PCN Lidl Grantham

Jay64

So I’ve read the newbie thread and I’ve taken parts of it but I don’t think it fully answers my situation...

I got a hire car with work and stopped in Grantham on 31 Jan, I stayed for 2 hours 20 mins (time limit is 1 hour 30, I didn’t realise they even had one!)

The PCN got sent to the hire company (Thrifty), they received it on 2 Feb.

Thrifty then sent it to ‘Phoenix Babcock’, they are the company that we use to manage our contracts. Phoenix PAID this £45 PCN.

Phoenix then sent it to my work (with a £30 admin charge) and my work head office paid it (£75 in total).

I got an email on Monday (so 39 days after the offence) stating that I now ‘owe’ £75, I went to HR this morning and said that I wanted to appeal it as Phoenix paid it and accepted liability. I was tol that they only do that so that the PCN doesn’t go up to £90, I followed this up with I would have appealed to Anthea about the PCN. They’ve suggested I pay them (as in my work) then appeal... sounds like rubbish to me, any ideas?

Coupon-mad

Anthea? Do you mean 'Athena' at Lidl?

Now that the idiots have paid it, this is too late to appeal. But:

Check your contract, as it is doubtful the company had the right to pay a 'parking charge' (civil matter). This was never a fine, but lease/company car firms don't know the difference and just pay them if they can get away with it.

Have a look at your contract and don't tell us ''it's OK as it does say they can pay fines''.

It's not a fine, or a penalty, and you could have had it cancelled merely by emailing the CEO of Lidl if you were shopping there an could have proved it. We help people to get these cancelled all the time, with one email to the right person.

You could try. Search the forum for any LIDL thread and use the email shown.

beamerguy

By doing this your company has taken away your legal right to appeal .......

From Thrifty to Phoenix Babcock and then to your company and HR, THEIR LACK OF KNOWLEDGE beggars belief

Out of interest, are this lot involved in any way with Brexit

Umkomaas

Athena will have no interest in your appeal. You have no prospect of achieving any kind of refund - they have been fed.

Your attention should turn to the contract you have with the hire company and what that says. If it talks about fines and penalties from authorities, then what your vehicle received was none of these. But it's not an easy point to argue, especially if the hire company have no idea about the differences.

If the hire company is a member of the BVRLA, they should have followed the protocol agreed between the BVRLA and the British Parking Association. Have a read of their Memorandum of Understanding and see what you can use from this. You have to try to turn this to prove the hire company has erred in paying this, against their trade association's advice, and as such should cover their own mistake themselves. Tall order, but one you should consider pursuing.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9b0iavad3aqeh28/BPA%20BVRLA%20MoU.pdf?dl=0

Were you a genuine customer of Lidl on the day, although how you managed to spend 2:20 in there, or were you just fly-parking?

If you have receipts for expenditure there and you are a very regular, high-spending Lidl customer, with receipts/bank/cc statements proving that regular, loyal patronage, you could try a last ditch letter to Christian Haertnagel, Lidl MD asking if he can intervene, but this is one very long shot.

christian.haertnagel@lidl.co.uk.

Once a parking charge has been paid, I'm afraid there are no silver bullets.

Jay64

Thanks for the info guys.

Yes I did shop there (albeit I also went to other shops also), I don’t shop in that Lidl regularly but I do my local one.

I have read the contract and it says the following (I’m sure this is probably standard) ‘I agree that while the rental agreement is in force I will be liable as owner/hirer of the vehicle, or any replacement vehicle, for any fixed penalty offence, penalty charge notice, notice to owner, parking charge notice for that the vehicle under *very long road act*. I hereby acknowledge my liability for all fines or charges arising from such infringements, plus an admin fee of £35 for such fine or charge.

Coupon-mad

Let us know how the complaint to Mr Haertnagel goes, attach ALL receipts/bank statements and work out how may £xxxx you spend at Lidl each year.

Tell him Lidl will now lose your custom unless Athena refunds the £45 and Lidl considers compensation for your £35 loss, too. say how upset and ripped off you feel, go to town on it (no templates, no using Resolver!).

The_Deep

Athena will have no interest in your appeal. You have no prospect of achieving any kind of refund - they have been fed.

I think that a judge might take a different view. Send the scammer a free LBA

https://www.rocketlawyer.co.uk/documents-and-forms/letter-before-action.rlm?msclkid=1b2cb42663de17dd96f1e8af71cb9d8b&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=BSN%20-%20Letter%20before%20action&utm_term=free%20letter%20before%20action&utm_content=Exact%20-%20Letter%20before%20action

and tell your employer that they have interfered in a matter in which they had no concern, the PCN was almost certainly a scam. If they are unhelpful, complain to your MP.

This is an entirely unregulated industry which is scamming the public with inflated claims for minor breaches of alleged contracts for alleged parking offences, aided and abetted by a handful of low-rent solicitors. Is has been suggested by an MP that some of these companies may have connections to organised crime.

Parking Eye, CPM, Smart, (especially Smart}, and others have already been named and shamed in the House of Commons as have Gladstones Solicitors, and BW Legal, (these two law firms take hundreds of these cases to court each week), hospital car parks and residential complex tickets have been especially mentioned. They lose most of them, and have been reported to the regulatory authority by an M.P. for unprofessional conduct

The problem become so widespread that MPs agreed to enact a Bill to regulate these scammers. It has cleared Parliament and hopefully, this will become law shortly.

Jay64

So bit of an update.

I spoke to the head of the Vehicle Fleet this afternoon (HR have decided it’s their problem). He rang a couple of people and has actually found out our company hasn’t paid it and neither have thrifty. The only company to pay it was Phoenix (the guys that manage our contractors) so they have raised an invoice to our company (which obviously they want me to pay).

My company have said if I want to appeal paying it I need to give Phoenix as to why I don’t want to pay...

Any help with this? I guess I’m not really appealing paying the actual Parking Notice, more so why I’m not paying them?

The_Deep

My company have said if I want to appeal paying it I need to give Phoenix as to why I don’t want to pay...

Because it is a scam. because their signs were probably unlawful, because they probably did not have a valid contract. Because their paperwork may have been unlawful. Because it was probably a penalty. Because it was not a genuine pre- estimate of the scamme's loss. Because it was probably an unfair term in a consumer contract. Because right of appeal has been denied. Because it was not in anyone's best interest to pay it. Is that enough?

Coupon-mad

My company have said if I want to appeal paying it I need to give Phoenix as to why I don’t want to pay...

No. Do as advised already.

Jay64

Will do my reply this evening and upload before sending it for you guys to be ruthless on. No one has a clue what’s going on in the country anymore :rotfl: