Parking Eye 10 min overstay, hired vehicle

solmyr

Hello,

New user here, so I hope I have done everything correctly so far. I have read the NEWBIE thread already and I have not revealed the identity of the driver. I will give you a short summary of my case so far and looking for advice on what grounds should I appeal if PE continue to pursue my case.

We paid for 1h parking and have been photographed as entering the carpark and leaving 1h10m50s later. The parking fare was paid 5min after entering the carpark and the car is seen to leave 5 min after the end of the parking period. I was going to appeal on grace period grounds but after looking at the advice here, I decided to use a template from a similar case. I compared my letter to what's explained and figured out I have the so called "golden ticket". I appealed on the grounds of non-compliance with PoFA to PE and POPLA but the evidence PE have provided shows a letter with the PoFA paragraph. I don't have that letter as I only received the "reminder" in which no PoFA was mentioned.

I can respond to their evidence now, and even if they have supplied the PoFA wording at the back of the letter, they still didn't provide the rental agreement so not sure if I should press on with that. If yes, what should I write? That their evidence still doesn't address the grounds of my appeal as they haven't provided the docs as directed by PoFA?

In terms of timings they were really quick, 1 week to rental company and afterwards 42 days until they sent me the first letter (although I have only received the second one - a reminder - another week later).

Thank you for your help so far.

MistyZ

Did you refer to POFA Schedule 4, para 14 in the POPLA appeal? If you did and they haven't sent you the relevant docs or provided any evidence that the docs are in their possession then you should win.

The key thing with hire car appeals is hammering home the message that the PPC have not sent the hire docs. This is what you now need to do in your comments on their evidence.

Refute any other so-called evidence that you can refute as well, but go for the absence of hire documents first.

solmyr

Thank you.

Yes, I did. Below is a section of the relevant section of the appeal:

The relevant provisions concerning hire vehicles are set out in Paragraphs 13 and 14 of Schedule 4, POFA; the conditions that the Creditor must meet in order to be able to hold the Hirer liable for the charge are set out in Paragraph 14.
Paragraph 14 (2) (a) specifies that in addition to delivering a Notice to Hirer within the relevant period, the Creditor must also provide the Hirer with a copy of the documents mentioned in paragraph 13(2) (i.e.
(a) a statement signed by or on behalf of the vehicle-hire firm to the effect that at the material time the vehicle was hired to a named person under a hire agreement;
(b) a copy of the hire agreement and
(c) a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement, together with a copy of the Notice to Keeper (i.e. the notice that had originally been sent to the lease company (as Registered Keeper)).
ParkingEye did not provide me with a copy of any of these documents.


In their evidence, they have submitted "document a)" and the notice to keeper - "document c)". However, these were not sent to me at the time and there's still no hire agreement in their evidence. I will leave that as a comment and soon enough we will know.

I was surprised to see a 50 page supporting evidence from PE which indicates they are willing to fight it.

MistyZ

Write something like:

'As stated in my appeal P.E. did not send me any of the documents specified in POFA 14 i.e. those mentioned in POFA para.13(2). All of the documents must be provided to the hirer for compliance with POFA. Although P.E.'s evidence now shows SOME of the documents they have still not been sent to me as hirer. And 13(2) b, 'a copy of the hire agreement' is NOT in their evidence. This appeal must therefore be allowed.'

I've seen exactly the same from P.E., they're not embarrassed by overkill, though there were no hire docs shown at the evidence stage. But POFA is clear that docs a, b, and c must be provided.

solmyr

Finally got the assessment from POPLA and I won my appeal on the basis of PoFA not followed (i.e. rental agreement not included and the pack they added later should have been sent with the initial notice)

Thank you all (especially for the pinned guides) for helping me feel in control during this stressful experience. The guides and templates from other users were really helpful. Thank you again!

Ralph-y

well done ...


may I kindly ask if you would post up the POPLA appeal on this thread



https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/76228693#Comment_76228693


as it may help others ...


again well done


Ralph:cool:

The_Deep

PE signs are rubbish, read this

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5972164/parking-eye-signs-oxford-road-reading

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams so consider complaining to your MP.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

MistyZ

Good news! Well done you.

solmyr

Done. Posted in the POPLA thread.

@The Deep
Their signage in this case was OK, it was at Waltham Abbey Gardens and they did send a 50 page pack showing how good their signs are, not that this makes it fair.

By the time I park, buy a ticket and leave, it genuinely takes 10 minutes especially with a 6 month baby in a car seat. I was mostly annoyed that they themselves stated I was 10 min late (with no seconds) in all communication with me and POPLA and still charged me even though I was only 50 sec or so above the 10min grace period on the ANPR camera's timestamps. From what I read here though the PoFA grounds are much stronger so I went with those.

Now I need to challenge the £40 "admin fee" from Europcar but that should be a much easier battle especially considering I am a longstanding customer up in their "privilege" levels.

Le_Kirk

solmyr wrote: »

Now I need to challenge the £40 "admin fee" from Europcar but that should be a much easier battle especially considering I am a longstanding customer up in their "privilege" levels.

Check the BVRLA guidelines and your paperwork for the lease/hire. You should find they can only charge you for penalties, NOT speculative invoices, which this was. Sometimes the T&Cs state they will cancel the admin fee if you win your appeal against the invoice.