NON-STOP PCN from Southend Airport ******* Case Dismissed, Now VCS appealing ********

Unicorn51

Their witness statement  32: States no public right of way.

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld199899/ldjudgmt/jd990304/jones07.htm

Especially read the first paragraph in which their Lordships state that the road is a Public Highway to which the public have a right of access.

IamWood

The case is confirmed to be held in person at my local court on next Tuesday 06/10. It's my first time to be in court. I'm feeling a bit nervous tbh. Any tips would be really appreciated. Thanks!

Redx

IamWood said:

The case is confirmed to be held in person at my local court on next Tuesday 06/10. It's my first time to be in court. I'm feeling a bit nervous tbh. Any tips would be really appreciated. Thanks!

Read other recent court case threads that are imminent or concluded , especially since covid , plus the telephone hearings thread too

You won't get better advice than reading the comments from those who have just been through it , whereas the rest of us have rarely if ever been through it at all ( the regulars here try to avoid the situation in the first place !! )

Le_Kirk

If it s a F2F, here is a video (normally posted by @KeithP) : -
www.youtube.com/watch?v=n93eoaxhzpU

IamWood

It's F2F.
How should I argue this rubbish point from VCS WS?
S38: It is argued that the Byelaws are therefore arbitrary. It is not mandatory that the Byelaws are utilised so long as the relationship is established between the two parties.
Byelaws is attached for reference. Thanks a lot!

nosferatu1001

Assuming this is a case where the driver HAS NOT been identified, then it doesnt matter whether they are arbitrary or mandatory; they exist, the land is therefore NOT RELEVANT LAND for the purposes of POFA, and they CANNOT therefore hold the keeper liable 
They have to prove the D is the driver  
YOu put them to strict proof. 

IamWood

Unfortunately I have admitted that I am the driver during my initial appeal (sorry, first PCN). I stopped to ask the on-site traffic officer for direction actually in my case, the picture had my full image getting out of my car going to the officer. Is there anything else I can attack it?
Thank you!

nosferatu1001

I wouldnt worry too much about byelaws then. They can operate a contractual scheme, but they cannot allow something - via contract - that is prohibited under law or byelaw. So if the byelaws state youre not allowed to stop, they cannot offer you a contract to stop - you cannot offer a contract for something that is illegal. 

Coupon-mad

Find the section in the new PAS Code of Practice (Government statutory draft) that says that byelaws prevail (or something like that).  It definitely says it and I'm not linking the place, because I want ALL posters to read the PAS and comment on it!  On your case though, why not add this to your papers and take it to court to show the will of the Government. 

Byelaws are not arbitrary and can't be ignored (if they have a section about parking of vehicles).  A private firm can't offer an alternative 'contract' because byelaws trump contract law and the new Code of Practice says as much...if you dig and read it all.

PLEASE CHANNEL YOUR ANGER ABOUT THIS PATHETIC CHARGE TO CHANGE THE WAY THE PARKING INDUSTRY WORK:

CALLING ALL NEWBIES! 

 

An urgent task – deadline approaching in a week or so:

Please now make a real difference because not enough people have yet, and time is running out. 

The Government is consulting for just a few more days, about a new statutory code of practice (CoP) and framework intended to rein in the rogue parking firms. 

Does it go far enough?  Read and comment on the draft CoP proposal and the enforcement framework consultation (two separate consultation documents).

HOW TO DO THE SUBMISSIONS:

BSI PAS 232 – COMMENTING ON THE CODE OF PRACTICE AS DRAFTED:

1.    You will need to register then log in, to comment on the CoP and enter an occupation even if you are retired or a homemaker.  

 

2.    Register, log into the BSI page, and download & read the cover letter here:

https://standardsdevelopment.bsigroup.com/projects/2020-00193#/section

 

3.    Read the cover letter again and note the suggested extra questions... if you agree that, say, the 'loading/unloading and dropping off, asking for directions, and disabled people parking on double yellows as they can on street' activities listed should be exempt (not parking events, what do you think?) then please go to the Annexes at the end of the PAS Code and find the one about Exempt Vehicles and state what other activity you think should be added to the exempt list. 

 

4.    Download the PAS itself and start commenting on what you wish to say something about.  Quick links to each section appear on the left of your page. 

 

You don’t have to comment on everything, e.g. you might want to skip the definitions and focus on later sections, and certainly look at the Annex tables at the end that show things like consideration & grace periods and exemptions.

 

5.    Submit comments when you are happy with them. Don’t just ‘SAVE’ and forget!

 

THAT IS HALF THE JOB DONE!

THE MHCLG CONSULTATION IS EASIER AS IT IS JUST A LIST OF QUESTIONS. 

 

6.    You can do it first if preferred or pushed for time:

https://forms.office.com/Pages/ResponsePage.aspx?id=EGg0v32c3kOociSi7zmVqAVPfAOtwRxLhHRwQ610oElUMzhQSVo0WUQ4SERVSEZaUU9DTUhFQ1VMUy4u

If your answers exceed 4000 characters (approx. 500 words to a single question or 16000 words (approx. 2500 words) for all the questions below, you can email your answers to parking@communities.gov.uk as long as you state who you are.

THESE ARE THE QUESTIONS YOU WILL SEE, FOR RESPONSES TO THE FRAMEWORK:

Q1 Do you agree or disagree that members of APAs should be required to use a single appeals service appointed by the Secretary of State?

Strongly agree/Somewhat agree/Neither agree nor disagree/Somewhat disagree/Strongly disagree

 

Q1.1 Please explain your answer

(free text)

 

 

Q2 Please provide any other feedback on the determination of appeals, including the funding model and features that an appeal service should offer e.g. telephone or in-person hearings, the ability to submit evidence online

(free text)

 

Q3 Please provide any comments you have on the proposal to enforce the Code by combining the ATA’s existing audit procedures with additional safeguards.

(free text)

 

Q4 Please outline any alternative means by which the Code could be monitored and enforced. You may wish to cite evidence from other regulatory frameworks which are relevant.

(free text)

 

Q5 Please provide any feedback you have on the proposed governance arrangements for monitoring the new Code of Practice

(free text)

 

Q6 Which parking charge system is most appropriate for private parking?

 a) the Three-tiered system

 b) Mirroring the Local Authority system

(free text)

 

 Q6.1 Please explain your answer. You may, for example, wish to make reference to other deterrent frameworks (for example, for railway tickets or traffic violations)

(free text)

 

 

Q7 What level of discount is appropriate:

40% as is currently offered in private parking and suggested in the three-tiered system, or

50% as is offered in Local Authority parking?

a) 40%

b) 50%

 

Q7.1 Please explain your answer, including whether the discount should be set at a different level

(free text)

 

 

 Q8 How should the level of parking charges be set and how should the levels be revised in future?

(free text)

 

 

Q9 Do you agree or disagree in principle with the idea of the Appeals Charter?

Agree/Disagree

 

Q9.1 Please explain your answer

(free text)

 

 

Q10 Do you agree or not that the examples given in the Appeals Charter are fair and appropriate? Agree/Disagree

 

Q10.1 Please explain your answer.

You may wish, for example, to suggest additional cases to be covered in an Appeals Charter or query existing examples.

(free text)

 

Q11 Do you agree or disagree that the parking industry should contribute towards the cost of the regulation?

Agree/Disagree

 

Q11.1 Please explain your answer.

(free text)

 

YOU CAN INSTEAD GIVE MORE CONCISE ANSWERS ONLINE, USING THE MHCLG PAGE LINK.

Don’t forget that answering these questions is the easier bit…

Looking at the BSI PAS (the draft code of practice itself) involves logging in and submitting comments again, and again and again and takes more time!

There is a discussion about PAS submissions and what the pages look like, here:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6195417/am-i-doing-something-wrong/p1

 

IamWood

Just got a letter from my local court, saying the hearing for tomorrow is now being held on phone. Gutted the changes were made in the last minute.