated :T0 -
He is not being pedantic, in matters such as this, 100% accuracy is a sine qua non..You never know how far you can go until you go too far.0
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Well done on your win - was it ever going to be anything else with C-m by your side!
Your offer of help is generous and, for someone who has been through the experience, Gold Dust.0
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