Court Claim Help needed.

Coupon-mad

Glad to hear you are reading similar threads. Not everyone does but it's the best way to learn what to do and expect, and bodes well for your outcome.

iamsamrat1

I have now submitted my DQ. Just out of curiosity , I have received my SAR from euro parking services and there is no mentionn of POFA on any of their paperwork about driver/keeper. There was nothing put of the windscreen at the time.... and the first correspondence was NTK letter. Also the time.inthe car park was 1 min 26 seconds could I argue this is insufficient time to read the signs and enter a contract . Thanks

Coupon-mad

I have received my SAR from euro parking services and there is no mentionn of POFA on any of their paperwork about driver/keeper. There was nothing put of the windscreen at the time.... and the first correspondence was NTK letter.

OK, so on the NTK is there nothing saying 'you' will be liable if they have not got the driver details by 28/29 days beginning with the day after the PCN (NTK) was served?

What was the timeline between parking event and receipt (NOT DATE) of NTK?

Also the time.inthe car park was 1 min 26 seconds could I argue this is insufficient time to read the signs and enter a contract .

Definitely. In your witness statement and evidence.

iamsamrat1

3 days between parking date and letter sent date.
It does say I have 28 days to inform them of the driver name or they will have the right to recover from keeper. Sorry I just thought with it not specifically referring to POFA there may be a loophole.

Coupon-mad

OK so it's a POFA NTK but issued by post, based on some self-ticketer taking photos and not putting a PCN on the car, like this defence I wrote re a Euro case like yours:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/75711757#Comment_75711757

You can use some of those words in your later Witness Statement.

What did you final version defence say?

iamsamrat1

Hi, Apologies as I have not been on the foum for a while and did not see the last post. I have since been served a court date for early Sep and believe gladstones are intending to go through with it. I have reviewed some of the witness statement examples on the forum and tried to put one together. It is a basic draft and am aware it will probably need a lot of editing. I have taken some of the wording from the above link that you shared in relation to self ticketers. Please could you look over it and tell me wht you think.
Thanks

I XXX am the Registered Keeper of Vehicle DNXXXX but was not driving the vehicle on the material date.

1.On the day in question the driver entered the car park at 1-4 xxxxxxx which serves the local express supermarket. There were no visible car parking signs or contracts at the entrance to the car park. The driver parked the vehicle and utilised the services of the cash machine.

2.The time of entering the car park as evidenced in the Notice to keeper dated the 15/05/2018 was: 11:14:59 and the time of leaving the car park was 11:16:26. – See Evidence PR Folder 1
The time Elapsed from entering the car park to leaving the car park is 1 minute 27 Seconds. The driver did not have a sufficient amount of time from entering and leaving the car park, to approach one of the scattered signs, read the terms of conditions in full and enter into a legally binding contract.

2.(i).It Is noted that the time entering the car park was 11:14:59 and the time the first photograph of the vehicle was taken was 11:15:18. Which means there was only 19 seconds from entering the car park before the attendant decided the terms were breached and a PCN was issued. I believe it is impossible for any person to read the signage and enter a legally binding contract in such a short space of time. – See Evidence PR Folder 1

3.Further, the time between the Claimant's photographs and the lack of any windscreen PCN served, suggests that this may have been an untrained and unauthorised 'self-ticketer' taking predatory photos for a 'bounty' payment - effectively an incentivised lurker.

3.(i) ANPR cameras were not used, and yet no windscreen PCN was placed by the person taking the images and no time was allowed for the driver to have had a fair opportunity to seek out any hidden/high signs and read the small print terms,

3.(ii) Euro Parking Services Ltd are put to strict proof regarding whether or not an employee took these photos, when and how that person was trained and the site duly audited, and to explain why no windscreen PCN was issued, nor grace period allowed for the driver to read the signs, despite the photographer evidently standing near the car during the few minutes snatched to create the incriminating appearance of a contravention.

4.The Driver did not see the terms, therefore cannot be bound by them and the authorities for this are (a) Vine v Waltham Forest [2000] EWCA, in which Miss Vine prevailed due to unclear signs hidden behind vans and the fact she did not see them - the judgment from Roch LJ being quite different from the general presumption that the Claimant is likely to invite the Court to make - and (b) ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67 (the Beavis case) described non-prominent signs and unclear terms as creating a 'concealed pitfall or trap' and further confirmed that a non-landowner parking firm could not have pursued a sum pleaded in damages, or for trespass, which remains solely in the gift of a landowner.

5. In addition to the above breaches, the Defendant denies that the signs at the location were in compliance with the IPC CoP and believes they were sparsely placed low on walls and could be obscured from view by other vehicles. See Photographic Evidence PR Folder 2

5. (i) Following the date of the issued PCN there are several more signs that have been affixed to the walls as can be compared from the photographs from the material date, and at present

5.(ii). Additionally, the floor markings have since been repainted and the colour of the No parking Zone has been changed from White to Red and Yellow, as evidenced again the comparative photographs-see Evidence PR Folder 2

I believe the facts stated in this witness statement are true.

dk007

Hi there,

I have a similar case as you and was wondering if hearing for your case has taken place and what was the outcome, what was the main point court decided it to be in your favor and what evidences you had to attach.

Thanks