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POPLA appeal letter - staff member - hospital car park

Hello.
I'm a doctor at an NHS hospital. I have a staff permit which I pay £40 a month for the car-park, however the parking for staff has become worse and worse since I have worked there. Closing large sections of it, whilst demand increases. I got 2 parking notices on my window for "not parking within permitted bays" and in one also "blocking other vehicles". In neither was I blocking other vehicles and I have photos to prove it. In both I indeed was not parked within any bays, due to the lack of capacity mentioned above.

Car is registered under my partners name and she received the PCNs in the post, which i appealed using her name and the templates, got my rejections and my POPLA codes.

Now I just wanted to check what I should be submitting in my appeal letter.
So far I was just going to copy and paste the 5 templates from Coupon Mad.

Is there anything else I should or shouldn't be doing?

The firm is CPP - Car Parking Partnership.

Thanks for any help.
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Comments

  • Redx
    Redx Posts: 38,084 Forumite
    Eighth Anniversary 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    a complaint should be made to the trust as well, to get them involved and get the pcn,s cancelled

    see these NHS principles

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles/nhs-patient-visitor-and-staff-car-parking-principles

    yes start drafting popla appeal (s)

    bear in mind that the person receiving the letTers is the one who is legally involved and should be doing all of this , so if that is not you get it all done under the keepers name (EVEN IF YOU ARE DOING THE DONKEY WORK), as it is the keeper who could end up in court if the popla appeals fail (if this is in england and wales, not scotland or N.I.)

    it may help if you name the hospital or the trust , seeing as you named CPP as the PPC
  • Tugay44
    Tugay44 Posts: 14 Forumite
    Thanks

    Yes I'm not naming myself as keeper. All in my wife's name.

    It's princess Alexandra hospital in Harlow.

    Can I include the the NHS parking principles in my appeal?

    Also I'm the one with parking permit, I'm the staff member. Can I still mention all this (ie things relating to having a permit) if I'm appealing in wife's name? As long as I just cite the detail and don't ever mention who is the staff member/ driver?
  • Redx
    Redx Posts: 38,084 Forumite
    Eighth Anniversary 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    edited 4 May 2019 pm31 3:25PM
    check if CPP met POFA 2012 , IF thery failed then the keeper has no liability in which case its not worth outing the drivers permit etc, but the keeper can cite the fact that the driver has a valid paid for permit which was on show (if it was etc)

    the point about the principles was that the permit holder should be complaining (not appealing) to the trust who issued the permit and so who the contract to park is with (the paid for parking contract with the trust is a separate issue) and this should have been done right at the start , quoting those NHS principles which have been in force for several years


    you do realise that paying for a permit means you have a legal contract with them , you pay your money and in return you expect to be able to park in a bay , same as if I pay for a pint of beer in a pub I expect a pint of beer in return , not some mish mash excuse of a reply saying they only have a few glasses so cannot fulfil the contract because they are all out on the tables being used so we will keep your money and not honour our part of the deal


    ideally this need quashing BEFORE any popla appeal, but do not miss the deadline for the popla appeal which is about 32 days max

    if CPP have complied with POFA then the keeper should have named the driver and the driver appeals with all the ammunition including the NHS principles , but in your quest to help your partner you have not separated out the issues and so have not dealt with them within their own context (its 2 separate contracts)

    a KEEPER popla appeal is based on the following principles

    POFA2012 non compliance
    no landowner authority
    poor and inadequate signage
    BPA CoP failures etc


    ie: - legal arguments
  • Tugay44
    Tugay44 Posts: 14 Forumite
    Thanks.
    So I should just paste the 4 templates you mentioned.
    I need to appeal this weekend so unfortunately can't take pics of their poor signage to attach as evidence.
    Should I just appeal with the template. Then add photos at later date in reply to any comments they make?
  • Redx
    Redx Posts: 38,084 Forumite
    Eighth Anniversary 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    yes you can use the templates , but any evidence has to go in with the appeal, not later , so photos would be embedded within your saved pdf

    you cannot supply any further evidence including photos after the appeal

    you get 2000 characters to rebut their evidence pack , no additions , no attachments , no photos , nothing other than 2000 characters

    when this popla appeal is submitted , choose OTHER and attach the popla appeal as a pdf to the bin icon and ensure it has uploaded

    do not fill in any boxes or options , and if necessary put POPLA APPEAL ATTACHED only

    so save the appeal as a pdf and upload it choosing OTHER, ignore the rest
  • nigelbb
    nigelbb Posts: 3,816 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper
    Tugay44 wrote: »
    The firm is CPP - Car Parking Partnership.
    The firm is actually ParkingEye trading as Car Parking Partnership. PE seem to like using this brand name at hospitals for some reason. They also use generic signs that refer to private parking & the landowner without actually naming the landowner.

    As you pay the Trust for a permit to park you need to check the T&Cs but it's abundantly clear that the contract for parking is with the Trust & that PE t/as CPP can offer nothing so cannot enforce any other contract on the driver.

    If PE have satisfied the requirements of POFA 2012 to hold the RK responsible for parking charges incurred by the driver then your best defence is that the driver had a pre-existing contract to park with the Trust so you will have to be named in the appeal.

    However if PE have not satisfied the requirements of POFA 2012 to hold the RK responsible for parking charges incurred by the driver then the easiest appeal point for POPLA is this non-compliance.
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 144,625 Forumite
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    Tugay44 wrote: »
    Thanks

    Yes I'm not naming myself as keeper. All in my wife's name.

    It's princess Alexandra hospital in Harlow.

    Can I include the the NHS parking principles in my appeal?

    Also I'm the one with parking permit, I'm the staff member. Can I still mention all this (ie things relating to having a permit) if I'm appealing in wife's name? As long as I just cite the detail and don't ever mention who is the staff member/ driver?

    Is there no scope for you to complain to the Facilities Manager at your work to cancel it?

    Needs doing BEFORE you even think about POPLA and it's the most tried & tested, easy and likely successful way to get a private PCN cancelled.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top or bottom of any page where it says:
    Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • Tugay44
    Tugay44 Posts: 14 Forumite
    I'm already at the Popla stage. Appeal to CPP was rejected.
    If PE have satisfied the requirements of POFA 2012 to hold the RK responsible for parking charges incurred by the driver then your best defence is that the driver had a pre-existing contract to park with the Trust so you will have to be named in the appeal.

    However if PE have not satisfied the requirements of POFA 2012 to hold the RK responsible for parking charges incurred by the driver then the easiest appeal point for POPLA is this non-compliance.

    How do I determine this?
  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 40,993 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    Tugay44 wrote: »
    I'm already at the Popla stage. Appeal to CPP was rejected.
    But the suggestion is that to appeal to Facilities Management before submitting your PoPLA appeal.


    Tugay44 wrote: »
    How do I determine this?
    By comparing your PCN with the criteria specified in POFA2012.

    There is a link to Schedule 4 of POFA in post #1 of the NEWBIES thread, or Google will find it easily.
  • Tugay44
    Tugay44 Posts: 14 Forumite
    Well they mention POFA 8(2)b and f. I can't really see how they would have not complied with it tbh
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