Too late to try?

flamingjoe

So I only just got wind of this thread so I think it may be too late for me to act, but wanted to check.


I received a PCN last year from Parking Protection, having parked in a parent and child space for less than 5 minutes. At the time I appealed to them to say that the charge was in error as firstly, I was not the driver, and secondly there were two children in the car at the time, and as such the charge as in error.



They replied that because the children didn't get out with the driver we were in violation of the contract we had entered as per their signage. To this I replied that one child had left the car, and that the signage was not visible from the space.



I didn't receive any response from this email other than an automated reply stating that that I should wait 35 days for a decision. I then followed up with them 2 months later to say I assumed that no response meant they had decided to cancel the charge and was informed that they had replied previously (to the initial appeal) and as no payment was made they had passed it on to a debt recovery company. I received a letter from a debt recovery company but ignored it, and then one from a solicitor stating they would be taking it forward. Nothing happened for a long time, maybe 6 months, then I received a letter from the courts saying that they were making a claim against me. Stupidly, I knee-jerked and submitted a defence statement without taking the time to put in the time to research and plan it fully.


They have since sent me an email explaining that they had filed a Directions Questionnaire, noting that the case would be dealt eith on papers without a hearing as it is straightforward and costs of an oral hearing would be disproportionate. It also said they had decided not to mediate, not to be obstructive, but that it would likely not be beneficial. And finally that the client would be happy to listen to "any genuine payment proposals".


Is it best to put forward a payment proposal or is it still possible to/worth fighting?

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Thanks for any input you might have.
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KeithP

It is difficult, if not impossible, to answer your question without seeing the Defence that you have filed.

Meanwhile you need to be reading post #2 of [URL="https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/4816822NEWBIES thread[/URL] which explains the process from now through the court stages.

You should expect your Directions Questionnaire from the court next and that NEWBIES post will tell you exactly how to answer every question on it.

Quentin

You don't have to fall in with their bullying tactics to get you to agree to no hearing!

You will be getting your own dq shortly

Get up to speed with this by studying the newbies FAQ thread near the top of the forum

Post#2 there covers Court claims

Post up your defence here (redacted so you can't be identified) for advice

The_Slithy_Tove

flamingjoe wrote: »

I appealed to them to say that the charge was in error as firstly, I was not the driver, and secondly there were two children in the car at the time, and as such the charge as in error.

They replied that because the children didn't get out with the driver we were in violation of the contract we had entered as per their signage.

So, what does the signage say? I doubt very much it specifies what the child(ren) in the car must or must not do.

Need to know what your defence was.

fisherjim

The_Slithy_Tove wrote: »

So, what does the signage say? I doubt very much it specifies what the child(ren) in the car must or must not do.

Need to know what your defence was.

Can't speak for the OP's circumstance obviously but these scammers have included a new clause to cover that signage quoted half way down in this similar case:


https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/8138414/mum-fined-260-for-using-parents-parking-space-because-she-didnt-take-her-children-out-of-the-car/

The_Deep

If the children are left alone in the car, what prevents them from getting out whenever they wish. I think that the PPC would stuggle to convince a judge.

Also he/she may well conclude that such a clause was an unfair term in a consumer contract.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/unfair-terms-explained-for-businesses-full-guide

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams so complain to your MP.

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up, and access to the DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/enacted

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

flamingjoe

Thanks for the support... I may be down but not out. I will do some reading in the mentioned areas, but in the meantime my defence is as follows:

The claim raised against me is false as the original fine was
erroneous and I do not accept it.

We parked at xxxx intending to visit the
xxxx store to purchase a few items that we needed.

Having parked in the child and parent parking bay, the driver got
out of the car and I released the children's seat belts. The
children then decided that neither of them wanted to go to the
shop any more. As such we decided that rather than forcing them o
go against their will we would just leave and get the items at
another time.

I then tried to return the children to their car seats and fasten
their seat belts. This was not a problem for my son, but my
daughter became very distressed and would not cooperate in
returning to her seat.
I
t quickly became clear that without physically forcing her to do
so she would not return to her seat until she had settled down. As
we would be waiting for this to happen anyway, the driver went to
the store to get what we had come for, and by the time they
returned both children had calmed down and were sitting safely in
their seats, with belts fastened so we left.

In total we were parked in the space for 4 minutes, and I saw no
other car enter the car park, so no one was inconvenienced by our
being in the space.

We were also unaware that in order to be deemed worthy of using
the child and parent parking bay, it was necessary for the parent
to be accompanied by a child outside the car, had we realised we
obviously would not have done so.

As it was, we didn't see the signage informing us of this rule as
it was a few metres away from the space, next to a space for blue
badge holders and the text not clear enough to read from any
distance. Had I seen the sign, which I don't recall ever having
done before I was sent an image of it, I would have assumed it was
explaining the requirements for parking in the blue badge space,
instead of the child and parent bay we had stopped in.

flamingjoe

Also, the signage states:

No parking in a parent and child bay unless accompanied out of the vehicle by a child 12 year old or less.

Quentin

Is that the defence you sent to court,??

Coupon-mad

Looks like it.

There is a chance of winning but you have all your eggs in one basket and haven't even criticised the fake added costs or put them to proof of their landowner contract/authority.

flamingjoe

Indeed, mistakes were made, hoping I haven't torpedoed myself completely.