Getting a National Insurance number

chickn

Hi,

A bit of background :

I've been in receipt of council tax support for a while as I am on ESA. My wife has moved in with me not long ago - she has no recourse to public funds. The council wants her NI number (she does not have one) so they can process my claim.

Would my wife be able to get a NI number if she states she needs it because the local council needs it to process my CT support? She's not looking for work as she's pregnant and also cares for me, so doesn't have any evidence for job seeking. Any advice appreciated on the best way to get her a NI number. Thanks.

Dazed_and_confused

https://www.gov.uk/apply-national-insurance-number

chickn

Thanks, I've been on the gov site but I guess I really want to know if she can get a NI number for the reason that the council are asking for it?

calcotti

I recommend you get immigration advice. If she is included on such a claim it may be treated as having recourse to public funds which may prejudice her ability to renew her visa when the time comes. I think this will depend on whether or not the amount of CTR you get increases as a result of her inclusion, however this is a complex and specialist area of law.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/public-funds--2/public-funds

http://www.nrpfnetwork.org.uk/information/Pages/public-funds.aspx

A person who has recourse to public funds may be entitled to claim housing benefit and council tax reduction. However, if they are living with a partner who has NRPF, then before they make a claim they would need to find out from a benefits adviser:

Whether they have to include their partner's details on the housing benefit or council tax reduction claim
If they have to include their partner's details on the claim, whether they will receive an additional amount of benefit because of their partner's presence
If the person making the claim receives an additional amount because of their partner's presence then this could cause a problem for a person who has leave to remain with the NRPF condition. They would need to seek advice from an immigration adviser to find out whether this benefit claim will cause a problem for their immigration case, now or in the future.​

If you were previously living alone and entitled to a 25% Council Tax discount your CTR will have been based on 75% of the full Council Tax amount. When your wife moved in you would have lost the entitlement to the 25% discount and your CTR would then be based on the full Council Tax amount. In that situation you have received additional CTR as a result of your wife’s presence.

If you were not previously entitled to any discounts and were getting the maximum CTR allowed under your local authority then your wife’s presence will make no difference - although the council will require her added to the claim as any income or savings she has she will be taken into account.

WyldeRose

Hi Chickn, the fact that you only claim CTR does not prevent your wife being added to your CTRS claim as she would have a joint and several liability on your council tax account irrespective of her nationality or residency status. It is just a little more complicated.

Council Tax Support is provided by your Local Authority from their own funding. It is Not Public Funds. You would on the other hand, be advised by your Benefits assessor to seek independent immigration advice before continuing with your claim. You would also lose your Single Person's Discount as you would not be entitled to it.

People who are Subject to Immigration Control are split into two groups, those who are not required to apply for a National Insurance Number and the rest, who are required to do so.

1. Those who are exempt from applying for a NINO: Only illegal immigrants, Overstayers and asylum seekers are exempt from the requirement for a National Insurance Number, however once their residency status has been determined as "Leave to Remain/Limited Leave to Remain" they are then required to apply for a National Insurance Number in the same way as everyone else. The National Insurance document will also state that it does not automatically confer the right to Public Funds

2. Everyone else needs to apply for a National Insurance Number.

As she is not entitled to Public Funds, this means that she cannot claim:
- Child Benefit
- Tax credits
- Housing benefit as a named claimant on the claim
- Council tax support as a named claimant on the claim
- DWP benefits, such as Income support, Jobseekers Allowance, Emplyment and Support Allowance, maternity allowance, Carer's allowance

For your claim you would need to supply 2 forms of ID for your wife, your marriage certificate, her Home Office documentation, her passport which would show her visa (spouse visa, education, visitor's visa etc) with it's expiry date and whether or not Public funds can be claimed, her Biometric Residency card.

Your local authority can assist you by completing and sending off the DC1 - National Insurance Application, however please note that if she does not comply with the interview process for her NINO, your claim may stop.

You will also need to notify the Department for Works and Pensions that she is resident as you receive DWP benefits. The fact that she is now resident as your wife, may mean that your ESA ends and you need to claim Universal Credit as this is a significant change in circumstances. If you were entitled to Severe Disability Premium within your award, this may be written back and removed back to the date she moved in. Your wife because of her Immigration status would possibly not qualify for Universal Credit.

I hope this helps - Good Luck

calcotti

WyldeRose wrote: »

Council Tax Support is provided by your Local Authority from their own funding. It is Not Public Funds.

That is not what the two links I have already provided say.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/public-funds--2/public-funds
Council Tax Reduction is clearly listed as Public Funds.
This is further explained in the section I quoted from http://www.nrpfnetwork.org.uk/information/Pages/public-funds.aspx

WyldeRose wrote: »

The fact that she is now resident as your wife, may mean that your ESA ends and you need to claim Universal Credit as this is a significant change in circumstances.

It is possible to add a partner to an existing (legacy) ESA claim. It does not require a claim for UC. However OP needs to get immigration advice about this. UC is actually better at dealing with people on claims with NRPF than legacy benefits (provided the claimis processed properly).

WyldeRose

Hi Calcotti, for the wife to be excluded from claiming or being included on a claim for housing benefit or council tax support , she would have to be the named claimant, which is why I was quite specific in my reply.

There is big difference between someone making a claim in their own right and being included as a household member on a claim. She is a household member as defined in the HB Regs 2006 , whereas he is a British national with the right to make a claim and who has an existing CTRS claim.

Under the exceptions because of the nationality of a family member, a person who is subject yo immigration control is not considered as accessing public funds if it is thor partner who is receiving the funds they are entitled to.

By the way your "access to public funds" link is to a document that is 5 years out of date.

Try this one instead
You will find it on the Gov.uk website under the page "government/publications/public-funds"

The document you require is - Guidance oyn funds foreign nationals can claim (updated 21/01/2019)

As for Universal credit, I was also specific in that I stated "it may mean that ESA ends". I am a Revenues and Benefits decision maker, not a Universal credit decision maker and such that decision would be down to Universal credit.

But under normal circumstances, and this gents circumstances are anything but, a partner joining the household where a legacy benefit in pay, is a trigger for natural migration to a universal credit claim.

calcotti

WyldeRose wrote: »

. . a partner joining the household where a legacy benefit in pay, is a trigger for natural migration to a universal credit claim.

I don’t think this is correct for DWP benefits. Adding a partner is a change of circumstances to an existing claim and does not require a new claim so can be done. It is true for tax credits because for tax credits it is a change which would require a new claim which is not permitted, so claimant has to claim UC if they wish to continue to receive that support.

I think this is the document you are referring to https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/772305/Public_funds_v14.0ext.pdf

I still believe that where a claimant receives increased benefit as a result of the presence of someone with NRPF then that person can be treated as having had access to Public Funds. NRPF Network clearly indicate this is possible.

I think the problem is that the rules require the partner to be declared thus losing the CT discount and this will affect the amount of CTR payable.

This is complex and OP would do well to seek advice (and not just from an Internet forum).

WyldeRose

Hi Calcotti, yes that is the same document but on the publications website. Apologies for all the spelling mistakes in my previous post, my eyes don't work too well late at night.

If you take a look at Page 13, bottom right is the link to "exceptions because of the nationality of family members"

A person subject to immigration control is not considered as accessing public funds if it is
their partner who is receiving the funds they are entitled to.
Child and working tax credits are claimed jointly by couples. If only one member of a couple
is subject to immigration control, then for most tax credits purposes, neither are treated as
being subject to immigration control. See related link: Child tax credit and working tax credit:
exceptions, Exception 5 for further detail.
A person subject to immigration control can claim certain public funds when they have a
right to reside in the UK if they live with a family member who is a:
• British citizen
• national of a country in the European Economic Area (EEA)

You are correct in that adding the partner may increase the claimant's amount of CTRS even though he loses his SPD, how this would be viewed by the Home Office is something that he would have to clarify with them via his solicitor.

Because of the NINO requirement, the claimant is in a catch 22 situation. If she is not regarded as excluded from NINO requirements, then she must apply for one. If she does not apply for one to be included on the claim then the claim is made Ineligible/cancelled and the claimant loses out completely. Satisfying the conditions of claim in circumstances such as this can be a minefield.

But under normal circumstances, and this gents circumstances are anything but, a partner joining the household where a legacy benefit in pay, is a trigger for natural migration to a universal credit claim.

Because of the rollout of UC, a partner joining or leaving he household is a change of circs that would trigger UC, except if they both receive the same legacy benefit, in which case they just merge the claims. But for the claimant, because of the current change of circs:

a) New partner in the household - he may or may not be required to claim UC but in the capacity of a single person. Alternatively they may leave him on legacy benefits in the short term as he would remain on a single claim of ESA.

(The new partner in the household would mean that he would lose his entitlement to Severe disability premium if it is in pay, due to another close family member over the age of 18 being in the household)

b) The wife is pregnant and depending on how far off full term she is they again may decide to migrate him to UC as he would need to claim CHBen and Tax credits in the very near future.

calcotti

The bit you have quoted is not specific enough to answer the question. I am simply aware of the warning I quoted on the NRPF Network website which is generally considered very reliable. The OP claiming benefits they are entitled to does not affect the NRPF partner just because they live with the partner. However the NRPF Network suggests that if the amount the existing claimant receives increases as a result of the NRPF partners presence then the NRPF partner may be treated as being in receipt of public funds. However I'm not going to debate this any more because it is so specialist and I don't know the correct answer.

In respect of your last point simply adding a partner to a DWP benefit such as income based ESA is allowed because it is not a change of circumstances requiring a new claim, unlike tax credits, and therefore a claimant with a new partner does not have to claim UC. In this case there are obviously other considerations to do with NRPF. For others there will also be circumstances where claiming UC may be desirable (such as you suggest - having a child so wanting the child element).