ATM fraud - currency card institution playing funny !!!!!!s

eDicky

Lizmontague wrote: »

a holiday currency card company.

Which one? Using such a prepaid card is a mistake, usually more expensive than just using your regular bank debit card and without support in case of problems.

You were scammed and should have reported to the Thai Tourist Police to get a crime report which would help your case on return home, try to do that if still possible.

18cc

The first step is to complain to the card company. Do it in a letter, and make sure you say you are making a complaint. They have 8 weeks to reply. If there is deadlock, you will get a deadlock letter and can then complain to the FOS. You can also complain to the FOS after 8 weeks if they don't reply.

Keep the complaint simple - your card was retained by a compromised cashpoint machine and your money was stolen. You were in no way negligent. You are asking for a refund.

chattychappy

Terry_Towelling wrote: »

Yes, it may be that they still don't have to reimburse you if they have reasonable evidence to believe you were negligent, complicit or are lying but the chargeback position has nothing to do with it.

The regulatory position is better for CCs than for other cards. It is set out in the CCA1974 that you can't be liable for negligence (except £50), for example.

Unfortunately "backpacker fraud" is very common and I have seen it myself. Young people travel around the world - sometimes intending to earn money from working. They go over budget, get money stolen, bail out friends etc. Blokes pick up bar girls. Eventually then they have the idea to do some kind of fraud - steal off mates, leave hotels without paying the bill, dispute transactions which they have conducted/other people have done in cahoots.

Of course this is only a minority... but it's significant.

In the days fo Traveller's Cheques, certain areas of Thailand were on a blacklist. If you reported them lost from these locations, they wouldn't replace them until you returned to the UK. They would, perhaps, advance you a small amount of emergency cash and that was that. In most cases, the travellers never pursued the claim.

Perhaps that's why the issuer is giving the OP a hard time.

Terry_Towelling

chattychappy wrote: »

The regulatory position is better for CCs than for other cards. It is set out in the CCA1974 that you can't be liable for negligence (except £50), for example.

In the days fo Traveller's Cheques, certain areas of Thailand were on a blacklist.

Perhaps that's why the issuer is giving the OP a hard time.

Perhaps the issue of 'liability for negligence' is 'circumnavigated' by card issuers by the T&Cs of the CC agreement wherein it (probably) states you must take reasonable precautions to safeguard your PIN etc. If the issuer believed the cardholder didn't take such precautions (seemingly not the case here) the issuer might be able to side-step liability by claiming a breach of T&Cs. Whether that is just semantics and wouldn't wash in a court of law I cannot say but that may be the angle here.

No matter how much we would like our card companies to take us at face value, first-party fraud is an issue and we should probably expect to be given a hard time where our cards are used with our PINs. It's then a matter of how hard we are prepared to fight our corner.

On the subject of fraud-prone countries, I started working in cards in 1985 and of the countries reputed to cause a higher proportion of fraud/disputes, Thailand was most definitely fighting for a place on the podium.

Lizmontague

Does anyone think they might be hiding behind the BS excuse that I can't get a refund as per 'chargeback rules' because of the maladministration of their staff? They don't want to actually refund me because they've got no recourse if Visa and/or their insurers find out how they did not investigate when alerted months ago?

eDicky

Please explain clearly what steps you have recently taken according to the advice give here, and any response received. And, once again, what card is it?

andygb

CakeCrusader wrote: »

And never use a cash point, always go into a bank to withdraw funds.

Even this is not a 100% secure way to withdraw money or change up sterling. Around 10 years ago we were in Turin and wanted to change some sterling into Euros - around £100 - and the first main bank we went into attempted to give us 75 Euros when the exchange rate was around E1.35 to £1. It took ages to get the cashier to give my money back:eek:
We then went to another bank in the same road, and they used the correct exchange rate.
I think the OP has been extremely unlucky here, it could happen to anyone.

adindas

andygb wrote: »

Even this is not a 100% secure way to withdraw money or change up sterling. Around 10 years ago we were in Turin and wanted to change some sterling into Euros - around £100 - and the first main bank we went into attempted to give us 75 Euros when the exchange rate was around E1.35 to £1. It took ages to get the cashier to give my money back:eek:
We then went to another bank in the same road, and they used the correct exchange rate.
I think the OP has been extremely unlucky here, it could happen to anyone.

Well I think this is entirely a different case with OP case.
The case like you mention could happen to any bank, shops even in the UK. The same thing people could lose their cash everywhere if they are not cautious.

It might be genuine human error. It is highly unlikely happen in the banks but could still happen where human are pretending making a stupid mistake, especially in the shops where they give change. The only thing to prevent this to happen is by counting it in front of them.

fewcloudy

it never rains but it pours... any other credit card woes looming?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5977229/credit-card-company-cancelled-my-card-whilst-on-holiday

xmarksthespot

@Lizmontague - I'm surprised you travelled with a single card on this latest occasion, especially since you also posted today that in 2017 you travelled with a single card and had problems back then, which - like this latest incident - left you without access to funds.

I empathise with the potential instances of fraud, but customers also have a responsibility to limit financial risk when they travel.

I think others have given you a similar message about being better prepared (e.g. with a couple of cards) which I hope you'll consider on your next overseas adventure.