Cambelt snapped within 7 days from purchase

angrycrow

It is possible, even likely that the belt was changed as per the service history but other parts like the tensioner or water pump were skipped.

First thing to do is establish why the belt failed. Often another component seizes which causes the belt to strip teeth and the engine to go bang.

12 years ago I did manage to get a 75% contribution on engines repairs after a cambelt snapped on a car I had picked up 2 weeks before. Trading standards were involved as they already had a file open on the garage. The car was also miss described as a higher spec version with after market and second hand parts fitted. The brakes were also in very poor borderline dangerous condition. Trading standards intervened and negotiated the dealer contribution against the repairs but were very clear had it just been a cambelt failure the garage would not have been forced to contribute. This was in the days when TS would still help private individuals.

Sorry OP but the odds are not great for you. I would give this 50/50 in a civil court.

kozlikha

Also this, where does it state that 8 year old car is an old car and where does it state that 140k miles is a lot of miles for the year and overall? This is what the garage may claim, but is it a fact? No it isn't. Did the dealer state that car has been reduced in price based on whatever factors? No they did not. Did the dealer state that warranty is for £200 per claim? No they did not. Can they prove that there was no fault at the time of purchase? No they can not. I will try to look for other reasoning to support my case.

AdrianC

Somebody is getting very confused between messenger and message.

Aylesbury_Duck

kozlikha wrote: »

Look, who is a qualified solicitor here? Who went to court with a dealer? These are mere opinions, but I'm to accept them as law? Come on.

If you want a qualified legal opinion, pay for it. It was your choice to post a whole series of questions on a general motoring forum frequented mainly by legally-unqualified people. You don't like the answers you're getting? Fine, but I hope you can see they are critically challenging your assertion that you are absolutely in the right which might help you eventually get some sort of remedy for your misfortune.

If you'd prefer people to just say "there there, the nasty dealer sold you a pup and you're due a full refund plus a hamper" then just say so and save us all the trouble, but it won't help your case. Critical challenge just might.

debtdebt

kozlikha wrote: »

Also this, where does it state that 8 year old car is an old car and where does it state that 140k miles is a lot of miles for the year and overall? This is what the garage may claim, but is it a fact? No it isn't. Did the dealer state that car has been reduced in price based on whatever factors? No they did not. Did the dealer state that warranty is for £200 per claim? No they did not. Can they prove that there was no fault at the time of purchase? No they can not. I will try to look for other reasoning to support my case.

140k miles for an 8 year old vehicle is high mileage. Average annual mileage for a vehicle is 10k-12k so the average mileage for this age of vehicle would be around 96k miles. This vehicle has done around 40k over the average.

Anyway, you don't seem to be accepting any advice from posters which don't accord with your own warped views. You don't seem to care about this, you don't seem to care about that.

Here's some advice that you can take on board or choose to ignore, it's up to you. If you don't get any joy from the garage, you're going to have to spend more money either way to either fix the car or prove the defect was there at time of purchase.

I personally believe that cam belts just "let go" without warning and sticking within the service parameters limits this risk. However, want to prove that there was a pre existing fault with the car, you need evidence. A quote from a backstreet garage simply won't be enough to stand up in Court. You need to spend a few hundred quid on instructing an automotive engineer to prepare a report detailing what may have been wrong with the car AT THE TIME OF SALE to cause the cam belt to fail. Use this report as part of your claim against the garage.

Solicitors are expensive. Go and seek legal advice if you wish but you will have to pay. Hourly rates start at around £100 for a basic paralegal rising to hundreds of pounds an hour for a partner. If you issue in the Small Claims Track, you WILL NOT recover costs even if you win. Keep that in mind. Even if you do win, you may face difficulties enforcing judgment. The garage might liquidate the limited company (if it is so) and restart again.

Personally, I don't think you have a case but then again, you probably don't care and think the world owes you a refund.

Mercdriver

Also bear in mind should you win, and it gets protracted like my case against a property surveyor you do not get all your costs back. You get 'agreed costs' which is not the same thing. In my case we are in the 11th year, and will end up receiving less money than we spent. Yours won't be as protracted as that, but it will not be clear cut either and how reasonable you appear to be will become important.

Did you go in all guns blazing when the fault happened? I understand it is upsetting to find your wife and children in that position, but in all things legal, it's best to calm down first before acting in a way that can influence future outcomes.

Make yourself look reasonable and you will have more sympathy from the judge. If the dealer comes across as more reasonable, he might be more persuasive than you, which is crucial in a civil court, as balance of probabilities can go either way.

There is a good chance that the judge will rule that you have simply been unlucky and there was no way the dealer could reasonably predict the failure on the basis of the knowledge he has of the car, and the age and mileage of the car.

You have to prove his negligence. Court should be a last resort not a first suggestion and the court system takes this view seriously and if you fail to use mediation for example, costs can go against you, even if you win the judgement. You need to have yourself perceived as trying to resolve this without getting the courts involved, not using it at the start.

As far as warranties are concerned, I am frankly amazed that you don't know that aftermarket warranties are generally not worth the paper they are written on, and if the dealer threw it in with the deal as a closer, then you haven't paid for it. They are an insurance product, not a warranty as such. Insurance companies do not make profit by paying out.

EdGasketTheSecond

That nasty dealer sold you a pup and you are due a full refund plus a hamper


I am of the opinion that the law says that the car must be fit for purpose and as it only lasted two weeks it cannot have been fit for purpose. I think the OP is entitled to a full refund under current legislation.


Quote from Which?
"
When you buy a second-hand car from a used-car dealership in the UK, you have rights under the Consumer Rights Act (which replaced the Sale of Goods Act from 1 October 2015). You should expect the car to:

• be of satisfactory quality (taking into account its age and mileage)
• meet any description given to you when you were buying it (whether in the ad or in discussions prior to sale)
• be fit for purpose (in this case, to get you from A to B safely).

It's important that you take into account the mileage, age and how the car is described to you.
If the second-hand car does not meet these requirements, you have the right to claim against the used-car dealer for breach of contract."


A car that only lasts two weeks clearly does not satisfy point 3 above. I really dont think any judge will be interested in the technicalities of timing belts; they won't need to go into that level of detail.

DUTR

EdGasketTheSecond wrote: »

That nasty dealer sold you a pup and you are due a full refund plus a hamper


I am of the opinion that the law says that the car must be fit for purpose and as it only lasted two weeks it cannot have been fit for purpose. I think the OP is entitled to a full refund under current legislation.


Quote from Which?
"
When you buy a second-hand car from a used-car dealership in the UK, you have rights under the Consumer Rights Act (which replaced the Sale of Goods Act from 1 October 2015). You should expect the car to:

• be of satisfactory quality (taking into account its age and mileage)
• meet any description given to you when you were buying it (whether in the ad or in discussions prior to sale)
• be fit for purpose (in this case, to get you from A to B safely).

It's important that you take into account the mileage, age and how the car is described to you.
If the second-hand car does not meet these requirements, you have the right to claim against the used-car dealer for breach of contract."


A car that only lasts two weeks clearly does not satisfy point 3 above. I really dont think any judge will be interested in the technicalities of timing belts; they won't need to go into that level of detail.

Did the car only last two weeks though? As you have mentioned and others, the price and age will have some bearing, equally lets imagine the new owner was driving at night and the headlamps had failed (fuse bulbs) the car would be undrivable under the circumstance , would a full refund be also due?
The dealer perhaps couldn't know the full true history of the car in the last six months and can only go by the paperwork submitted.

If the OP is challenging the trader that they were in full knowledge of an upcoming fault, there is a high chance the OP will not win.

kozlikha

It is reasonable to expect that damage to have happened to a £1000 car, not to a £3500+ one and it happened on day 7 of ownership. As it happened so quickly, this makes it not fit for purpose (30 day period). As far as I'm concerned I have a case, of this was reasonable to happen to happen to car of this age/mileage then it wouldn't be priced at £3500, think about it, market prices in these sort of things and £3.5k car should have lasted longer than 7 days, that is the paramount factor in all of this.

And to answer the poster who suggests I don't listen to advice I state again I am not here for advice based on what you think, but what people experience was taking car dealers to small claims based on similar experiences. Why would I want YOUR opinion? Who are you? Lol

littlerock

I would think the fact that the dealer advertised it as having recently had a new cambelt which was written in the service history, would allow OP to argue he had reasonable expectations that it would not fail for next 50,000 miles from date of replacement. If the car was sold as seen that would be different.