Electric vehicle investment

silverwhistle

50Twuncle wrote: »

Considering the cost of replacement EV batteries is around £200 per kWh (down from £1000 - 8years ago)

The average capacity of EV batteries is 40kWh - so a replacement power source needed after 8 years is currently £8k - which is enough to put me off buying an EV !

I can't think of a single post from you that is either accurate, well-informed or not negative.



As for areas of investment, all I can say to the OP is avoid coal and fossil fuels! Spread your money around a bit even in the electric vehicle environment.




Last year battery costs were down to $176 (that's dollars) per kWh and they're heading down rapidly. The experience of battery packs with proper battery management systems is that they last for the lifetime of the car. Have a look around Bloomberg, check out the experience of high mileage electric taxis around the world, talk to people with EVs.


I haven't got one but when my current car expires I'd hope to replace with an EV. There'll be no additional construction of a car, just a replacement.

DrEskimo

50Twuncle wrote: »

Considering the cost of replacement EV batteries is around £200 per kWh (down from £1000 - 8years ago)

The average capacity of EV batteries is 40kWh - so a replacement power source needed after 8 years is currently £8k - which is enough to put me off buying an EV !

Why would a replacement be needed after 8yrs?

50Twuncle

DrEskimo wrote: »

Why would a replacement be needed after 8yrs?

Because 8 years is apparently the average lifespan of an EV battery
70% charge holding ability at 8 years - at which point, they should be replaced to maintain range

DrEskimo

50Twuncle wrote: »

Because 8 years is apparently the average lifespan of an EV battery
70% charge holding ability at 8 years - at which point, they should be replaced to maintain range

According to who...?

AnotherJoe

50Twuncle wrote: »

Yes - but oil and gas are almost as polluting as coal...

Only for the narrow definition of pollution = CO2. For carcinogenic and otherwise noxious chemicals oil burnt in a car engine oil (aka petrol/diesel) is by far the worst.

50Twuncle wrote: »

And in any case - in 2016 the % renewable energy used in the UK was 27.99% - which means that 72% of the electricity produced was still from non-renewable sources (gas amd oil)
So MOST electricity produced in UK IS STILL from conventional power stations

And in 2018 it was 33% and so far this year it's running at 37% a trend that's clearly set to continue as the price of renewables continues to fall and the price of FF continues to rise. Won't be long before it's over 50%. And that's nothing to do with being green or such like, it's just pure economics. In the states coal is declining catastrophically just due to renewable prices falling.
So to get back to the OP the best way of investing in electric cars is by investing in renewables as they are taking over from FF. there is no way to invest in electric cars in the UK and investing in Tesla is not for the faint hearted.

And there's two things here, there's transport and there's general power consumption. Even if all electric use came from gas (forget coal and oil they are gone as generation sources) which soon the majority won't , the choice for cars is either electric or oil, and electric from renewables has a massive economic advantage over oil even before you factor in the efficiency of electric motors.
This is aside the costs in health terms of polluting oil burning cars.

AnotherJoe

50Twuncle wrote: »

Because 8 years is apparently the average lifespan of an EV battery
70% charge holding ability at 8 years - at which point, they should be replaced to maintain range

Rubbish. Tesla's are now up to 500k miles (far more than 8 years use) witha goal to get to 1 million. Other manufacturers will eventually catch up. Batteries at car end of life are now being repurposed (mostly into stationary storage) and when you said that the cost ofa new battery in 8 years time will be £x you forgot to account for in the massive drop in battery prices over that time, something you actually quoted in your post, so in 8 years time to replace a 40kWh battery will bea trivial cost and that's if the Car won't be reused as a lower mileage local runabout replacing the highly polluting old FF cars still remaining at that point.

I don't know if yiu have fallen for all the FUD put out by coal and FF proponents or have an axe to grind with all the half truths and out of date stuff you post ?

[Deleted User]

For those interested - https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0006dqn
Note the comments made by the Aston Martin designer about EVs during the programme
Fascinating - I think he mentions that the chassis is going to end up being a skateboard and designers will fundamentally change the look of a car around this

EDIT.. The discussion starts at 07:42

redux

AnotherJoe wrote: »

Rubbish. Tesla's are now up to 500k miles (far more than 8 years use) witha goal to get to 1 million

Yesterday I discovered an odd juxtaposition of Google search results.

Quite close to Mr Musk's boasts that the batteries will last 300 to 500,000 miles was an article about a car with 450,000 miles. Its third battery has now done 160,000 miles, after the first two were replaced under warranty. Their current battery warranties seem to be in the 100 or 125,000 area.

redux

50Twuncle wrote: »

Maybe I am missing something - but what EV costs just £4k ?

I don't know what car that person is talking about, but I'll take a guess, based on what I've noticed.

About 3 years ago it would have been possible to buy a 2012 built Citroen Zero or Peugeot Ion with only a coup!e of thousand miles for £4000 to £4500.

Now there are 40 to 60,000 mile 2012 examples for sale around £5000 to £6000.

(I already mentioned this in post 19)

Gadfium

50Twuncle wrote: »

Because 8 years is apparently the average lifespan of an EV battery
70% charge holding ability at 8 years - at which point, they should be replaced to maintain range

An you citate a source for this information?
Also, do you replace your petrol/diesel engine when it wears a bit and the MPG declines?