Carers Element on UC

calcotti

Stuckinarut wrote: »

I thought I'd update to say that they told me to put my reasons I didn't apply earlier and a decision maker would decide however this could take 28 days. I'm not holding out much hope as waiting on a decision on a mand recon since 30th January.

You simply need to explain that you applied as soon as the PIP award was made. Your were not eligible prior to the decision but now that it has been made the carer element should be back dated.

DWP shouldn't be asking for you to state this they should simply be applying the rules but it's best to do as they ask in order to get matters progressed.

If you wish you can include a reference to Advice to Decision Makers Chapter A4. I believe paragraph A4220 is the most relevant.

Stuckinarut

They confirmed it was received 30th January but not passed to a DM until 14th Feb. I asked on my journal and got a reply on Monday saying they couldn't tell me a time period.

Stuckinarut

Thanks, I'm going to go update my journal now and add that in, and fingers crossed they see sense.

Stuckinarut

Further update. This was added to my journal.

Hi, the reason it needs to go to a DM is that you only declared you were a carer on 30/03/2019, so this is classed as late reporting of a change. Regards

calcotti

When was the PIP decision made? Provided this was shortly before 30/03/2019 I think you should post a note along the lines of
My partner received his PIP decision on xxxx. Prior to the award of PIP I did not meet the definition of carer for UC purposes because he was not in receipt of a qualifying benefit and so could not have advised you I was a carer prior to that decision. However now that the award has been made I meet the carer definition andbelieve I am entitled to the carer element backdated tothe same date as the PIP award start date.

Stuckinarut

The money was received on the Wed and I updated uc on the Saturday. I didn't think I needed to tell them prior to that as before PIP me being a carer would have made absolutely no difference to my claim it's not like my commitments would change as I already work full time earning enough to not have commitments. I have asked for them to confirm which regulation states that I need to go to a DM. I'm starting to get really angry with them as already have a mandatory reconsideration in from 30th Jan to try get hubby into lcwra group and still waiting so can't see them dealing with carers element very quickly. When I ask I'm just told there is no update.

Stuckinarut

This needs read from bottom to top, but this is where I'm at just now.

Hi , the policy can be found on GOV.UK website. Regards John Case

10 Apr 2019 at 10:42am So can you provide me details of the policy in which this is stated, as I am unable to find anything which suggests what you are saying?

10 Apr 2019 at 9:51amHi There is no regulation to support this it is Universal Credit Policy. Regards June

June

9 Apr 2019 at 9:29pm But prior to 30/03/2019 me being a carer had no relevance as it made no difference until PIP was awarded? Can you point me to the regulations that support this?

9 Apr 2019 at 12:46pm Hi, the reason it needs to go to a DM is that you only declared you were a carer on 30/03/2019, so this is classed as late reporting of a change. Regards John Case ManagerReply

John

6 Apr 2019 at 8:05amI did and John was helpful, however I am unsure why I am required to wait 28 days. I would like to point to Advice to Decision Makers Chapter A4. I believe paragraph A4220 is relevant to me where my uc decision should be superseded so not sure why a decision needs to be made by a decision maker when it would appear that it's more a procedure that it should be backdated. If my research is incorrect I'd be grateful to be pointed in the direction of where it says it doesn't need to be backdated? Thanks

Ineededaname

You are asking people who are not aptly trained on legislation and guidelines to answer questions they cannot answer. That is the purpose of the decision makers. They will give you a decision and if you request the full decision, this will include the information on applicable legislation they have used to make their decision.

They have answered your questions but you do not like the answer. 'The reason it needs to go to a DM is that you only declared you were a carer on 30/03/2019, so this is classed as late reporting of a change'

It really is as simple as that. You might not have considered it relevant to tell them you were caring for your husband before the PIP award was granted, but that is besides the point. You have to report all changes in your circumstances when they happen, and caring for someone is one of the things listed as a change you must tell them about. As you only told them in March it is late reporting of a change and it is up to a decision maker to consider if the increased amount can be paid from an earlier date. You are essentially applying for a previous decision(s) (your payments) to be altered. Your messages won't get you anywhere because the case managers replying to you on the journal cannot make that decision. They have taken the action they can take by referring this to a decision maker. You just need to wait.

You are asking them to quote policy at you that they can't provide. The DWP administers the legislation, but the legislation does not state the particulars of how this is managed. In this case it is simply one of job roles. The legislation does not define who must do what, only that it is done. If that makes sense? Even if John was a qualified lawyer, it is not in his job remit to take this action. You asking him to do so because you found a paragraph of guidance doesn't mean he can do it, and what do you expect him to show to you to explain that he can't? It doesn't exist. The paragraph of guidance you are using is actually from the ADM.. which stands for advice for decision making

A4220 could also be seen as a bit of a red herring on this case. It is referring to changes in benefit entitlement that impact the UC award. The change in benefit entitlement in itself has no impact on the UC award. If you didn't care for your husband, or if someone else cared for him, your UC award would not change as a result of him receiving PIP. Had you declared yourself as a carer in October, but were not eligible for the carers element, and you now would be due to the recent award of PIP, it follows that the carers element would now be backdated. The issue once again reverts to you not informing them you were caring for your husband.

Is my interpretation right? Is Calcotti's right? Who knows. Law is complicated. This is why you need to wait for the decision maker, and if you disagree with the decision they give follow the appeal procedures. I appreciate this may be difficult to hear due to the trouble you have had in relation to the other decision, but your messages on the journal aren't going to get you anywhere. You also need to treat the two issues separately. Take a step back and look at this in isolation. You only spoke to them about this for the first time on 30/03/19. Give them reasonable time to take action.

If you want to do something about the other issue, ask to speak to a manager, submit an official complaint, speak to your MP etc. Letting your frustration impact on the caring issue isn't going to help. The best thing you can do for this is to ensure that your argument for backdating is as detailed and strong as it can be.

calcotti

OP, you will need to wait for the DM make a decision. You asked in your opening post whether the carer element will be backdated, it is my opinion that it should be. You don’t yet have a DWP decision, if backdating is refused you can then challenge that decision if necessary.

indeedaname, obviously we don’t know what has been said previously by OP to DWP, if anything, about looking after their partner which might be taken into account in the Claimant Commitment. However as the OP did not meet the definition of a carer for UC purposes until the PIP was made I find it hard to see how they can be treated as late reporting that they are a carer. I accept however that others may take a different view!

huckster

From what I have come across, it appears backdating of carers element is only allowed, if the claimant advised of the caring activity at the time. So for example someone unemployed advised their Work Coach that they had caring responsibilities for a disabled person, which would affect their claimant commitment.

If someone never told UC of a caring responsibility, until a PIP claim was succesfully backdated for a disabled person they cared for, then why would UC be compelled to change the UC claim to when PIP started ? There was no previous indication of any caring activity.